Auger bits, which to buy

[Mike Holbrook]

I have good braces and want a set of auger bits to use in them. I am following auctions but it is hard to tell from the pictures provided what kind of shape the bits are in. I have found sets of these bits for sale at Tools for Working Wood, Traditional Tools andHighland Woodworking. Highland has what appears to be a traditional 13 piece set 1/4- 1" but they want $150 for the set. I found several threads on the subject of restoring old bits. It sounds like it is fairly common for bits to have their cutters filled away making the bit useless for the original job it was designed for. Some apparently make these bits into other types of bits or tools. The descriptions on some the new bits I find for sale fail to clarify whether they are designed for soft or hard wood.

More people seemed to like the Russel Jennings sets than the Irwin sets. Many felt the RJ's work better in hard wood, but I found one poster who believed the common information about the RJ's vs the Irwins were wrong. The one poster felt the Irwins were better in hardwood.

Any suggestions on my best options and an idea of what a good used set might cost would be appreciated. I do see that Highland hardware has a auger file for sale so I know I can sharpen an older set if I can find a decent set.

[David Weaver]

Antique jennings bits with fine pitch. They might cost you $100 if they are low use, complete and in box, but they are the ones to have if you're going to be working with hardwoods.

I can't remember which jennings bits are the fine pitch, they're numbered 100 or 101 or something. Maybe someone will chime in.

The irwin bits you'll find in droves have a coarser screw, but are good bits, too, and some of the smaller sizes have bigger diameter lead screws than the jennings, probably to make up for the coarser pitch. They work quickly in softwoods but can be really rough to use in hard dry hardwoods, especially if you're drilling parallel to the growth rings (like on quartersawn hardwood).

[Joel Goodman]

I would get Jennings if you work with hardwoods. I am not a big Ebay fan so I bought a set from Sandy Moss (sydnassloot.com), and some more from Walt (Brass City). I would check their sites as well as Patrick Leach. If they need a touch up it's pretty easy. A least with those three dealers the bits will be as advertised and if they say the screws are good they will be. I would not get any of the new auger bits -- the cheaper ones are cheap and anything good will be way more than a primo used set. I often see bits that are in really good condition on those sites. Dave is in the ballpark with $100 for a set -- maybe a bit more for a good set in the box from a good dealer.

[Jessica Pierce-LaRose]

Also think about what size big holes do you really need to drill? I mean, I find myself using my braces more for driving screws and bolts than anything else.

I find weird size bits are nice sometimes for roughing out a handle or pierced piece to cut down on the sawing I do, but in general work, I find the bits I use the most are the 1/4" and 3/8" for pegging things and starting a mortise (I like to drill one hole before I start chopping) and the 3/4" for dog holes on the bench. I mean, when I need them, I'm glad I have all the weird sizes, but I know out of 13 bits, there are probably more than a couple I haven't used. The other thing I drill a lot of holes for are odd sized metric holes for guitar hardware, so I end up going with brad point bits on those anyway.

If you look at the other threads you can find here by searching, (I think some are archived in the Wisdom/FAQs sticky, but it sounds like you found a lot of them already) you'll find discussion of what to look for - haunt enough flea markets and thrift stores and eventually you'll start stumbilng across them. Grab the ones that look good and play around with them. Even you go the eBay route, sometimes it's nice to get started with a few bits and not drop a large chunk of change all at once. (Although I'm probably more sensitive to money right now than a lot of folks) See whether you like Irwin or Jennings better. Maybe you decide a hand brace just isn't for you for the tasks that auger bits are good for - that's okay too. Maybe you realize you want a bigger sweep brace or a smaller one. And if you grab a couple bits and then later pick up a set, I can guarantee you probably won't find yourself wishing you *didn't* have that extra 1/4" bit.

[Mike Holbrook]

I guess what threw me was the post by the one poster who was adamant that the common thought about hardwood auger bits is based more on bad information than practical use. I seem to read that most actually prefer the R-J bits for actual use. I did read that the pre WWII bits are better than the more recent ones and the very old bits are often inferior steel. I imagine some of it has to do with the period the bits were made in and whether or not the twists were made to better accommodate hardwood.

I have restored two 10", two 8", one 12" and one 6" brace so I am well set fro most brace situations. I also have a great collection of old hand drills. I have a good selection of bit adapters that allow me to use the more modern hex/quick change bits, screw driver sets, nut drivers...with most of my braces & drills. I need to bore 3/4" holes for dogs and holdfasts in a bench or two and sawbenches and I am thinking about using drawbores on sawbench joints to try them out.

[Ben Beckham]

I have both the Irwin and Jennings bits. I consistently reach for my Irwins. I just drilled a 1" hole in 4/4 QSWO yesterday with an Irwin and 12" throw brace and it didn't leave me wanting anything else. The Jennings will get their threads clogged in softwood, so I say the Irwins are the better all-around bit.

For the Irwins, I paid $20 for a set of I think 10 and paid probably $40 to a guy I trust here who sharpens things to get them sharp and they just rock. The Jennings were considerably more, and I don't find them any better so far.

EDIT: since you mentioned bench dog holes - I drilled the holes for my holdfasts through my 5" SYP bench legs with the Irwins and it didn't take more than 30 seconds per hole.

[Jim Koepke]

Mike,

My first bought set of bits was about $20 and came with a cabinet brace which is a handle on a chuck instead of the crank handle they usually have. Great for drilling in a corner or against a wall.

Here is my thread, A Bit About Augers.

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?131238

Hopefully this will help you to recognize the points of interest when looking at bits for purchase.

I do not get into the "good for this or these are better for that" argument. If it works, it works. If it doesn't work, it doesn't work. No argument from me. Some bits have double lead screws. The finer the pitch on the lead screw, the slower the bit will pull into the wood. This is how the thickness of the shaving is regulated. One thing to remember is that some people boring holes were not making fine furniture. They were installing plumbing or wiring and did not care about the look of the hole since it was going inside of a wall. What they cared about is fast and getting done with the job.

I tend to buy good bits whenever I come across them at a buck or less each. There is always the chance of messing up a good bit by hitting a hidden screw or nail.

Of course, my needs are different than yours and yours are different from others. I save bad bits for rough work. Sometimes I have to drill into trees, sometimes an old fence post. My best bits are spared those tasks.

jtk

[Dan Andrews]

I use my fine thread RJ s for hardwood and my Irwins for carpentry work. I want to make a point that no matter how good the lead screw and cutting edges are a rusty bit will bind up due to friction preventing the chips and curls from exiting up the spiral. It doesn't take much rust to cause the problem. I gave a few RJ s a citric acid bath to remove rust. Big mistake. the surface left was worse than rust had holding the chips. I now only buy bits with minimal if any rust film on them.

[Eric Brown]

Unfortunately the way we talk about wood is to define it two ways for both hardwood and soft. The first definition is the how the tree seeds are produced. Generally the hardwoods have nuts. The second definition is the actual hardness/softness of the wood. Many "hardwoods" are actually not that hard (poplar). Some softwoods are quite hard (southern yellow pine).

So when talking augers, the actual hardness or softness of the wood is being refered to.

With augers, typically the coarse screws (like Irwin solid center) work better on the softer (pine) and very hard woods (hard maple). The Russell Jennings #100 set, with double pitch screws (double twist), work better on the cabinet type woods that aren't extremely hard or soft.

With patience, they will all bore a hole. For hard holes, use wax or some other lube. Keep the bits clean. Polished works better.

Other less common options: Single twist bits (for deep holes)
Forstner bits for smooth holes.

On all the bits, the spurs are what determines the smoothness and size of the hole. The double spurs of the Irwins and Russell Jennings work better than the single spurs of other makes. To protect the bits, store them so they don't hit each other. Either a canvas roll or wood box with dividers works well.

One more thing, there are many other makers of the Irwin or Russell Jennings designs. The original Irwins are so plentiful and cheap though with no others made better, they would be the best choice of that style. The Russell Jennings is another matter.

A little history. Russell Jennings made excellent bits clear up to when they were sold to Stanley in 1944. After that, the steel was the same, but the finish became less polished. Sometime in the 1960's the plant was moved from Chester to New Britain Conn. and then later to Sheffield England. Some bits have also Been made in Australia.

But there have been other makers of the Jennings pattern that are quite good. Swan, C.E. Jennings, and many other come to mind. Look at the finish. Polished is better. Complete sets in a protctive case, may have been taken care of best. Avoid loose bits unless you want to start a collection.

Good luck.

Eric

[Shlomo Hoffmann]

Pretty much what Eric said, but based on my experience so far let me add a couple of points...

Pull/head screws were/are offered in 3 main different thread types - coarse, medium and fine. As far as I have seen in the field, Irwin auger bits typically have coarse and deep threads and Russell-Jennings’ are typically fine-threaded.

Soft woods, e.g. pine, spruce etc., have soft & coarse grain and lend themselves better for a coarse thread for better grip and pull. In addition, as the wood is soft, it “allows” for faster “RPM” with coarse and larger chips and a single-flute bit for clearing volume is better here. Irwin (like) bits come to mind…

As hard woods typically have much finer and denser grain, a fine threaded head screw is usually preferred for better grip and pull. Naturally, this results in lower “RPM” but with more force-gain per turn. With finer shavings, the clearance volume is realized here with a parallel/double flute. Russell-Jennings (like) bits come to mind here…

The pitch of the pull screw needs to be matched to the task. A too fine thread (R-J) in softwood might simply “shave” itself out of progress and go “free-wheeling” and cause understandable frustration (happened to me)… Similarly, a coarse thread (Irwin) in hardwood has less progression power gain and calls for much more torque force by the user, which is tiring and may result in overheating especially in deeper holes that may even break off the thread or the bit itself - frustrating no less…

[Mike Holbrook]

Thanks for all the great comments and ideas. I have not been able to locate a rehabed set of bits. I have some options I am studying on though. Jim thanks for the link, it was good to have those close up shots of the threads. I am trying to maintain a 12 acre dog park and sneak in a little wood working too. I am also a little slow & studious when searching for tools. I think I am better buying a set to start just to save a little of my precious time, if I can find what I want. The challenge being, full sets of good bits tend to be priced a little higher.

[David Weaver]

There are so many jennings and irwin complete sets sold on ebay, not at the confiscatory dreamer prices that some fixed price sellers put up, but half that...here's what I'd do (and what I do when something is sold fairly regularly).

Save a search in ebay and let it tell you when items are available. Use esnipe, not to snipe someone, but so you can put in your max price on one or several auctions that advertise a full and complete set (and have pictures to prove it) and not forget about things. It costs something like 1% of the final auction price or some such thing, and if you use it right, you should save more than it costs.

At any rate, that then allows you to spend a lot less time searching listings, and allows you to cap what you want to spend and see if over a period of a week or two, you can get a full set of bits for a reasonable price.

There are a lot of completed auctions for jennings sets that are around $60. If a seller says they're a full set and offers a return policy, you're risking only the cost of shipping. If they offer little description, then you can pass on the auction.

I think you can probably get a good set for half what a good dealer charges, and a third or less what the shyster dealers charge.

You are definitely better off buying a set, they are both cheaper that way (in general) and in terms of your time, you're talking about minutes of your time involved. If you start trying to find economical single bits, and several of them, it's hours.

The beauty of using esnipe is that you can essentially enter a bid without actually entering a bid, if that makes sense. You let esnipe bid in the last 4 second or whatever for you, and if you do that for several different auctions, as soon as you win an acceptable auction, you can go toss the remaining pending bids - they haven't been made yet, and you've had the benefit of not having to sequentially follow tons of auctions to get a decent deal....and a bid that doesn't win costs nothing, just like a bid that you enter and then cancel.

[James Owen]

I have a set of older Russel Jennings auger bits that come in the three-sectioned wooden box. Excellent bits!! Also have a couple of random-sized Irwins that I like, but I prefer the RJs.....

If you don't want to pay antique store prices and are dubious of those on the infamous auction site, then take a look at Jon Zimmers (jonzimmersantiquetools dotcom), in Portland, Oregon. Nice selection of tools (ever-changing), good quality photos, reasonable prices, and useful descriptions.


Everything that I have bought from him has been better than described, and he is a great guy to buy from -- fast service, very reasonable shipping, and an all-round a pleasure to do business with. He was one of the very first antique tool dealers on the net, and has been in the business, I believe, since the early or mid-70s. (No affiliation with him or his company; just a very satisfied repeat customer.)

As a side note, LN and a couple of other places also sell auger bit files, either Grobet or Nicholson.

[Mike Holbrook]

I won a set (4-16) of Irwins that appear to be in exceptional condition. They are in a functional wooden box with slide out second compartment. I have immediate work for these bits and did not want to put off the work while I searched for bits. I got the set for 1/3- 1/2 of what I would have paid for a new or refurbished, sharpened set. I was interested in the box as a way to keep the bits in good condition without having to build something.

I have some work to do that is more construction grade woods so I went with what I thought might be the better option for the wider range of materials. I am still following auctions for R&J bits and may buy a set of them too, if I find a good deal. Now I can take my time locating specific R&J bits in great condition.

[Mike Holbrook]

So I have my new/old bits, they look almost new and the box although worn still performs well, especially considering the flimsy old hinges and tiny nails holding it together. Clicking twice on the pictures in my Flicker account doubles the size of the pictures twice and places a black background behind them giving one a good close look at the condition of the bits and the twist in their lead screws.

I like the box almost as much as the bits. Any suggestions on restoring/rebuilding this great old wooden bit box?

http://www.flickr.com/photos/16891057@N05/