I don't get it--------????????

[Gary Max]

"OMG look who's on the front page of ___ ____ ___ ___ turning site"
I see this post here all the time and just don't get it. Most of the time the piece has already been shown here at SMC, why tell me to look at it again on another site.
What's the point?????????

[Roger Chandler]

Gary,

It is about recognizing the work and excellence of another turner who has had their work recognized..........we celebrate with them................

Romans 12:15 (KJV)
15 Rejoice with them that do rejoice, and weep with them that weep.

[Wally Dickerman]

I guess it depends on who you are...I've had the front cover of WoW a couple of times in the past few months and nobody on SMC said a word. Am I feeling left out?...Naw

[Scott Hackler]

I will assume that the latest thread Dick Wilson started congratulating me on the WoW cover was the tipping point for you Gary, so I might add my views on the subject.

Sawmill Creek is a great place for us turners to "hang out" and learn from each other. It, to me, is also a "proving ground" for designs and techniques. I am a member of all the major forums on the net and Sawmill Creek is easily the most active for discussions and the previous mentioned things. We, mostly, are an extended family here and I had made some great friends because of my activity on Sawmill Creek.

WoW is a different kind of site, in the sense that there is a lot less active participation (conversation wise) and a whole lot more emphasis on a showcase for turnings. WoW is also a monster collection of some of the worlds greatest and most respected wood turners. Many of which (although they might be a member here) do not participate on Sawmill Creek or other sites, but actively submit their work onto WoW. Consequently when the select few, who are assigned to do so, select your photo/turning to be on the cover for the day.... well its quite an honor. The work displayed on WoW, a lot of the times, is from the masters of our craft and the only place to see their work is either on WoW, their gallery, a private gallery or in person. The choice of the cover photo selection is a selection over (if just barely) the most recent work submitted. Getting selected for the cover photo is an honor and something to boast about or at least something to say thank you when someone else brings the selection to peoples attention. Not everyone here goes to other sites on a regular basis or at any time.

Other sites such as AAW has the cover for the week photo and yet another site...Woodturners America just completed a massive contest where several Sawmill Creek members won prizes. All of which have likely been mentioned here, again, after the fact.

It's all about recognizing the awards and honors awarded to each other (just an electronic pat on the back) and to give others something to strive for. Not to just get a "cover photo" but to be recognized by our fellow master turners.

I see it as a choice to either participate in a particular thread or just ignore it. For example, some thread asking about how to do something on a Jet lathe will not receive comments from me because it is of no interest to me and I have nothing to add. I would not want the thread deleted because of that OR the fact that if a search is done, the topic has likely been covered 10 times before.... here.....

BTW, Wally I missed your last cover shot and apologize for not bringing it to light here. You are a big part of the SawMill Creek family and should have been recognized.

On a related note... Richard Kennedy just made the turner of the week for the AAW site. Congrats Richard. That bowl is awesome.

[David E Keller]

Scott pretty well summed it up. I don't always respond, but it's fun to see who's being recognized for their turning. Likewise, threads about sales and gallery acceptance are interesting to me... I enjoy seeing when my friends from SMC and elsewhere are strutting their stuff.

[Peter Elliott]

Gary, the point is you have a choice to keep moving along and not read the thread.... if it strikes a nerve. Great thing about a mouse/keyboard..

WoW is filled with all sorts of great stuff but it's an EYE SORE to read... I could use more descriptive words but no point to that.

There is too much negativity out in the world and any chance you get to read/see a fellow woodworker recognized, is just a good thing!

[Dick Wilson]

Gary, I agree with Scott. I was only posting to recognize Scott for his work. Indeed getting the cover of WOW is quite an accomplishment. I have received it once, some seem to get the cover every time they post a pic. To me it is sort of bragging rights to post a pic of my latest work. I pay close attention to the comments. Sometimes ya get some very good comments that really help your advancement. If anyone from SMC gets an award, cover, wins a contest etc. I think it is worth mentioning to the SMC community.

PS - Wally, do not feel left out. Somehow it appears that it got buy everyone:eek:. Belated congrats on your cover day.:)

[Roger Chandler]

I guess it depends on who you are...I've had the front cover of WoW a couple of times in the past few months and nobody on SMC said a word. Am I feeling left out?...Naw

Wally,

I missed yours...........I would have congratulated you..............sorry! Congratulations, even if it is belatedly........it is still sincere! :)

[Derek Gilmer]

As a new turner who hasn't made it over to WoW yet the threads about someone getting the cover or other award is nice. I'm still in the learning phase of curves that look good and those that don't.

There are two sides to that. I could turn something that I love and thing is the best thing ever made by man's little hands. But the rest of the world looks like it was beaten to death three times with the ugly stick. I'll still like that turning because it makes me happy.

The other side is finding out what appeals to experience turners/art critics. I'd like some day to be able to sell pieces and have a hobby that partially funds itself. With out a good understanding of what appeals to others that won't happen.

To the second point knowing the turners here at SMC that won awards is a huge help. If I saw something made by John, Steve, Wally, Bernie, Scott or many others here I'd be completely comfortable asking for info about how it was made, why it was styled this way etc. Primarily because as Scott said SMC is more a family than a forum in my experience.

All that is in addition to the fact that when a family member gets an award we all celebrate it. Which fits with SMC perfectly.

[John Keeton]

Since my self imposed hiatus from other forums, I do not frequent WoW and it is nice to see when one of our own makes the cover. Wally, for that reason, I was not aware of your honors - my apologies!!

[Mike Cruz]

Gary, eeeeeeaaaaaaassssseeee up. Take a chill pill. Relax. Go to your happy place. Do whatever you need to do to do. But recognition for people that we know and care for is a sign of appreciation. IF (and that is a BIG if) I ever make to the cover of a magazine (and it doesn't involve handcuffs, sirens, and men in Blue), I can only hope that those who I consider friends will lift me up and praise me...not shoot me down for success. Every time I read one of "those" posts, I see it as a friend or aquaintance that is proud of whoever is being highlighted. This is a family of sorts, and sticking together is, well, what we do... There are other families out there to "chose"...if you don't like one that praises its members. :rolleyes:

[Wally Dickerman]

Hey folks, I guess it looked like I was complaining....Really, I wasn't. Anyhow, thanks for all the congrats.

When you see the quality of the work that's posted daily on WoW, some of it by some of the world's finest turners, it's a big deal to make the cover. I'm always humbled when I do.

If you aren't a member of WoW you're missing something. There are many thousands of photos in albums, all available to see. I have over a hundred pieces in my album and it's small compared to some.

[Richard Kennedy UK]

I will assume that the latest thread Dick Wilson started congratulating me on the WoW cover was the tipping point for you Gary, so I might add my views on the subject.

Sawmill Creek is a great place for us turners to "hang out" and learn from each other. It, to me, is also a "proving ground" for designs and techniques. I am a member of all the major forums on the net and Sawmill Creek is easily the most active for discussions and the previous mentioned things. We, mostly, are an extended family here and I had made some great friends because of my activity on Sawmill Creek.

WoW is a different kind of site, in the sense that there is a lot less active participation (conversation wise) and a whole lot more emphasis on a showcase for turnings. WoW is also a monster collection of some of the worlds greatest and most respected wood turners. Many of which (although they might be a member here) do not participate on Sawmill Creek or other sites, but actively submit their work onto WoW. Consequently when the select few, who are assigned to do so, select your photo/turning to be on the cover for the day.... well its quite an honor. The work displayed on WoW, a lot of the times, is from the masters of our craft and the only place to see their work is either on WoW, their gallery, a private gallery or in person. The choice of the cover photo selection is a selection over (if just barely) the most recent work submitted. Getting selected for the cover photo is an honor and something to boast about or at least something to say thank you when someone else brings the selection to peoples attention. Not everyone here goes to other sites on a regular basis or at any time.

Other sites such as AAW has the cover for the week photo and yet another site...Woodturners America just completed a massive contest where several Sawmill Creek members won prizes. All of which have likely been mentioned here, again, after the fact.

It's all about recognizing the awards and honors awarded to each other (just an electronic pat on the back) and to give others something to strive for. Not to just get a "cover photo" but to be recognized by our fellow master turners.

I see it as a choice to either participate in a particular thread or just ignore it. For example, some thread asking about how to do something on a Jet lathe will not receive comments from me because it is of no interest to me and I have nothing to add. I would not want the thread deleted because of that OR the fact that if a search is done, the topic has likely been covered 10 times before.... here.....

BTW, Wally I missed your last cover shot and apologize for not bringing it to light here. You are a big part of the SawMill Creek family and should have been recognized.

On a related note... Richard Kennedy just made the turner of the week for the AAW site. Congrats Richard. That bowl is awesome.

Thanks Scott it is a real surprise and a great honour to have been picked. I love the woodturning forums I love seeing new work from everyone as it gives me ideas for my own work and very often leaves me speechless with "howdedodat" syndrome! I find the criticism good or bad fantastic in keeping my feet firmly planted to the ground or on occasion give me a great boost of motivation. I work for several months of the year in a remote corner of the world where there are very few woodturners. The feedback I get from sites like this is invaluable in me getting opinion from folk who do what I do and in lots of cases do it better! It has helped me and continues to help me to develop ideas and styles. In many respects getting negative constructive criticism is great as it it helps to point me in a better direction. The sites that have a photo of the day or week are the cherry on the cake when you create something special! everyone likes a pat on the back and recognition from fellow turners when your photo gets a POD or POW is a lovely feeling! I post my photos in several forums because I use the forums and I guess if no one posted anything they would be pretty dull places. Also different people use different sites so multiposting exposes work to as wider audience as possible and so will receive as wide a range of comments as possible which I have found a great way to learn about new techniques and help to avoid spending time on stupid ideas that wont work.

[Steve Schlumpf]

Gary - you bring up a very valid point! Why would we want to send our members to another site to see that site recognize a Creeker's work? Seems to me that we need to come up with something here on the Creek to honor our members and have the other sites come visit us!

[Gary Max]

Thank you Steve----I was hoping something postive would come from my post.

[Roger Chandler]

Gary - you bring up a very valid point! Why would we want to send our members to another site to see that site recognize a Creeker's work? Seems to me that we need to come up with something here on the Creek to honor our members and have the other sites come visit us!

Steve,

Your idea of something akin to a cover pic for SMC would be a great addition to this forum..........that being said.......since you are also an owner of WTA...........it seems like wanting to send our members to other sites is something that would also enhance that venture as well...........which I am all for................perhaps a cover pic for SMC and WTA...........the question then becomes ............

Who will make that decision.........for SMC would it be the mods, and on WTA would it be the owners? Seems like whatever is done, somebody will have to take the heat for whatever is chosen or not..........just thinking out loud. :)

[David DeCristoforo]

Don't even want to get i to why you should "get it". But I would like to cast another vote for some sort of "cover" here on SMC. It would add a nice element to an already great site.

[Steve Schlumpf]

Roger, first off, this is not my idea. Pete Jordan mentioned something about doing this quite a while back and while I thought it would be a good thing for the Creek, the timing or something was not right.

On the idea of sending folks to other sites... the ideal is to have people want to come visit your site - whichever site that is. WTA does not offer a turning of the day or week as far as recognition... so that site does not come into play at this time. The Creek - being the largest woodworking site there is - should be able to recognize those individuals whose efforts warrant being heralded. As far as who should select those members for that recognition... that is worth discussing. Just because I am a mod does not mean that I have the insight as to whose work deserves an honor. Seems to me that there could be a committee.. or a small group that were elected to such a post for a given period of time. I would put a limit on it as these things tend to wear folks out.

The major thing at this point is that Admin would not only have to approve of such a venture - they would have to wright something in the software to allow posting of a photo in the first place.

These are just thoughts at this point...

[Ron Radliff]

Pardon my ignorance, but what is WoW? I've Googled it but don't seem to get anywhere.

[Steve Schlumpf]

World of Woodturners. PM sent

[Joe Watson]

The major thing at this point is that Admin would not only have to approve of such a venture - they would have to wright something in the software to allow posting of a photo in the first place.
The software end of it would not be hard at all, but like you said, its a wood working site, not just turning - flat work would "have" to get in on this, instruments, hand carvers, etc...
Just a thought if it has not been suggested before...
Do the vote thing, committee, what ever... and when the choice is made, create a 'Sticky' in this forum section for the honored piece (then un-sticky it for the next piece and maybe have a sub-forum (if 'Keith' allows this) as a 'read only' archive of all chosen pieces) and if possible, see if the Admin will give the turning section of the site a 'content block' on the main page of the site (its a "123" thing to do) which will display it as well.
Just an idea if it has not been brought up before.

_

[Gary Max]

I am guessing that the vBulletin has the software already----- you would just reformat the cover page for the turners forum not the front page for SMC. Don't make it a daily thing but at the same time keep it moving as pics are posted.

[Bob Rotche]

I agree with much of what has already been said but wanted to add my 2 cents- SMC is an incredibly friendly and welcoming place which is one reason why it is so popular. That is, however, a strength but also a weakness. I truly believe in the value of constructive criticism. We all want to be very supportive of each other but a mutual admiration society doesn't do much to make us better turners. I would love to see a cover photo chosen for its excellent craftsmanship or artistic creativity with a brief analysis by whichever "expert" had the privilege of choosing. This can be very educational. I have suggested a feature over at WTA where people might voluntarily submit a piece for analysis first by the resident artists and then opened up to the general membership for comment. Unfortunately, the idea never gained any traction and that site is rapidly becoming fairly dormant which is a shame as the format has huge potential and they really had momentum after the beauty and the beast contest. The great thing about WoW is the caliber of work and assessment by some of the best turners in the world. I have had the honor of the cover once but I would only post there if I was particularly proud of a piece. Great place to view some incredible work but nothing close to the commoraderie found here. I guess there is a place for different sites with different "personalities". I would just love to see them all be the best that they can be.

[John Keeton]

As an update, Steve has posted a thread in the moderator forum for comment and input on this idea. There are many considerations as have been mentioned, and hopefully, we can develop a workable plan. The breadth of the SMC community does complicate the idea somewhat. The other two sites - WoW and WTA are both woodturning only. However, we remain hopeful a plan can be developed. Keep posting your ideas and suggestions here!! Thanks!

[Steve Vaughan]

The software end of it would not be hard at all, but like you said, its a wood working site, not just turning - flat work would "have" to get in on this, instruments, hand carvers, etc..._

Been reading through the posts. I'm here way more than WOW because of all the knowledge shared, but I do like the idea of having a cover picture here. If there were a question about the other forums on SMC getting in on it, seems like they could decide themselves. Wouldn't a cover picture be possible on each of the forums, and couldn't that be a decision those forums make for themselves? Heck, start a cover pic here and let them see if it 'works' here. They might want to do the same thing, which wouldn't be a bad idea either.

[John Keeton]

Steve, part of the considerations is that SMC has one Home Page. Each forum does not have a separate "Home Page" so a cover pic for each forum would need to share the same home page - at least at this point.

I am not a guru on software, and certainly not on VBulletin, but we have that expertise with Aaron so let's see what the possibilities are.

Ideas and suggestions on the logistics of how the "cover pic" would be chosen, etc. would be helpful, too.

[John Coloccia]

One thing about SMC I like is general lack of a caste system. I think if you start officially honoring members you will quickly change the atmosphere and create an SMC upper class. Seems like a big price to pay just so somebody doesn't have to skip over threads they don't want to read. As a general rule, I don't think SMC should be telling it's members who's work is to be admired. Leave that to the members, and let them stick it in a thread like they already do. Just my opinion.

[Derek Gilmer]

Steve, part of the considerations is that SMC has one Home Page. Each forum does not have a separate "Home Page" so a cover pic for each forum would need to share the same home page - at least at this point.

I am not a guru on software, and certainly not on VBulletin, but we have that expertise with Aaron so let's see what the possibilities are.

Ideas and suggestions on the logistics of how the "cover pic" would be chosen, etc. would be helpful, too.

Maybe one of the moderators could add the selected piece to a blog post? That way we can all know where to go look for the latest and past winners. Once a week go look at John's (for example) blog and see who won. Or maybe make up a new account that moderators can post to in blogs. Something like Tuner Award instead of John Keeton.

From a new turner point of view a short write up about what made the piece a winner would be great to. Since you guys have sooo much free time already :)

[Michelle Rich]

Having made Picture of the Day at WOW is a HONOR ..a huge one! Competing with the best in the world , it really says, one has arrived in the turning world. I have made it three times and it is a happy & wonderful thing to be honored with the best.

[Betty Fox]

I like this site just the way it is; laid back and relaxed.
*just my two quid*

[Peter Elliott]

I like it the way it is... When you post a thread here and reference a photo (even if it's on a cover of XXXX), you are going to get more dialog either good/bad. Further, you will have people ask questions, etc about the actual piece, how it was made, techniques, etc. This is why this turners forum does so well. If your bothered by that, then skip the thread. Why bring up an argument about ones piece being showcased? :cool: To me, that is the root of this thread. The old saying goes "if you don't like what you see, MOVE ON!"

[Paul Heely]

I think SMC and WoW are two different animals, and I like them both the way they are. SMC, to me, is more of a social site for sharing my work, asking questions and general camaraderie. WoW is for tough love critiques of work and to compete with some of the best turners for cover photo honors.

[Greg Bender]

Steve,
if you could send me the PM related to access'ing the WoW site.I googled it and ended up on what is the non member side of it with no link to sign up or to access the galleries that Wally refered to.
Thanx,Greg

[Dan Hintz]

Hey, if any of my work ever gets picked for a WoW cover, I'll be the one touting it... I'm too impatient to let others do it for me :D

[Alan Trout]

I have had a few cover photos on WOW and it to me is a great honor. I see WOW as more of a critique site and really enjoy the critique aspect of it. I like SMC for what it is. It is where I started and a very nice social place that provides good valuable information on many different skill levels as well as a source of encouragement. I don't see a need to make it something that it is not, as it is fine the way it is. Of course this is just my humble opinion.

I also don't mind someone giving a "congratulations for your WOW cover" on this site. It is a big internet with plenty of room for other forums.

Alan

[Roger Chandler]

My honest opinion about a cover photo for SMC is this............I like the general good atmosphere here at SMC..........I actually do not think a cover photo is necessary............but if one is developed it won't upset me at all. I don't mind when congratulations are given one of our creekers for their work.........it think it is a great recognition and builds confidence in the turners who see that they can rise to accomplish work that is appreciated by the turning community.

I would not like to see this forum develop into what the WOW site is..........although I do appreciate being able to post a pic there and get critiques when I desire........................that being said, I like the "how to" and "how do I...." aspect to this forum, and the fact that experienced turners [and some real artisans, at that] come on here and help those who are struggling and encourage everyone else in the development of their skills.

I like the pics that show what others are doing............most of all I like the fellowship we have here................the light-hearted banter, and even the self deprecating humor, exhibited at times by many of us........

Lets never lose the good I have spoken of.........if we really need to add a cover photo......well I just hope we will not let it become a contest of " I am better than you, because I got a pic on the cover" .........we are and should remain better than that!

[Paul Singer]

I am fairly new to turning. I have posted a couple of my early efforts and received very nice comments were as on WOW I would have never posted. This site has a very nice neighborhood atmosphere and I have no doubt that no matter what is posted the comments will be respectful and helpful. Maybe it is just me but I do not feel as comfortable on some of these other forums. Please keep the general feel as great as it is today. I am a member of alot of these forums but only visit once in a while whereas I am on SMC a few times every day.

This is my go to Forum.

[Dick Wilson]

:(:( It would appear that I innocently started something.:(:( My apologies to Gary and all others. That obviously, was not my intent. I have seen numerous posts in the past of Creekers posting congrats when a fellow Creeker got the cover of WOW (including myself), AND other awards/recognition at other events or forums.

I belong to WOW, SME, WTA, WoodCentral and and Woodworkers Institute UK. All are great sites for different reasons. WOW being a "sponsored to join" forum is more formal. SMC is totally different: much more discussion, much more helpful with turning problems and, in my humble opinion, a lot of great turners willing to take their time to help turners advance their skills. This takes nothing away from the other forums. This place is just plain homier.


As far as posting "cover pics" on this forum, I tend to think it would be better to leave it like it is. We do not have to copy another forum to make this forum "better". It is already great. Just my one penny:D

[Scott Hackler]

I'm also in the camp of "no cover photo needed" for SMC. WoW fulfills a need, but it isn't the same as the everyday mix of SMC. Like before, this place is home for a lot of us turners and the easy going attitude and range of newbie to master and everyone in between is a nice mix. It's almost like SMC is my first turning club and we meet everyday....sometimes 5-10 times!

And although we have some heated discussions from now and then (see tool comparisons), the other 99% of the time it's a great place to "hang out". This site is my first "go to" every time I sit down with the computer.

[Mike Cruz]

I'm not really big on the idea of a cover photo either. However, if there is going to be one, I think it should showcase an array of turners, from the beginner to the experienced. Sometimes first turnings are as exciting as works of art. Sometimes they are one in the same. Sometimes, first turnings are, well, crude, simple and unrefined. But they are what the members here are doing. And therefore, ought to be included...IF a cover is in our future.

[Gary Max]

This brings me back to the question----if you folks don't like cover pics why tell the menbership here to go to _____ ______ ______ ______ and look at the cover pic. I really don't get it?????????
To the folks who have sent me PM's-------- you all really should be posting here on this tread.

[Scott Hackler]

Really????

It's not "don't like cover pics" it's more don't want SMC to become WoW, so do we really need to mimic them. They are two totally different venues.

I would also like to add that on WoW, Woodturners America, SMC and the AAW site.... they ALL reference other sites...regularly. It's all about congratulating others when they are recognized by their peers and by the masters of our craft. If those kinds of threads don't appeal to you, it's really up to you not to click on them.

I am sorry that you don’t share the same type of admiration for the accomplishments of your fellow creekers. :

[Gary Max]

Scott I don't know if I should laugh at your post or just shake my head at your responce, so I will just walk away from this thread. It really has nothing to do with accomplishments.

[Alan Trout]

Gary,

I will then pose a question. What is wrong with congratulating a person for recognition in another venue? I don't get where that would be a problem?

Alan

[Scott Hackler]

I agree, this thread is useless, mainly because there have been several good responces explaining WHY and yet you still "don't get it". I don't get that mindset and don't understand what's not to get about this topic.

If it "has nothing to do with accomplishments", then what do you think it has to do with? I get the feeling that you believe there to be another motive involved.

[Peter Elliott]

I'll say it... Gary YOU OFFENDED MANY HERE with your topic. It served no point at all to post this thread. Fact, it's rare these types of threads come up on SMC. It's a negative thread that the only outcome was exactly the 3 pages of rebuttals directed towards your negative thinking.

Mods - please close this SENSELESS Thread!

[Steve Schlumpf]

Well, wasn't that fun. It seems everyone has had a chance to voice their opinion of whether to start some sort of a photo/cover honor or not. While I personally think the general idea has merit, it does seem that the majority here do not wish to take any chances on changing the atmosphere of the forum. Not a problem. I have closed the discussion in the mods forum and will not pursue the idea further.

Also, seeing as how the only thing that seems to be coming out now is anger.... I am closing this thread.