Negative Rake Scraper

[Bernie Weishapl]

Well I have seen a lot of talk about negative rake scrapers and have been thinking about it for a while. So I went to PSI and bought a 3/4" sqaure end scraper. I took and ground it to a combined angle of 42*. It looks like a skew. I had been in contact with Cindy Drozda who has been great in helping. Anyway once I got the shape I wanted and is one she suggested then you only sharpen on one side so you have a burr on the top side. I will say this. I have been working on another lidded box like the finial star. I used it on the inside of the lid and the top side. I can say it does a fine job with thin, wispy ribbons and I actually finish sanded it with just 400 and 600 grit. Anyway the finish on the inside and outside was just smooth like glass. I also wanted it to try and lighten the dye like she does on the background colors. So will continue to try it on different projects to see how it goes.

[Steve Vaughan]

Bernie, thanks for that! I've wondered about them too and just happen to have a 3/4" scraper laying around I might give it a try with. Thanks for the notes!

[mike ash]

Sorry for the ignorance, but I don't have a clue what "PSI" is referring to. I'll probably slap my forehead when you tell me!!!!

Thanks, Mike

[Greg Just]

I have seen this before and I need to try it. Thanks Bernie. I need help with that "final" cut.

[Robert Henrickson]

Penn State Industries

[charlie knighton]

PSI probably means pen state, we do not have a store near here, but i get the catalog

Bernie, thanks for the picture, i can see the burr i believe in the first picture

it does almost look like a skew, maybe that's why my previous attempt to use one was "not so good"

[Roland Martin]

Very interesting, I've heard the term negative hook, but never reallized that it was ground that way. I'll be trying that myself, thanks Bernie.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Bernie....I use my skews as a negative rake scraper routinely.

[Jon McElwain]

Bernie....I use my skews as a negative rake scraper routinely.

So I have seen the Cindy Drozda videos about the negative rake scraper (Cindy is in our woodturning club) but I have always had one question. Why make a new tool for the job when a scraper or a skew can be angled downward to present the tool to the wood with the same negative rake as a specially formed scraper?

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Jon.......the Lacer skews with their increased thickness and mass work extremely well in this fashion.

[Bernie Weishapl]

Thanks for the comments. Ken I do use my skews but it dulls them quickly. So Jon decided to make a tool specfic for this. The burr doesn't last long on them and I got tired of having to sharpen my skews all the time.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Granted Bernie....that straight scraper sharpens quicker freehand than our Lacer skews!

[Dick Mahany]

I just watched a 2009 episode of the WoodTurning Work Shop with Tim Yoder, where Stuart Batty did a spectacular job of explaing how he turns an off-center bowl on a very thin wing. He used a negative rake scraper technique and got a fabulous finish with it. He mentioned that burr on the negative scraper only lasts for about 15 seconds before needing redressing, but it was impresive, not to mention truly informative and fun to watch.

[Bernie Weishapl]

Thats for sure Ken. Much rather sharpen a $17 scraper than my expensive Lacer skews.

Dick I have a chinaberry bowl I was having trouble with. I just couldn't get that thing smooth with a gouge or shear scraping. Tongiht I used this scraper and it worked wonders with it. Started sanding at 220 and 320. Surface looks extremely nice.

[David Gilbert]

When I first started turning I bought two partial sets of old Craftsman high speed steel tools. I ended up with two skews so I sharpened one of them like it was a scraper. I put it on my Wolverine base at the same angle as my other scrapers and went to town. It works very nicely and find is my go to tool for the bowl bottoms and tight spots.

Cheers,
David

212344212345

[Bernie Weishapl]

Thanks David. Looks good.

[Nathan Hawkes]

Thanks for posting this Bernie. I have a couple old tools that I was going to give away, but I think regrinding them to this profile is a much better idea!! This should really help clean up some grain on tiny boxes! Using my custom Lacer skew and 2030 Packard as scrapers wears down the edge too quickly. Thanks for the info!

[Jon McElwain]

I have a couple old tools that I was going to give away...

I gave a lot of old tools away a few years ago. Just before joining the Creek. Totally bummed after seeing all these cool custom tools that guys come up with that are made from old tools. Better go hit up Craigslist - lots of cheap HSS on there!!

[Hayes Rutherford]

Jon, I think most of the cheap tools on Craigslist are high carbon steel not HSS. Aside from that, I did what David did with two old skews and made a right and left for outside curves. I just started in grinding at 60 deg. and after a few times to the grinder I hit the top bevel again. If HSS last 15 seconds, I would say carbon steel lasts about 5 seconds. But 5 seconds is usually long enough to get rid of a few ripples in most cases, they take only a couple of seconds to touch up, and the price was right.

Bernie, your approach is probably better because not a huge investment and a longer lasting edge each time.

[Thom Sturgill]

At the NC symposium, someone asked Richard Raffan about negative rake scrapers and he asked back why not just angle your scraper at a downward angle? I seem to remember someone once telling a group that you do not put a burr on a NR scraper.

[Bernie Weishapl]

Nate that is why I bought a cheap tool. Thom the problem I found I was sharpening my skew all the time when used as a NR scraper. I didn't want to keep going to the grinder with an expensive Lacer skew. I do have a burr on mine and that is what Cindy Drozda recommended. I know Richard doesn't use them and just uses his skews but he did say when using them he had to sharpen quite often.

[Thom Sturgill]

Bernie, coming into turning from instrument making and flatwork, I had gotten interested in reconditioning planes, chisels and using bench scrapers. As a result, I hone to a fine polish and use a tool Lee Valley sells:
212500

This puts a fine burr on my scrapers that lasts quite a while.

[Toney Robertson]

And how do you present this NRS to the wood?

Just flat with a downward angle?

TIA

[Thom Sturgill]

And how do you present this NRS to the wood?

Just flat with a downward angle?

TIA

The tool is held flat. The downward slope of the edge (Negative rake) makes the tool almost catch proof. A conventional scraper is often held at a downward (negative) angle for the same effect.

[Bernie Weishapl]

Toney like Thom said it is held flat on the tool rest. Light cuts makes fluffy curlies.