Neophyte needs suggestions

[John C Bush]

Good Morning,

Grain tearout is making me tear my limited hair out. I was given a beautiful 34" X 72" X 2" slab of Copper Beech(?) and it has swirly grain and knots that are making it tough to get a smooth surface. I want to stick with neanderthal surfacing but am getting ready to fire up the belt sander. I have an old Stanley(Bailey?) #8, a Record smaller than the #8 and a smaller yet Stanley I think a #6. I have tuned them up as much as I know as they all shave off a thin ribbon on straight grain. I am thrilled as the long strokes leave a nice surface, then the chatter starts at the goofy grain and tear-out begins. I have been using a more diagonal--skew??--stroke and still get the same. I approach the aberrant grain from all angles and can get smoother results but tear-out happens after passing over the knot. My local rental shop doesn't have any Lie-Nieson rental and the planes I have should work. Can't be the operator. Any suggestions. I need to finsh this table for a charity auction by the 19th of Nov.

thie slabe weighs ~~100#s~~ Any base design ideas?? I am going to use some Madrone for the base and I have some ideas but I concerned about engineering stability and the overall weight on the table. Thanks, John.

[Jeff L Miller]

Time to go with a scraper I would guess. There are high angle planes available for the gnarly grain, but I have had luck with a scraper set up with a nice burr, it should shave off your chatter marks and get down to a respectable surface.

A Stanley #112 is a great tool and so is the #80, but card scraper will work as well. Your local woodworkers supply will likely have Sandvik or other similar brands. If set up properly, a card scraper will work wonders and I think they are underutilized for as good as they work. The key is proper tune up and a sharp burr.

Jeff

[Bill White]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nz6EpQu2HRo
Ng makes this seem sooooooo easy. Try his techniques.
Bill

[Jim Koepke]

John,

Welcome to the Creek. Your profile does not indicate your location. You may live close to someone who is able to help you with different tools for the situation.

My usual solution to such is to use one of my tight mouthed smoothers with a blade as sharp as I am able to get it. This would be one of my planes from 7 - 10" depending on the situation.

jtk

[Greg Wease]

You might want to try a higher cutting angle by adding a back bevel (10-15 degrees) to one of your blades if you don't have a scraper handy. Skewing your plane effectively lowers the cutting angle and usually makes things worse with gnarly grain.

[James Owen]

John,

One of these might help you out:

http://www.japanwoodworker.com/product.asp?s=JapanWoodworker&pf_id=98.107.2155&dept_id=13602

http://www.japanwoodworker.com/product.asp?s=JapanWoodworker&pf_id=98.107.3155&dept_id=13602

They're both bedded at 63˚, are inexpensive ($55 - $65), and work like a charm on gnarly, uncooperative grain. I've used the 9" and the block plane sized versions on curly maple and on knotty areas in walnut and oak; they gave a nice smooth, tear-out free finish. YMMV.

[Jim Neeley]

I'd use Jim's approach, followed by Jeff's if a few small areas needed even more work.

As Jim indicates, #6 and larger planes are for flattening and removing stock. The small smoothing (say, a #4 or so) planes are for smoothing out torn grain where its changing. A high angle or back-bevel will help.

A scraper is the ultimate tool for this but it likes to leave dips and waves since its a very localized scraping, so is used by some for very shallow cuts, removing the final torn fibers in a localized area.

YMMV.. Opinions are like... NOSES... everybody has one! <g>

[jamie shard]

+1 on the back bevel suggestion and note that skewing effectively >lowers< the pitch which will tend to increase tearout.

[Fitzhugh Freeman]

I'm also rather new to all this, but I strongly suggest you get a card scraper and learn to get a nice burr on it - takes a little practice to get one consistantly, but each attempt doesn't take much time. Don't fall for the recent wave of "just run a file over it and it works - why does anyone bother with a burnisher?" type articles and blog posts. It is a wonderful tool, and about as cheap as you can get. It is easy to use and gets you out of a lot of jams. Get a good burnisher, don't try the screwdriver handle approach. I did, it was bad. Got a burnisher and it made all the difference.

As mentioned, they can cause dips and waves in the surface since they don't have a plane body around the blade. Still, they only take off a small shaving - unless you want them to take more. Check your work often and carefully as you go so you know what is happening to the surface.

Note that I haven't used a cabinet scraper - I see the terms interchanged, but I think of a card scraper as just a piece of metal with a burr and a cabinet scraper as something similar, only with a body or handles - others, please correct me if I'm mistaken.

Wouldn't a toothing plane would be a good choice here? Followed by a scraper?

[Greg Wease]

Note that I haven't used a cabinet scraper - I see the terms interchanged, but I think of a card scraper as just a piece of metal with a burr and a cabinet scraper as something similar, only with a body or handles - others, please correct me if I'm mistaken.

Wouldn't a toothing plane would be a good choice here? Followed by a scraper?

You are correct about a cabinet scraper. There are several types with the Stanley #80 or equivalent perhaps the most common. The bed is small but definitely aids in maintaining a flat surface relative to a hand scraper. I use mine regularly.

A Toothing blade would help flatten the surface, followed by one of the suggested improvements for smoothing.

[James Scheffler]

I'll put in a vote for the Stanley No. 80 cabinet scraper. This has worked better than a card scraper for me. I also find it easier to properly sharpen than a card scraper. Popular Woodworking had a great article on sharpening these blades a few months back.

Jim S.