Epilog Radius Tube

[Martin Boekers]

I was given an Epilog Radius Laser 25watt this weekend. I haven't had a chance to power it up.
It was working a few months ago when replaced with a newer model. I just got off the phone with Epilog,
to refurbish the tube, if needed. Better sit down.........is $4000.00! That is the price, (there is NO core refund)
better yet there is only a 6 month warranty on the tube. NOT The standard Epilog 2 years. This is for a
25watt tube. I was told no way to retro-fit another tube and power supply!

Imagine that! a 25watt LIMITED Warranty tube for $4000.00.

The tube may be good I'm not sure, but one thing after hearing all this (even though Epilog is an upstanding
company) I can now NEVER recommend buying a used Epilog that isn't a late model (less than 2 years old) at any
price. Wow. (sorry Peck,) I'd still buy a new one and recommend them, this laser is 11 years old. Epilog should
have some form of retofit. I could see an upgrade with a new 60watt tube with a 2 yr warranty for $4000.00.

So, before anyone buys a used laser (any manufacturer) you really need to find out what the cost of support is.
I still see these being sold at $2000+. Do your research before buying!

[Michael Hunter]

Fit a Chinese glass tube???
Tube and PSU together should not be much more than $400.
Worth investigating whether the output from the Epilog motherboard is suitable for controlling a glass tube.

[Martin Boekers]

You would think that someone would sell a whole retrofit kit. Motherboard included.
This one may work fine. It's just that I was blown away what a 25watt tube cost with basically
no warranty. I think once someone realizes the market for such a retrofit they will start producing
them

I have recently replaced 75watt tube, I think the price (with core exchange) was about $2200,
So I was figuring maybe a few hundred less.

We'll see what happens when I fire her up!

[Liesl Dexheimer]

Gotta admit, I was kinda shocked @ the price they charged for a power supply. I've built my own computer & I know how much one costs, I figured it would be $150 for the laser. I can say it was actually slightly more than double what I had anticipated. Of course I'm not under warranty either. I'm still surprised it failed after about 6 yrs. God forbid when the tube goes (crosses fingers & hopes it never does).

[matthew knott]

It would not be hard to interface the electronics, most epilogs use a coherent laser, they are controlled via and RJ45 and there is not many signals to deal with, these come direct form the motherboard so you might need to change a few levels or invert some signals but it can be done, the real problem would be mounting the laser, the rf waveguide lasers tend to be compact, thats why small area high power chinese machines have a box on the back,to take a long tube. Also epilog is not the only company that can fix these, coherent wont touch them because they have a tie in deal that forces you to send them to epilog but there are other people TLM laser in the uk, sure the usa has a few.

[Ernie Balch]

oops wrong location

[Martin Boekers]

One thing with Epilog and ULS both give great support. I have 2, 75 Watt Legend EXTs One 6 years old and the other 3 years old.
I haven't been down more than 24hrs, parts overnight and in. So that part is good. Epilog gives a 2 year warranty on new tubes.
(except for models such as this one)
You can run the serial number past Epilog an they give you the service records.

Will the vendor give you any warranty more than 90 days?
Are there extras thrown in, Software, rotary attachment, blower motor etc, those can add up.

If you by an American made, Epilog or ULS their prices are quite a bit higher than a Chinese laser.
Chinese lasers seem to be a more hands on product. I am not that mechanical but with Epilog support
I can replace anything. Very well designed.

I would contact Epilog and see how they plan to support this laser a few years down the road.
I believe they update models every 3-5 years so this may be getting close to "expensive" support.

I know tubes and boards can get expensive, but to charge $4000. and limit the warranty. Most
used car dealers give you more at least on the warranty side. I have to admit... I get nervous when
a company will sell you a product but don't want to warranty it.

[Michael Hunter]

I think you do much better in the 'States.....

In the UK, around £4,000 ($6,395) for an exchange 60W tube for my Epilog.
(apparently that is what I will end up having paid, after the core charge thing has been sorted).

So how much is air-freight for a tube?

[matthew knott]

There is defo some profitering going on with the replacement tubes, we have been quote £4300 for an exchange on a 75watt tube, im going to get our tube repaired and regased, be under half the cost but it means the tube will be gone for a week or so, its coming out tomorrow!!

[Rodne Gold]

The cost of a replacement RF tube is what led me down the Chinese laser path. I would rather buy a new machine at the same cost of a tube or less!!!
We had a 30w coherent repaired at coherent at a cost of $4000+ and it lasted for JUST the 6 month warrantee...a total waste of money and a total rip off by the RF tube mnfgrs..synrad prices not much better.
Retrofitting a glass tube to most mainstream machines is really not an option , you would have to change a lot of things , almost certainly the motherboard and maybe some of the motion system.., you might as well just buy a new laser for the time , effort and money involved if you have to do all that
If you could get it right without major machine mods it would be cheap , $300 for a cheap 80w tube and PS , $600 for a RECI. I think getting it to fire properly is going to be the issue.
I have a dead tube GCC explorer , will fiddle with it next year to see if a glass tube can be fitted.

[Martin Boekers]

Rodne,

I was given this machine so I was hoping to play with it at home. It was working a few months back.
I imagine that when the gentleman found out what the tube cost was he decided on a new machine!
I think he may decided against selling it as if the tube went quickly someone would not be happy ;(
It may be fine, when I get a chance to start it up I will see. This is for home so I can have have something to
fiddle with late at night when I can't sleep!

It it doesn't work, I'm sure someone out there would like some parts!

It still amazes me the cost though.......

[Mike Mackenzie]

Martin,

I would contact photovac and let them recharge the tube probably about 1,250 +/- for the 25 watt tubes + they give you a 12 month warranty.

The drawback to this is you must send that tube to them and it will take up to a couple of weeks to reprocess.

[Martin Boekers]

Martin,

I would contact photovac and let them recharge the tube probably about 1,250 +/- for the 25 watt tubes + they give you a 12 month warranty.

The drawback to this is you must send that tube to them and it will take up to a couple of weeks to reprocess.


Thanks Mike that was more what I was looking for! A few weeks or a month isn't an issue on this one as it is not planned to be "work-flow" laser. More towards home use
and testing.

I will make note of Photovac and get details for when a tube needs to be worked on!

[Martin Boekers]

Martin,

I would contact photovac and let them recharge the tube probably about 1,250 +/- for the 25 watt tubes + they give you a 12 month warranty.

The drawback to this is you must send that tube to them and it will take up to a couple of weeks to reprocess.


Mike,

Thanks for the tip! I contacted them and they said the avreage repair for that Synrad tube was < $1500.00 That is QUITE a bit
cheaper than Epilog's quote of $4000.00 Plus their warranty is even better than what you said. It's a full 18 months. Epilog was
6 months. Epilog should consider setting up an arrangement with these guys as it is so much cheaper and a longer warranty!

If you ever make it to my neck of the woods I owe you a dinner!

[Liesl Dexheimer]

Gotta admit, I was kinda shocked @ the price they charged for a power supply. I've built my own computer & I know how much one costs, I figured it would be $150 for the laser. I can say it was actually slightly more than double what I had anticipated. Of course I'm not under warranty either. I'm still surprised it failed after about 6 yrs. God forbid when the tube goes (crosses fingers & hopes it never does).

Since there was talk about high prices with Epilog and I posted how high of a cost the power supply was...I stand somewhat corrected. The problem is that the replacement power supply doesn't fit in the exact same spot as the old one (on an Epilog Mini) which then meant I needed an entirely new back panel which is why it cost more $$. Thought someone might wanna know in case this happens to them...

[Martin Boekers]

Since there was talk about high prices with Epilog and I posted how high of a cost the power supply was...I stand somewhat corrected. The problem is that the replacement power supply doesn't fit in the exact same spot as the old one (on an Epilog Mini) which then meant I needed an entirely new back panel which is why it cost more $$. Thought someone might wanna know in case this happens to them...


It's just not Epilog, didn't mean to harp on them alone. I have two Epilogs that are fine and if I needed a third laser I wouldn't have a problem buying another one.
Service has been great, warranty and other repairs have been fine. The only reason I posted this was for those buying a used laser (esp hobbists) to really check
it out and what parts are to replace before jumping in. One thing Epilog would be wise in checking is how can an Laser Repair shop be $2500 less and give you an
additional year under warranty. New lasers become old lasers, some start out with a used model and when they get rolling by a new one. If you price the repairs to costly
on older machines then those buyers never develop. They buy a cheaper brand, then 3 cheaper models and toss them when they go bad. Just some thoughts...

[Michael Hunter]

When I drove a Saab, the spares and servicing for cars over 3 years old was heavily discounted as they wanted to keep you happy and have you buy a new one.
Now my wife has a Mini and the BMW garage does a similar thing (though the discount is "only" 10%).

Shame the laser people don't do the same.

[Mike Mackenzie]

The problem is not with the system manufacturers it is with there suppliers. Synrad for example discontinued a couple of series of laser tubes and will not support them anymore. These tubes are the ones that were used in all the earlier systems (epilog, uls, trotec, new hermes, GCC, etc.

So now the system mfg's have a lot of systems in the field and there supplier of the most important part does not want to deal with them any longer and controls the repair price if they are repairable.

So how is the systems MFG going to control an UN controllable situation?

This was one of the main reasons Universal started manufacturing there own tubes.

I am surprised Epilog did not offer the photovac company as an alternative.

I can also say that if you tried to buy a new part for a 1950 Chevy you will certainly pay more for it if you could even find it. The same thing will happen with the parts for older laser systems.

What the system Mfg's should do is offer upgrade kits or retrofit kits in order to use the current parts on older systems, however this will not happen because they want to sell new equipment.

[Craig Matheny]

Martin and other Epilog users I have a 45 watt Aug 2007 build date. Just replaced the tube converted from Coherent to Epilog total cost 1200.00 not 4000.00 that coherent wanted.

Basically Epilog can at this time convert late models to 2007 but call first and I did get 2 year warranty also.

Part of the conversion was an upgrade to 6 input fans from 4 and a longer tube with bracket extender.

[Martin Boekers]

Martin and other Epilog users I have a 45 watt Aug 2007 build date. Just replaced the tube converted from Coherent to Epilog total cost 1200.00 not 4000.00 that coherent wanted.

Basically Epilog can at this time convert late models to 2007 but call first and I did get 2 year warranty also.

Part of the conversion was an upgrade to 6 input fans from 4 and a longer tube with bracket extender.


The tube I have is a 25watt Synrad 48 series. On Synrads website they say this tube should last over 45,000 hours.
If my math is correct, that mean you could run this 8hrs a day 365 days a year for over 15 years!
That's a heck of a long time! They also say the design is such if the tube loses power it may require just a cheap
refill. This Radius is from 1998.

I haven't fired this up yet, shoot I may have another 5 or more years on the tube (Feb 1998) :)

I did call Epilog to see what support was available for this machine. (I know there are quite a few Radius & Summits
out there still) The tech rep from Epilog said I would have to send them the tube and it takes 4-8 weeks. The cost would
be $4000 and there is only a six month warranty on that. I questioned them on that, but they reconfirmed the cost.
I was told that they don't sell the belts seperetly, but as a kit.

The 75 watt tube I replaced recently for my 2005 EXT was about $2400.00

You may have got a pretty good deal on that tube, I haven't heard of a price that low on any Epilog tube, not counting what it would take to convert it. Hopefully my machine won't need it! outside of the mirrors and lens the machine is really
in nice shape!

[Craig Matheny]

Martin I was just letting people know that Epilog has made some major changes on tube replacement and currently it is 40 - 60 watt and back to at least 2007. Also if you send your tube in and then have them send out the replacement tube you save 100.00 and that ends up covering the shipping cost.
Good luck I wish I had a tube that would last 45,000.00 hours. By the way why don't you go direct to Synrad if you need a tube?

[Rodne Gold]

I don't think you can buy directly from synrad..well not one tube....