Miller Falls Miter Boxes

[David Nelson1]

I'm looking to purchase a miter box and have pretty much decided that an older Miller Falls would be a good choice based on comments posted here and elsewhere. I have seen a reference "nbr 74",what does this mean? Can't find an explanation anywhere.

Thanks in advance.

[andrew messimer]

I am not positive but I think that means Number 74, which was the model. They also had No. 73 which was smaller and a 75 which was bigger. I think the 74 had like a 26" by 4" saw and the 75 had 28" by 5" saw. I could be wrong on the exact sizes. Seems to me the 74 was the most common. If you google Rose Antique Tools, they have all sorts of old catalogs, Millers Falls included.

Edit: If you download the MF 1939 catalog, the miter boxes start on pg. 142 of the pdf.

[Mark Dorman]

I think Andrew is right. Both mine are # 74. I will send a link to a manual.

Mark

[Joshua Clark]

As far as I know, the Langdon Acme box was offered in three sizes, referred to in the catalog as 1, 2, and 2 1/2. The model numbers 68-75 determined the combination of saw and box. The model numbers break down as follows:



Model No.
Box No.
Saw Size


68
1
22


69
1
24


70
1
26


71
2
22


72
2
24


73
2
26


74
2 1/2
28


75
2 1/2
30





I don't know what the differences are between the different box numbers The 2 and 2 1/2 are clearly larger boxes since they have a larger mitre capacity at 45 degrees and at 90 (10in vs 7in). The 2 and 2 1/2 have the same capacities but the 2 1/2 is heavier (net, not including saw) indicating it's bigger in some dimension.


That's what I've been able to learn from the catalogs I have. My advice to everyone when it comes to mitre boxes it to keep looking. They do pop up from time to time. I dislike selling them online because shipping them is a real pain. It takes a tremendous amount of time, not to mention packing supplies to pack and ship them properly. Because of the high cost of shipping them I'm forced to charge what I feel is an unrealistic price for them which is something I hate to do.


I hope this helps! Good luck in your search!


-Josh

[Jessica Pierce-LaRose]

I haven't searched (maybe tomorrow morning while I'm having coffee) but is there a good reference that would describe what I should look for as far as parts or what to look for and such? I've seen a couple at thrift stores and craigslist, some without the saws, but I don't know enough about the box itself to avoid getting for something that might need some odd threaded screw or hard to find part.

[David Nelson1]

LOL nbr has to mean number. Wow that was way to obvious duh!

[David Keller NC]

David - The company name is actually "Millers Falls", not "Miller Falls". Might help when searching the 'net.

[Dave Lehnert]

Miter Boxes has gotten popular. 10 years ago I saw some at auction go for $10 attached to a workbench. (Included)

[David Nelson1]

David - The company name is actually "Millers Falls", not "Miller Falls". Might help when searching the 'net.

LOL thanks for the attention to detail.

[Joshua Clark]

As few as five years ago I was giving them away for free just to be rid of them. Nobody wanted them!

As far as what to look for- the most important thing is that the box shouldn't be broken or overly rusted. The supports that the saw rides in should operate smoothly and it's preferable that the mechanism that holds the saw positioned above the wood works well. There are all sorts of attachments, stops, and little bits that came with these mitre boxes from the factory. Finding a complete one is almost as likely as winning the lottery. Luckily, many of the pieces are not completely necessary. The stops that prevent the saw from cutting the frame are nice to have, though you can use a board to protect the bed and it will work just as well. Most boxes had some sort of dog to hold the stock to the fence. These are nice to have as well, but not critical. There are also supplementary stops that allow you to set an arbitrary stop height which is useful when sawing tenons. I've never found this useful personally. Finally, a lot of boxes had length stops that, just like a modern SCMS, allow you to quickly and easily make cuts of the same size. This stop is almost always missing but the functionality can be easily replicated with a small clamp and a block of wood.

In short, don't but one that's broken, rusted beyond repair, or with bad saw supports.

Hope this helps.

-Josh

[Mike Holbrook]

I have given thought to purchasing a mitre box for a hand saw several times while shopping at Highland Wood working. They offer a couple different models which include a frame saw. I just went and looked at some Miller's Falls versions for auction and I think the price of the vintage item is similar to the new ones. Are any of the currently made versions of the same or better quality than the vintage ones? I would love to hear from someone who actually uses one of these tools concerning what & how they find them useful for especially compared to a modern electric compound miter saw.

[Jessica Pierce-LaRose]

I've got one of the Jorgensen mitre saws with the frame saw - it leaves a nice smooth finish, but I'm generally more accurate cutting by hand. The angle setting of the blade isn't too bad (but really only works with the preset angles) but the frame saw has enough play it can be difficult to get a truly plumb cut, and the and the although I haven't checked it, I'm not convinced the fence is actually square. The wood-holding bits do a really poor job of things, as well. I've not used a vintage box, so I have nothing to compare it to, but after seeing them used in a few videos, I'm thinking they work a little better. In reality, even if I haven't fidgeted the saw in to behaving as well as I'd like, a little bit of work at the shooting board cleans it up, and I usually use the shooting board just to get moulding to be perfect anyway.

That said, I don't have any experience with the Nobex ones, which I hear are nicer than the Jorgensen ones.

I'd take either one over an electric compound saw, mainly because of the noise/dust/size of the thing, and also because I often use one for the types of cuts that wouldn't be safe with powered saw - at least, I've seen at least one bad experience with a compound mitre saw powered missile with small offcuts, and a hand powered saw is much easier to take apart and put on the shelf in my small space.

If I was using one to crosscut large quantities of larger stock regularly, that would be different - but I've always had other options to turn to for that.

[Tony Zaffuto]

That's what I've been able to learn from the catalogs I have. My advice to everyone when it comes to mitre boxes it to keep looking. They do pop up from time to time. I dislike selling them online because shipping them is a real pain. It takes a tremendous amount of time, not to mention packing supplies to pack and ship them properly. Because of the high cost of shipping them I'm forced to charge what I feel is an unrealistic price for them which is something I hate to do.


Josh

T0 re-emphasize what Josh has said about shipping miter boxes: About ten years I begain a quest to corner the miter box market and now have close to twenty in my shop. Some were purchased from that auction site we all look at from time to time and it was only these that I had problems. First, from pictures it is hard to tell if all the pieces are there. It is fairly easy to see the saw guides, etc., but the guide bearings, screws, etc. are a different story. Second, these things are a bear to ship and if not packaged correctly, are easily broken. I remember all to well the nearly mint 50 year old Langdon I bought that arrived with the swing arm crack-off, because the doofus that shipped it tried to force pieces of styrofoam all around the miter box, instead of packing peanuts or newspaper. The ridgid foam snapped the arm cleanly off. The seller did refund a portion of the price to me, but in retrospect, it left me with a box that was useless, except to scavenge a few parts from.

Anyhow, the best bet is to scour flea markets, garage sales and even an occassional antique mall (I picked up two boxes at these!). In person you can see clearly the condition and it is up to you to get the box home safely.

T.Z.

[Jessica Pierce-LaRose]

Up where I'm at, these things pop up on Craigslist fairly frequently - it's interesting - the prices asked will be all over the map, and they show up in a few different categories. And it seems random as to whether they'll go immediately or languish being reposted for months.

[Gary Herrmann]

I've got a nbr 74. Cleaned it up and it works great. Look for breaks in the base. I think the 75s are more popular and expensive because they're the big ones.

[Mike Brady]

http://i234.photobucket.com/albums/ee300/finefettle/newbox001.jpghttp://i234.photobucket.com/albums/ee300/finefettle/Woodnet images/miterbox002.jpg
An old M-F 74 (right) and a newer Langdon (left). Both work very well and are accurate but the later one is less fussy to adjust.

[David Nelson1]

Both them look great Mike! How much time did you spend rehabbing them?

[John Petsche]

Great info on these classic saws!

[Mike Brady]

Here is the best site I know of for Millers Falls Langdon miter box information: https://sites.google.com/site/langdonmitreboxes/home/catalogs

Use it if you really want to do a precise restoration of the tool's functions. This site isn't fancy, but is has a lot of useful information.

[steven c newman]

The only real difference between a #74 and a #75 is the LENGTH of the saw being used. The 75 used a 30" long by 5" deep saw, the 74 had a 28" long saw, by 5" deep. 370144
This is how my #75 came home from a Garage sale ( $15) Cleaned up rather nicely...
370145
Currently, that 30" saw is in need of a sharpening....so I am running the 28" long saw. Both are 5" under the spine, both fit either box.

[Tom Humbert]

As far as I know, the Langdon Acme box was offered in three sizes, referred to in the catalog as 1, 2, and 2 1/2. The model numbers 68-75 determined the combination of saw and box. The model numbers break down as follows:



Model No.
Box No.
Saw Size


68
1
22


69
1
24


70
1
26


71
2
22


72
2
24


73
2
26


74
2 1/2
28


75
2 1/2
30





I don't know what the differences are between the different box numbers The 2 and 2 1/2 are clearly larger boxes since they have a larger mitre capacity at 45 degrees and at 90 (10in vs 7in). The 2 and 2 1/2 have the same capacities but the 2 1/2 is heavier (net, not including saw) indicating it's bigger in some dimension.


That's what I've been able to learn from the catalogs I have. My advice to everyone when it comes to mitre boxes it to keep looking. They do pop up from time to time. I dislike selling them online because shipping them is a real pain. It takes a tremendous amount of time, not to mention packing supplies to pack and ship them properly. Because of the high cost of shipping them I'm forced to charge what I feel is an unrealistic price for them which is something I hate to do.


I hope this helps! Good luck in your search!


-Josh


Is there an easy way to save your post so I know where to find it later on besides printing it out? Always have questions on these and this seems to answer most of them!

[Jim Koepke]

Is there an easy way to save your post so I know where to find it later on besides printing it out? Always have questions on these and this seems to answer most of them!

Tom, It depends on your computer's operating system.

It also depends on other preferences. Often it is easy for me to save pages as a web archive. This lets me save full pages as a file that opens with a browser but saves it on my computer.

Other times text is copied and pasted in to a text editor for saving.

Sometimes an image file is more useful. My computer is an iMac. There are system commands that allow the user to capture images from the screen as an image file. My understanding is this is available on current Microsoft operating systems.

jtk

[Sanford Imhoff]

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