SRG on Bowls, Wrong/Right

[Reed Gray]

There was an extended thread on using spindle roughing gouges on bowls on the Australian Woodworking forums. I would post the link to them, but not sure if that is allowed here. This video says a lot about now not to use a SRG on face plate work. He was intending to show what can happen, and got a bit more than he bargained for. I couldn't figure out how to drag his link and mine over here in one spot, so it follows in the first response here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IOhHeyoZLaY

r (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IOhHeyoZLaY)obo hippy

[Reed Gray]

Here is my version on how to use a SRG correctly on a bowl.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OwlAb2BWHw8

r (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OwlAb2BWHw8)obo hippy

[Jim Burr]

If no one else makes money from the thread...who cares!!! Threads are deleated on a popular basis.

[Roger Chandler]

Reed,

I see you have the corners [what the other guy called horns] ground back a little from 90 degrees on the gouge you were using.........seems that also is a critical issue.........those corners on a bowl can do you in, but with them back from the center a bit, it looks like one could get by with the technique you show.................still a bit iffy for a novice, I think, but a more accomplished turner might get comfortable with it.

No denying the nice finish off that tool when used as a shear cutting tool.

[Josh Bowman]

Well, I guess we learned a couple of things with both of these. Good information.

[Baxter Smith]

Very interesting Reed. Thanks!

[Scott Hackler]

Am I the only one who became extremely uncomfortable while the first video was playing? I knew it was coming but boy did that make me nervous!

[David E Keller]

Interesting links for completely different reasons... Reed, your gouge looks like the Thompson version which weights about 30 pounds and has a solid end that fits into the handle... That's a different beast all together than the more traditional roughing gouge that the Aussie was using. Still, your technique is an interesting one, and I'll try it some day when I've saved up enough tool money to get a manly SRG!

[Reed Gray]

Actually, that SRG was in the first set of tools I got from Craft Supplies, 15 years ago. Small tang. I do have one of Dougs, but it is a smaller one, but round shaft.

robo hippy

[Alan Trout]

Reed,

very nice work. Every time I see Doug I ask him if he will finance his big SRG. I don't use them much but it is a heck of a nice tool. and it does have a 3/4" shank which would be pretty hard to break.

Alan

[Harvey M. Taylor]

All that loose clothing around machinery scares me. Max

[Dale Miner]

Reed,

A conventional ground bowl gouge with a grind of about 45 degrees will make the same high shear cut and not have the small tang issue in the event of a mistake.

There is a bloke in New Zealand that uses a skew for his final cuts on the outside of bowls. I tried that a few times, and it does leave a nice fininsh, but a bit too nerve racking for me.

[Russell Neyman]

Both of these are useful and somewhat entertaining clips. For the life of me, why someone would put a completely square board (a thick bowl blank I guess I could understand) on a lathe is beyond me. Anyone heard of a band saw? Or a chain saw? Or a hand saw, even? My philosophy is to put the smallest possible cutting edge to the wood because it reduces the leverage that can be used against me if/when I get a catch. I use bowl gouges with a fingernail grind most of the time. I liked the demonstration of the finish cut using the roughing gouge, though.

[Tim Rinehart]

Am I the only one who became extremely uncomfortable while the first video was playing? I knew it was coming but boy did that make me nervous!
No...I was on edge of my seat as well.

Reed, I enjoyed seeing your demo on using the SRG vs what most of would use for finish cuts, a bowl gouge. I will have to try this. It seems like your approach offers a compromised improvement potentially between traditional bowl gouge push cuts and shear scrape pull cuts. If I interpret correctly, the improvement results from the radius of the tools cutting edge and approach using a SRG vs a bowl gouge in similar application.

[Reed Gray]

There are all sorts of ways to get a clean finish cut. The higher the shear angle is, the cleaner the cut. Having the bevel rubbing makes it cleaner. The more the nose profile looks like this ) the bigger the sweet spot is. The more it looks like this V the smaller the sweet spot is. This is when using the gouge fairly level. To use the wings, and get a larger sweet spot, you have to drop the handle. I can make that same cut with a scraper while rubbing the bevel.

robo hippy

[robert baccus]

I love to use roughing gouges on bowls, however there is a trick. regrind the bevel to 15 deg. or so and run the flat bevel on the work. you can forget catches and yet really hog some wood off. i also grind a little "round" on the tip as opposed to a flat across shape. try it.-------------old forester

[Jamie Donaldson]

Russell, I turn square flat grain bowls frequently, but you'll never see me doing so with a SRG or skew in my hands! I believe showing bad turning examples are not in the best interests of safe turning, because even though certain individuals may be able to accomplish exceptional tasks with generally inappropriate tools, publically promoting such actions is not in the best interest of safe turning. Leading by example should exclude individual exceptions to what are generally perceived as safe procedures, especially when beginners could be influenced by such examples.

[Russell Neyman]

Russell, I turn square flat grain bowls frequently, but you'll never see me doing so with a SRG or skew in my hands! I believe showing bad turning examples are not in the best interests of safe turning, because even though certain individuals may be able to accomplish exceptional tasks with generally inappropriate tools, publically promoting such actions is not in the best interest of safe turning. Leading by example should exclude individual exceptions to what are generally perceived as safe procedures, especially when beginners could be influenced by such examples.

So you use a square blank, per the demo video? Seems like more work than necessary.

[Jamie Donaldson]

210422To make a square bowl form, I start with a square blank, yes.

[Primvs Aebvtivs]

@ Scott ^^^ You and me both buddy! Just sent the first link to a mate (we're both novices) - Ilearnt the hard way not to do it, but I got off lightly with a couple of skips, at which point I thought - "that's not working..." and switched to a proper bowl gouge, thankfully, no problems, except chatter since!

Thanks for the links Reed, I'll catch up with the second one tomorrow.

[Ryan Baker]

I start with square blanks on the lathe frequently. Making square bowls is one obvious time. But it is often faster and easier for me to rough them out on the lathe than to bandsaw them round. (If I had a bigger/better bandsaw, I might do things differently.) Nothing wrong with putting a square piece on the lathe if you are using the right tools and techniques.

Reed, thanks for posting those videos. Both presented interesting views, even if the first had a strong "here it comes" cringe factor.

[Ralph Lindberg]

Dale
There is a You-Tube video, taken from a documentary done in the 30's, of a German craftsman using a number of tools to make a lidded bowl, including a skew
But then his skill level is certainly well above that of the average turner

[bob svoboda]

Thanks Reed. I knew the 'what', but now better understand the 'why'. Nice demo on your part.

[Primvs Aebvtivs]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-z_Ph6nZfGE is the linkto the youtube video "WOOD CARVING IN GERMANY 1926 " *I think*!!!

[Primvs Aebvtivs]

Yep, that's the one! It's made to look very easy, or is that just me as a novice talking? I thought he'd made a mistake leaving the screw holes in, until I saw the handle...

[Reed Gray]

I have seen this one a number of times. Never really paid that much attention to what he was actually doing. He does use a 'continental' style SRG which is more ) shaped compared to the SRG I used which is C shaped. He does keep it up on it's edge a bit for almost all of his cuts. It does look like he is not always using it in 'rubbing the bevel' style which is more of a scrape than a shear cut.

Yes, he does make it look simple. That is the result of years of practice.

robo hippy

[robert baccus]

I use a 3/4" and 1" roughing gouge quite often. the standard 45deg. grind is only for people with a death wish, on bowls. grind the bevel to almost flat 70deg or so and it is a great gouge for putting woodon the floor and finishing also. it is almost impossible to get a "catch" when using this grind and you could grind back the corners a bit. don't be afraid to think outside the box or grind outside also.---------old forester

[robert baccus]

Piece of cake----grind the bevel back to 70deg. almost flat. lays wood on the floor and is almost impossible to get a catch. makes a nice finish cut also.------------old forester

[Rick Markham]

Reed thanks for posting this! I didn't watch the first video, but I watched your's and the other two videos you have, all very informative! It's fun watching you turn