caster height

[Bruce Seidner]

I see people driving to the supermarket on paved roads in Range Rovers and Hummers. And, while I have admiration for the engineering of these vehicles, I just shake my head at the application.

I need to build a mobile base on a 42"x60" top multiple use cabinet and because it will sometimes be moved out of the garage during nice weather some of the low wheel skid designs seem less applicable than a caster mounted base.

There are lots of very good ideas throughout the Creek but I have seen no discussion of caster height. My surfaces are all relatively flat and paved. It will likely weigh in considerably less than a thousand pounds. I don't know if there is a relationship between the height of a wheel and its stability. Likely depends on how robust the wheel is and I don't know about jiggle or stability relative to wheel height.

What is the rationale for choosing wheel height?

And just how stable are these all lock wheels that lock both the wheel and the swivel?

[Jerome Hanby]

I have/had the exact same issues. All my "normal" mobile tool stands were too low to slide the tool out into the drive way without way too much effort. I settled on the Kreg casters. They are about $40 for a set of four and they lock roll and swivel. I cut a piece of 3/4" plywood dimensioned so that my existing tool stand (minus the rolling part of course) with any feet removed would sit on it with a little overhang on all sides. I marked the holes that the feet shafts formerly occupied on the plywood, drilled, and used the caster shaft to attach the plywood (and themselves) to the tool stand. This has given me a rock steady base with the casters locked and plenty of clearance to roll the tools between the garage and driveway easily. Only possible drawback that I see is that it does raise the tool height. For me, I'm tall, so the added height was a good thing.

Rockler sells a mobile stand called Bigfoot (I think that's the name) that also gives extra clearance, but it's a little prices (close to $200 IIRC). But, I don't think it increases the machine height as much as my solution.

I've currently done my table saw, planer, and RAS. The casters aren't suitable for my Shopsmith, but I saw where they just came out with a new set that gives the same sort of capability. My theory is that since I just installed the new Shopsmith casters that I've had for several years they felt compelled to come out with better ones for me to buy!

[Ryan Mooney]

What is the rationale for choosing wheel height?

Doesn't make the tool overly tall (or conversely raises the tool to a comfortable height). Is tall enough to roll smoothly across floor. From what I can tell unless you have pretty big bumps the latter is mostly a non issue unless you are trying to roll over something pretty big - like in the transition from my garage->driveway there is a ~1/2" drop which smaller casters with heavy machines wouldn't handle so well - for heavy tools moving them out there is a non starter anyway so its not an issue..



And just how stable are these all lock wheels that lock both the wheel and the swivel?

I've tried a couple of type of those, and have mixed feedback. All the ones I've tried seem to have some "slop" (or in a few cases lots of slop) in them, so they aren't good enough for something like a workbench where you are trying to plane or hand saw on it but work fine for a tool rolling cabinets (I don't really "push" on those in use though they're just storage...). For something you aren't reefing on they may suffice. I recently put some carrymasters under the bandsaw and the way that the foot is aligned with the center of the connection makes for a very stable base in comparison (they aren't cheap though and are somewhat slow to raise/lower). I suspect if you could find a locking caster that has a similar center alignment it might work better - all the two way locking swivels I've tried have the center of the caster offset from the center of the swivel which seems to give it more room to torque around. I'd be interested to hear if anyone has found a caster like that..

Another idea that seems to be working ok for the workbench for occasional moves is "flip down" casters (sort of a redneck version of these http://www.deltamachinery.com/accessories/bases/item/50-341?category_id=46 - I just put some regular casters on a board hinged to the legs and made a flip stop out of some old hinges, works but is kind of a pain to engage/disengage). This has the advantage of only having the wheels down when you want them down and not having to deal with trying to lock them in place.

I also have one side cabinet with an htc3000 mobile base under it.. that actually works pretty well but could potentially get high centered if you have to go over a large enough bump, I haven't actually measured the clearance but its decent. Its an old cabinet and isn't sturdy enough for other cheaper caster solutions and it needed to be movable... This has the nice advantage of not having to mod the cabinet at all to handle the casters, but the wheels do stick out a ways on one end which is a little bit annoying.

You might also consider looking at a narrow pallet jack and just having room under the kick plate to slide that in/out. I got one a ~month ago and have been finding all sorts of places where its handy if you consider it the universal mover... Storage of of the jack can become an issue (underneath the end of the movable wood rack works pretty for me and only adds about 6" to the space taken there - or just store it under the cabinet :p).

[Thomas Canfield]

You need to take the rated load for the casters with a double grain of salt. I had to increase the caster size for my 8" jointer because of the casters falling apart at less than 1/2 of the rated load. Caster City http://www.castercity.com/ was a big help getting the proper casters. Larger diameter wheels will roll easier (especially on rough surface) and generally have a higher load rating.

[Don Jarvie]

I like to use a 2 1/2 to 3 inch caster for most of my mobile bases and dollys. As Tom said above the bigger the easier to wheel. You can put on 4 locking casters and that will hold the cart pretty secure in place.

[Kent A Bathurst]

Bigger is easier to wheel, as noted - especially if you are going outside on the driveway. I have never liked locking casters, nor swivel casters. Instead, consider a pair of non-swivel casters on one end, and plain legs on the other end. The two pairs of legs have to be different lengths, of course, for the table to sit level. Rock solid.

Then - to move it, you need to make a thing that looks like a wagon tongue from your old Red Flyer. With the handle vertical, you push the other end - with a caster on it - under the lower rail at the non-caster end, bring the handle down, and this rotates the other end up of the tongue up under the rail and lifts the non-caster legs off the floor.

[Thomas Canfield]

Locking casters work well for most applications if there is not too much side load or if a little movement can be tolerated. Anything on casters would be subject to the base will not sit "level" when moved from one location to another. For my Powermatic 3520 I made some removable end pieces using trailer jack wheels and shown on this post: http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?143434-Powermatic-Lathe-Mover&highlight= Something similar might be made for benches or other work stations.

[Bruce Seidner]

I have looked into these trailer jack, scissor jack, and pneumatic jack opitons as well. But I had been locked into thinking they had to be integrated into the cabinet itself. It had not occurred to me to make them removable on an as need basis. I also had not thought about pallet jacks. My thought has been to make caveman style leveling casters where each wheel would be on a jack internal to the cabinet and raised and lowered to level the machine. But this would take some calling around for used jacks since I could not justify the expense of 4 new jacks in this application. I thought a trip to a couple junk yards would produce $5 jacks to play with as opposed to +$20 jacks to experiment with. Thank you for taking the time to share your photos and input.

[Kent A Bathurst]

Bruce - My suggestion is much simpler than all of that. The wheels are cheaper [non-swivel, non-locking], at rest the entire bench is more sturdy - IMHO :D - and assembly and use is very simple and easy.

Very quick, non-professional sketch attached. You would need to monkey around to get the dimensions of the dolly correct, but you'll get the idea.

The straight bolt on the dolly goes through the eye of the eye-bolt on the stretcher - push down on the handle of the dolly, lift the two fixed/straight legs off the floor, and go for a stroll.

If I was doing this, I would be using ~~6" dia pneumatic wheels - but that is just me. I'm getting too old to bust a gut dragging stuff around on a shop tour, and the 6" wheels will be easy to move.

[David Nelson1]

Hank Metz (hope I got the name right) built a flip top cart using the tow bar method.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wBnjo...=youtube_gdata (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wBnjoOvQ_X0&feature=youtube_gdata)

Yup Got the name right. Member here.

[Bruce Seidner]

These are really clever. Lots more straight forward and maneuverable than I would have thought. I looked at the mini pallet jacks that are available but these tow bars are more to scale and similar in function. Much obliged for the drawing and the video guys.

[Bruce Seidner]

These are really clever. Lots more straight forward and maneuverable than I would have thought. I looked at the mini pallet jacks that are available but these tow bars are more to scale and similar in function. Much obliged for the drawing and the video guys.

[Matt Cook]

It may seem like overkill until you try them but I no longer use anything shorter than a 5" caster. I've used everything in the range from 2" and up and, no matter what the application, I was always getting hung up on crap that's on the floor. You'd be amazed how a little, itsy, bitsy, teeneey, weeneey, piece of nothing will lock a wheel up and stop you in your tracks. I spent more time sweeping than I care to admit (not that it's a bad thing). The 5" caster will easily get you over cracks in the concrete, pop over the little stuff, and most support a decent amount of weight. I currently have them under my custom table saw base, my two shop carts, and a couple "move crap around the shop gizmos". The do the job and last. I've purchased industrial grade casters and, to be honest, the ones from the local Home Depot work just as well but cost about half as much. I used to get the ones with the locks but have stopped doing that. A small "wheel chalk" in front and behind a non pivoting wheel will keep the whole cart put.

Oh and how stable are they? My saw table base is about 5 feet long. I have a set of swivel casters at the saw end of the base and a pair of non-swivel casters about 2/3rds the way down the base. I can push a heavy sheet of plywood through the saw without it moving and the base at all and remember, I don't use locking casters. The weight of the table saw, drawer base, and rolling base is enough to keep it put even when I get leaning on a sheet of material.

[Kent A Bathurst]

Another trick/design that is overkill for this application, but might be of use to someone, someday: On the fixed leg end, there is a fixed stretcher somewhere around the midpoint of the legs. Then, there is a lower stretcher that has vertical sections attached to it, and this stretcher slides up and down on grooves/rails in the verticals and legs. There are two swivel casters attached to this lower "floating" stretcher.

And - the punch line - an inexpensive hand-operated hydraulic car jack is mounted to the moveable stretcher. Pump the jack handle, and the jack's shaft pushes up against the fixed stretcher and the moveable stretcher is forced down, causing the casters to lift the fixed legs off the floor. Very maneuverable with 2 fixed and 2 swivel casters, and extremely stable in operation.

Company I used to work for frequently used this technique for machinery that needed to be mobile.....powered conveyor belts [used to move lumber @ 200 FPM] was a common application - things 6' - 30' long, heavy duty C-channel steel frame. Also - special-purpose machines [automated banding machines, for example] that were not in continuous operation, but needed to roll in/roll out of the workcell, depending on the process/product being run. The operators could throw the disconnect, unplug the power twist lock, and swap out machines in a few minutes - the whole thing weighing 1-2 tons or more. No forklifts, no hernias, can 'o corn.

And - not to beat a dead horse - but a lesson learned from those days: You look at a caster that costs $40, and you look at another of comparable dimensions that costs $18. If you buy the $18 caster, you did not save $22, you wasted $18 on an inferior product. In the long run, nobody ever saved money buying cheap casters/wheels, they simply threw their money away.

[Keith Avery]

RWM is an industrial caster maker. I have bought 7 or 8 sets at ridiculously low prices(3-8 bucks per casrer). The good deals seem to be on 3-6" casters rated from 300-1200lbs per caster. They are heavy, smooth, and will last many many years. Most of them have a grease zirk. Do a search for RWM casters and sort by price. Be vigilant as AMazon seems to change prices hourly. These casters are a little overkill but for the price you will not find anything close to the quality. I did end up learning a little more about casters thumbing through their 50+ page catalog than I ever wanted to but I tend to over analyze.

[Bruce Seidner]

Another trick/design that is overkill for this application, but might be of use to someone, someday: On the fixed leg end, there is a fixed stretcher somewhere around the midpoint of the legs. Then, there is a lower stretcher that has vertical sections attached to it, and this stretcher slides up and down on grooves/rails in the verticals and legs. There are two swivel casters attached to this lower "floating" stretcher.

And - the punch line - an inexpensive hand-operated hydraulic car jack is mounted to the movable stretcher. Pump the jack handle, and the jack's shaft pushes up against the fixed stretcher and the movable stretcher is forced down, causing the casters to lift the fixed legs off the floor. Very maneuverable with 2 fixed and 2 swivel casters, and extremely stable in operation.
.

This is what I have been working on but have had a hard time finding the right jacks. I don't do well drawing or conceptualizing. I usually need to have the parts in hand to see and feel how they work. Jacks make sense and I have plans for a cabinet that uses 4 scissor jacks that raise and lower either the casters or the cabinet itself which would be stable on the floor when down or free the wheels to roll when raised up and the weight on the casters. But I would prefer to use vice srews that sit in the table top and are flush below the top of the table of the cabinet. For instance I have been stumped trying to think of a way to make the stretcher or a leg raise and lower with a vice screw or a socket headed screw. The least expensive way to do this is to use a long .5" socket head screw. The head would be flush with the top of the table and a drill with a hex drive would raise and lower the leg or riser using the threaded rod that extended into a drilled out leg with a bolt or threaded sleeve secured in the leg. It would work the same way as a vice except I am unsure how to keep the screw in place. On a vice the screw has bolts behind and in front of the front plate. But on a table top the screw would have to remain flush and secured from beneath the top. When I think of a bolt beneath the table top I can't "see" how to prevent the head being cinched down tight or raising up above the surface of the table. I just want it to turn but can't see how to capture it so that it does not move up and down. I have been all over the McMaster catalog and can usually figure this out looking at the pictures of the parts. I don't see a way to capture the head of the screw unless I drilled out a hole for the socket head and then glued a plug over it with a hole for the hex wrench to fit down into the trapped head.

My floors are so uneven that I would like to have one adjustable leveling caster per corner and to be able to adjust them from the top. Or the casters would be attached to the frame and these stabilizing adjustable legs would push down to stabilize and level the cabinet or rise and allow the cabinet to rest on the casters. Sort of a reverse of your scheme but for an old home with uneven cement floors it would be great to have the legs adjustable and allow the casters to roll when moving and off the floor when the cabinet is in place and need to be stable And level.

How would one keep the head of the vice screw flush with the top and not rising or falling as it turned to raise and lower the stabilizing leg?

[Kent A Bathurst]

Bruce -

I think you may have gotten wrapped around the axle by trying to devise one solution to multiple, conflicting design points. You need to break your requirements down into separate tasks/functions and devise a solution for each. Here's one answer - someone else may well jump in with a better answer.

One requirement is to hold a bolt in place - up/down, to/fro - without engaging a threaded fastener/nut, but still allowing it to turn freely. The attachment shows a way to do that. You need a sleeve to hold the bolt in alignment to/fro, and you need nuts/washers to hold it in place up/down. Notice that the nuts do not engage as the bolt turns - they are locked against each other [with loctite for insurance], so that they hold the fender washers against the block, and the nuts rotate with the bolt while keeping the bolt in place vertically. My "sleeve" is a block of hardwood. You might be able to find some type of steel tube + flange to use instead.

Then at the "foot" end of the deal...I would have a stretcher very near the floor, or mounting blocks screwed to the legs. Get 4 leveling feet - the type where the post swivels for uneven surfaces. Put a tee-nut [same pitch and dia as the foot post] in the bottom side of the stretcher, and thread the foot's post up through the tee nut and all the way through the block/stretcher. Select your feet and your main bolts to have the same diameter and pitch. Use a rod coupling nut to splice the foot's post to the main bolt.

Abracadabra.

Turn the head of the main bolt, and it rotates freely in it's upper mounting block while the foot post is engaging the tee-nut in the foot mounting block.

I don't like doing work on top of swivel casters, nor on locking casters. This way, you can lift all four casters off the floor. I have heavy-duty leveling feet [from Grainger IIRC] under my bench, mounted with tee-nuts. Very stable. I don't recall what I paid for them, but I know I was a bit surprised at how much I had to pay. Cry once.

[Bruce Seidner]

Bruce -

I think you may have gotten wrapped around the axle by trying to devise one solution to multiple, conflicting design points. You need to break your requirements down into separate tasks/functions and devise a solution for each. Here's one answer - someone else may well jump in with a better answer.

One requirement is to hold a bolt in place - up/down, to/fro - without engaging a threaded fastener/nut, but still allowing it to turn freely. The attachment shows a way to do that. You need a sleeve to hold the bolt in alignment to/fro, and you need nuts/washers to hold it in place up/down. Notice that the nuts do not engage as the bolt turns - they are locked against each other [with loctite for insurance], so that they hold the fender washers against the block, and the nuts rotate with the bolt while keeping the bolt in place vertically. My "sleeve" is a block of hardwood. You might be able to find some type of steel tube + flange to use instead.

Then at the "foot" end of the deal...I would have a stretcher very near the floor, or mounting blocks screwed to the legs. Get 4 leveling feet - the type where the post swivels for uneven surfaces. Put a tee-nut [same pitch and dia as the foot post] in the bottom side of the stretcher, and thread the foot's post up through the tee nut and all the way through the block/stretcher. Select your feet and your main bolts to have the same diameter and pitch. Use a rod coupling nut to splice the foot's post to the main bolt.

Abracadabra.

Turn the head of the main bolt, and it rotates freely in it's upper mounting block while the foot post is engaging the tee-nut in the foot mounting block.

I don't like doing work on top of swivel casters, nor on locking casters. This way, you can lift all four casters off the floor. I have heavy-duty leveling feet [from Grainger IIRC] under my bench, mounted with tee-nuts. Very stable. I don't recall what I paid for them, but I know I was a bit surprised at how much I had to pay. Cry once.

Ken,

We are in fact singing off the same sheet of music. I want to be able to raise and lower the leveling feet independently because of my uneven floors and get completely off the casters. I ran an 18 foot bench down one wall of the garage to the back end corner. I set the wall supports level to earth gravity via a bubble level and then set the outside support beam level and square to the wall supports and one fixed leg for the one non-wall end of the outside beam. The distance from this outside support beam varies up and down as much as 4" at various points between the outside beam to the floor. One hears measure twice cut once. Well in my garage it is measure constantly and don't cut until you have checked the specific point at which you want to place a joint. There is not a level or square point to point anywhere. Old homes with hand laid block and likely wheel barrels of cement on the floor in individual sections does not add up to much consistency.

That said, I had hand drawn essentially the same sketch that you have provided. I had a less elegant sleeve and thank you for cleaning it up considerably for me. I will go to the hardware store and get the materials to create this science project and likely "get it" when I build a model of it. I think I can see how it is the cabinet that moves up and down on the rod now. Though it is funny. I added up the costs of the materials for this approach and it is likely more expensive than using scissor jacks. I have found that I can even dispense with the costs of the leveling feet because of one of those "tips" columns in a magazine that uses discarded hockey pucks as the base of the foot and a threaded rod or a bolt epoxied into it. But threaded rods etc, come to over $25 per leg. With the scissor jacks I loose more internal space, but get the advantage of the mechanical levers for what may end up being a heavy bench style cabinet. The smallest, least expensive I can find are 1 ton scissor jacks at about $20 a piece and could be mounted in all 4 corners. Using plain rods with eyelets to the front of the cabinet they can be turned with a drill. I am just more partial to the use of the socket head bolts and adjusting from the top. If there were more level floors and I did not need to move this cabinet about every time I wanted to use it all this fuss would be ludicrous. But the fact is every time I move it will require that it be checked for level and be re-leveled given my floors. I would prefer not to be on my hands and knees with a wrench going at leveling nuts on such a regular basis. I have also thought the heck with all the Rube Goldberg and just find the two places where this large cabinet may go in the garage, mark the four pads that would align with the legs and hammer them out, pour new concrete in these pads and know that the cabinet would be aligned and level when placed there. It is fortunate that this is a hobby. There is nothing practical about this. Thank you for your generosity of spirit and capacity to use a computer drawing program.

[Kent A Bathurst]

The scissors jacks would be too clumsy. Functional, but inelegant. You're gonna live with this for a long time, so make it fun. That's my approach, anyway. I like solutions that no one else would have been likely to come up with.

I liked your concept of the bench-top-level bolt heads........plus, based on how I felt this morning, I have to assume I had way too much "fun" at dinner with the neighbors last night, so your post gave me something to do to reboot the mental processes this morning........I'll have to make the rounds of the neighbors later on and see what I might have done/said that requires an apology...........

[Bruce Seidner]

I may be inventing a solution for an imagined problem.

My only experience with casters has been with what is on the bottom of a small Craftsman tool cab I own and the $50 mobile base I purchased from Woodcraft. Well, that and what I have seen at Borgs and Harbor Freight. I had some time this afternoon and went to our local Northern Tool and got to see some of the better casters they sell. There are these 5x2" and 6x2" scaffloding casters that lock, and I mean lock, both the wheel and the swivel. They are cast iron with thin poly-something tires and they are beast. So clearly there is another level of industrial caster that I have only seen in pictures. These things are inspiring. A large cast iron total locking caster is something to try first. For the uneven areas of my floor I will mark the spots that require a foot square pad of rubber covered hardboard or ply to raise the corner of the cabinet to level. I am going to need wheels in any event because my experiments driving the pallet jacks were not all that successful. I was banging into all kinds of things as I tried my hand at backing up, turning, and even going straight. I don't think they would give me a learners permit. Should I go the route of the top adjusted leveling feet I will be sure to share the photos and figure out a way to get some suitable beverage down to Atlanta so you can have something to toast with. Hair of the dog, and all after your celebratory evening last night. Thank you for your inspiring assistance.

[Steven Lee, NC]

I try and get the lowest wheel height for my tables on wheels for maximum storage space under the table. As long as they are specced for the weight.

[Brian Backner]

I have added casters to various tools and benches over the years with varying degrees of success. Larger wheels are definitely easier to move, especially as the tool gets heavier.

A couple of years ago, I got a really big planer - a Crescent P24. The thing is a beast, weighing somewhere north of 3,000#. I nearly choked when I saw what casters for such a creature would cost. So, I came up with another way.

I am tall at 6'3", so I've raised all my machines so they are comfortable for me while I work. I've found through trial and error that this may be anywhere from 4 to 6". So, what I did with the Crescent was to bolt it to two pieces of 4x4" x 1/4" thick walled steel tubing. I had also put some adjustable leveling feet at the four corners, giving me a total of about 5" under the planer's base - this is more than enough for standard pallet jack to fit under.

It worked so well that I'm converting all my machines over to similar bases. Some of the smaller machines will not accommodate a standard pallet jack (27" wide over the two legs), but they do make special narrow pallet jacks that are only 20" wide.

You can usually pick up pallet jacks off of Craigslist for $100 or so and I pick up all the steel tubing I use at the local salvage yard and paint it with Rustoleum Rusty Metal Primer and whatever top coat color I happen to have around. Considering that a set of casters for the Crescent would have cost me over $200, I consider myself ahead of the game.

Cheers,

Brian
Taxachusetts