What a good thing!

[Ken Fitzgerald]

I am down to milling two pieces of trim molding, installing them, sanding and finishing the oak entertainment center I started in July.

I sanded some drawers and then the top of the entertainment center and the dust was a killer. I used both air cleaners. Then I started wondering.

Using a reducer, some 2" flex hose and a hose clamp, I removed the bag from my Dewalt ROS and attached the ROS to my DC. What a difference. I will pitch that little bag tomorrow. I can sand with almost no dust. Standing beside a make-shift table sanding for two hours....a little dust on thighs.....nothing on my hands...nothing in the air.

Now I am trying to design a way of hooking the 2" or 3" hose to my belt sander.

[Rod Sheridan]

Yes Ken, it's amazing how well that works.

I did that for years, however it does clog the filter on my cyclone faster than other machines, so I bought a good shop vacuum (Festool Midi) and now don't use the cyclone for collecting sanding dust.

Regards, Rod.

[Harry Hagan]

When weather permits, situating yourself between a window or doorway and a carpet/floor blower like this one makes sanding a breeze—pun intended. No worries about inhaling dust, monitoring your progress, or working up a sweat.


207519

[Will Blick]

I now only use Festool sanders, as they are designed from the start, for dust collection.... if anyone is concerned about dust, all their sanders are incredible. If doing a lot of hand power sanding, I also use a dust down draft portable unit, which grabs any remaining dust.... with the two, no need for dust mask.... without the downdraft table, I still wear a dust mask, because although there appears no dust, a dust meter indicates otherwise....

[Jerome Hanby]

I may be able to swing buying a Festool sander/vacuum combo soon. Any suggestion on which sander model is the best for a first (and only for quite a while) Festool purchase. I currently use a Dewalt ROS fro the vast majority of my sanding...


I now only use Festool sanders, as they are designed from the start, for dust collection.... if anyone is concerned about dust, all their sanders are incredible. If doing a lot of hand power sanding, I also use a dust down draft portable unit, which grabs any remaining dust.... with the two, no need for dust mask.... without the downdraft table, I still wear a dust mask, because although there appears no dust, a dust meter indicates otherwise....

[Will Blick]

Jerome.... its best you ask this question on a Festool forum where these guys are EXPERTS at every Festool sander made, and they sure make a lot of them.....

In general, you want to match the sander to the type of work you do. First is the size of the work, that dictates the size of the pad, next is the type of work.... paint removal, rough sanding, fine sanding, etc. This dictates what stroke is best.... wide strokes produce more noticeable patterns using the same grit. You can really get caught up in all this, and often there is many sanders that will fit the bill.... for me, I have learned that trying to have a perfect sander for every task is a bit overkill.... as getting close to final smoothness and then using a few swipes with a card scraper negates much of the variances at the "fine" level. I marvel how card scraping is not a normal part of the sanding process....its a small tool with little profit, but does BIG things at the end of a sanding job. and very quickly...

as a general rule, most people start out with the Rotex sanders, as these sanders are the only ones that have two modes, both coarse and fine. They are prob. the most popular of all the sanders. they come in 150, 125, 90mm diameters. The smaller the sander, the smaller the stroke. I have the 125 and 90, and can honestly say, I am hooked, will never buy another make of sander. The dust collection is legendary, specially when paired with their vacs. Any vac can suck, but their vacs don't discharge the invisible micron particles back into the air, they have the largest HEPA filter I have ever seen on any VAC. I know they are costly, but I have never read a thread where anyone regretted the purchase. They also offer money back 30 day assurance of satisfaction. Also, the Festool line-up of sand paper is amazingly impressive, and reasonably priced as well..... jump on the FOG forum and you will get many opinions, just be sure to describe the type of work you do most, to get the best responses. If you go through with the purchase, be sure to report back to us :-)

oh, one warning.... as they say on the FOG forum, once you drink the GREEN Koolaide, its a slippery slope....I learned this the hard way.... so you have been forewarned...

[Mike Henderson]

I have a Ridgid shop vac connected to my sander and find it works great. The Ridgid vac I bought has noise reduction technology and it really works - much quieter than a ShopVac (brand) unit I also have. Plus the Ridgid has a number of nice features that the ShopVac doesn't have - it has bags designed for it, the hose has a latching mechanism to keep it from being pulled out, it has an outlet port in case you want to use it as a blower (inexplicably, the Shop Vac does not), and it's a lot quieter. Performance wise, they're probably the same, capacity wise, they're about the same, and they cost about the same. The Ridgid is a much better product, in my opinion.

Mike

[Will Blick]

Mike, I own several Borg Shop Vacs, I use them for all different tasks.... Interestingly enough, when I test the CFM of the Borg Vacs, they actually pull more air than the mega costly Festool Vacs.... yep, no doubt about it.... But their is a reason for this.... the greater the filtration the greater the loss of vacuum pressure. So fine particles spew out of the back of the Borg vacs, and its these fine particles, as per Bill Pentz web site, that are so injurious to our lungs, and being invisible makes us have a false sense of security. Hence why I jumped on the dust sensor offering this forum assembled a few years ago, I learned what I could not see via the meter.

So for tasks where breathing dust is not an issue, I use the Borg Vacs all the time, such as vacuuming my car / RV, or clean up outside, etc. However, when confined in the shop, and sanding (the ultimate in fine dust generation) I use a mix of the Festool Vac/Sander and I move air through the shop....if I will be sanding for hours, and the pieces are not too big I add the Delta down draft table, with 4" port hooked into my Clear Vue Cyclone. It might seem obsessive, but I never want to take my health for granted again. The Bill Pentz story should be mandatory reading for anyone entering our hobby....after digesting his information, we can all make choices about what matters most....the problem is, most ww's were never educated on the risks of fine dust... I was one of them, but once I learned, I have altered everything I do in the shop.

On the matter of dust collection and tools... I also fell in love with the Festool Plunge saws not only due to straight cuts, but amazing dust collection

[Jerome Hanby]

I've already slid a ways down that slope, I've got the track and jig saws and won't voluntarily use any others. I kind of assumed if I asked in the Festool forum the response I would get would be something like get all of them :D

So you think it's worth the extra cash to get a Rotex over the 125EQ or 150/3 EQ? I'm typically sanding to get ready to put on a finish (guess that's finish sanding). If I've got something major to work out, I typically switch to a courser grit, or if it's bad enough get out the belt sander. I've got some crappy detail sanders and they pretty much stay in their boxes...


Jerome.... its best you ask this question on a Festool forum where these guys are EXPERTS at every Festool sander made, and they sure make a lot of them.....

In general, you want to match the sander to the type of work you do. First is the size of the work, that dictates the size of the pad, next is the type of work.... paint removal, rough sanding, fine sanding, etc. This dictates what stroke is best.... wide strokes produce more noticeable patterns using the same grit. You can really get caught up in all this, and often there is many sanders that will fit the bill.... for me, I have learned that trying to have a perfect sander for every task is a bit overkill.... as getting close to final smoothness and then using a few swipes with a card scraper negates much of the variances at the "fine" level. I marvel how card scraping is not a normal part of the sanding process....its a small tool with little profit, but does BIG things at the end of a sanding job. and very quickly...

as a general rule, most people start out with the Rotex sanders, as these sanders are the only ones that have two modes, both coarse and fine. They are prob. the most popular of all the sanders. they come in 150, 125, 90mm diameters. The smaller the sander, the smaller the stroke. I have the 125 and 90, and can honestly say, I am hooked, will never buy another make of sander. The dust collection is legendary, specially when paired with their vacs. Any vac can suck, but their vacs don't discharge the invisible micron particles back into the air, they have the largest HEPA filter I have ever seen on any VAC. I know they are costly, but I have never read a thread where anyone regretted the purchase. They also offer money back 30 day assurance of satisfaction. Also, the Festool line-up of sand paper is amazingly impressive, and reasonably priced as well..... jump on the FOG forum and you will get many opinions, just be sure to describe the type of work you do most, to get the best responses. If you go through with the purchase, be sure to report back to us :-)

oh, one warning.... as they say on the FOG forum, once you drink the GREEN Koolaide, its a slippery slope....I learned this the hard way.... so you have been forewarned...

[Jerome Hanby]

Which model Ridgid, Mike? I've been looking at the 1450 to replace my Shopvac, but if you have found a quieter model, then I'm all ears <g>


I have a Ridgid shop vac connected to my sander and find it works great. The Ridgid vac I bought has noise reduction technology and it really works - much quieter than a ShopVac (brand) unit I also have. Plus the Ridgid has a number of nice features that the ShopVac doesn't have - it has bags designed for it, the hose has a latching mechanism to keep it from being pulled out, it has an outlet port in case you want to use it as a blower (inexplicably, the Shop Vac does not), and it's a lot quieter. Performance wise, they're probably the same, capacity wise, they're about the same, and they cost about the same. The Ridgid is a much better product, in my opinion.

Mike

[Will Blick]

I kind of assumed if I asked in the Festool forum the response I would get would be something like get all of them :D

Ok, you got a valid point there!!!!


So you think it's worth the extra cash to get a Rotex over the 125EQ or 150/3 EQ? I'm typically sanding to get ready to put on a finish (guess that's finish sanding). If I've got something major to work out, I typically switch to a courser grit, or if it's bad enough get out the belt sander. I've got some crappy detail sanders and they pretty much stay in their boxes...


Your asking the right question here.... most people would prob. say the 150/3 would be more ideal for finish sanding only, if you need that size... the 125 has an even smaller stroke, I think 2 mm.... I was thinking of adding this sander as well...the only reason I have not is because I can't fathom how I can do any better vs. what I am getting now with the Rotex for a finish. This is where I think the sanders can cross territory. Many of the benefits of the non rotex sanders are outside the sanding area, such as lighter weight, for over head work, or long hours holding sander.

[Thomas Hotchkin]

Ken
When I got my Onida dust collection system, it came with a Dust Deputy as a gift. With it hooked to my shop vacuum, it picks up almost all sanding dust. I have yet to replace vacuum's dust bag or clean it filter. With a switch controlled electrical outlet (Sears), when I turn on my ROS it turn on vacuum. Sweet setup. Tom

[Alan Lightstone]

I would get the Festool 150/3EQ over the Rotex. I have both and use the 150/3EQ for the vast majority of my work. The Rotex is a beast. It can hog off wood, but it's a two-handed machine for sure. Very tiring for prolonged use. It's rare I find I need the Rotex coarse mode. I've found similar comments from many other users.

Definitely check out the Festool board for members with tons of experience using all of them. They are reasonable there, just as people are reasonable here. Which is nice to be able to say.

Then pull the trigger on the purchase and enjoy.

[Phil Thien]

I use a Porter Cable sander, along with their special 1" hose, and connect it to my separator via my shop-vac network.

Not much dust escapes.

I think the sander was about $50, the hose another $15.

[Paul McGaha]

I use something similar Phil.

I bought a Porter Cable 6" ROS Kit that came with a fitting and hose that will fit that tool and also my Porter Cable belt sander.

I use it with a shop vac. It does get most of it. Probably not as good as a Festool (I wouldnt know) but it works pretty well. I'd say it gets 90 % or better of the dust.

PHM


I use a Porter Cable sander, along with their special 1" hose, and connect it to my separator via my shop-vac network.

Not much dust escapes.

I think the sander was about $50, the hose another $15.

[Phil Thien]

I use something similar Phil.

I bought a Porter Cable 6" ROS Kit that came with a fitting and hose that will fit that tool and also my Porter Cable belt sander.

I use it with a shop vac. It does get most of it. Probably not as good as a Festool (I wouldnt know) but it works pretty well. I'd say it gets 90 % or better of the dust.

PHM

I can't imagine how a Festool would work any better. Holes in paper, check. Holes in pad, check. Holes in pad lined up with holes in paper, check. Hose connected to sander, check.

I'm not sure what a Festool could do that would be any different.

[Larry Edgerton]

I use a Porter Cable vac that is designed to use with their drywall sanding system. It is quiet, the hose is long, it has an easily replaced secondary filter that can be bought at an automotive parts store and has a switched outlet. It costs about half of what a Fein/Festool costs and mine has been working well for many years now.

May not be quite as good as a Fein/Festool but is much more affordable and being designed for use with drywall dust is very efficient.

Larry

[Jerome Hanby]

I like that recommendation...and not just because the Woodcraft price is five dollars less than the face value of the gift card I got yesterday. Plus, my wife told me I need to buy something for the shop around the end of the month, so I can grab a Festool vacuum and maybe lay off the kool-aid for awhile. Although I've been lusting after one of their routers...I think I'll try one of those dust collection bases one of the magazines reviewed...


I would get the Festool 150/3EQ over the Rotex. I have both and use the 150/3EQ for the vast majority of my work. The Rotex is a beast. It can hog off wood, but it's a two-handed machine for sure. Very tiring for prolonged use. It's rare I find I need the Rotex coarse mode. I've found similar comments from many other users.

Definitely check out the Festool board for members with tons of experience using all of them. They are reasonable there, just as people are reasonable here. Which is nice to be able to say.

Then pull the trigger on the purchase and enjoy.

[Harlan Barnhart]

For what its worth, the shop where I work has both Festool and Fein sanders. I always use the Fein because of the superior dust collection. The Festool is more comfortable but I prefer less dust.

[Pat Barry]

I have used my Dewalt ROS with a Shopvac for years - it works great. I use it for my drywall sanding and what a difference that amkes. Of course if I knew how to do the joint compound properly there wouldn't be much sanding, but I can't get the knack for that so sanding with the ROS makes it easy and clean.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

I have used my Dewalt ROS with a Shopvac for years - it works great. I use it for my drywall sanding and what a difference that amkes. Of course if I knew how to do the joint compound properly there wouldn't be much sanding, but I can't get the knack for that so sanding with the ROS makes it easy and clean.

Here I thought I was the only one joint compound challenged!:eek::rolleyes:

[Derrell W Sloan]

Which model Ridgid, Mike? I've been looking at the 1450 to replace my Shopvac, but if you have found a quieter model, then I'm all ears <g>

Jerome, I recently got the Ridgid 1450 to replace an older Ridgid that died on me. The noise difference between the two is substantial. The 1450 is so much quieter that I don't feel the need to wear hearing protection like I did with the older shopvac. HD had a noise rating on all of their shopvacs in the store and the 1450 was listed as the quietest of the bunch. I also picked up one of the mufflers HD sells. It reduces the noise a tad but the biggest benefit is it disperses the exhaust so you don't get a jet stream blowing out the back, and it doesn't seem to noticeably reduce the suction any.

[Jerome Hanby]

Thanks for the information! HD's beta store inventory doesn't show a 1450 in stock in the Birmingham area, but it looks like free shipping if I order. If there really isn't one at my local store, I'll be placing an order. Still gong after a Festool for the saws and (soon to be) sanders, but I think that Ridgid will make a good shop fixture mounted on a cart with my dust deputy. I roll my planer and router table outside whenever possible and it should make a good collector for those as well as general shop clean up.


Jerome, I recently got the Ridgid 1450 to replace an older Ridgid that died on me. The noise difference between the two is substantial. The 1450 is so much quieter that I don't feel the need to wear hearing protection like I did with the older shopvac. HD had a noise rating on all of their shopvacs in the store and the 1450 was listed as the quietest of the bunch. I also picked up one of the mufflers HD sells. It reduces the noise a tad but the biggest benefit is it disperses the exhaust so you don't get a jet stream blowing out the back, and it doesn't seem to noticeably reduce the suction any.

[Mark Engel]

I just got the Ridgid WD1680 to replace an old Craftsman wet/dry vac. It is the 16 gallon model, but very similar to the 1450. I also got the noise reducer and the 5 layer hepa filter.

This vacuum is so much quieter than either the Craftsman or the ShopVac Hang-Up. I have been using the ShopVac attached directly to a PC ros, mainly because the 1-1/4 hose fits the dc connection on the sander. I recently picked up some very flexible 2-1/2" vacuum hose and the new ClearVue CV06, so I will be figuring out how to use that set-up with the sander.

[Paul Johnstone]

Congratulations on almost finishing a project.
I agree that a shop vac might be better than a regular DC here (due to the small outlet of the sander), but you are right.. those little bags are useless.