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View Full Version : To get a Chinese Laser or US Laser, that is the question



Khalid Nazim
09-03-2011, 8:14 PM
I know that there has been a lot written on the comparison between Lasers from China and lasers from mainstream laser suppliers in the US. I recently had discussions with sales reps from EPILOG and GCC who told me not go for the chinese lasers due to the inferior quality of the laser tubes being used by them. They mentioned that their machines lasers from Synrad which not only last longers (more than 5000 hours compared to less than 600 on the CO2 lasers) but they cut and engrave better than the Chinese lasers.

How true are these two claims?

And while we are on the subject, what is a RECI Laser and is it better than the regular CO2 laser.

I thought that I had made my decision to buy a chinese laser as the price was incredible. When I mentioned the price to the EPILOG/GCC sales rep, they mentioned that why should I buy the machine when I can lease their machines for a few hunderd dollars a month.

This is really confusing and I need help :(

Regards
Khalid

Jim Reinhard
09-03-2011, 9:33 PM
I would look at GCC also.I am very happy with my new mercury so far.They are not made in usa but the laser tubes are synrad and made in usa . They are usualy in stock ship from california.No waiting a month for them to build it for you. I got a price that was less than uls and epilog, but more than china ones.I guess you call it middle ground.They have great features like smart center and pass troug doors for long stuff.My rep is a great help and answers my Questions quick.PM me if you want my reps info.

John Noell
09-03-2011, 10:57 PM
Khalid, welcome to the 'creek. Be sure to read Rodney Gold's post on Chinese lasers here (http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?166611-Chinese-lasers-they-re-here-%21%21%21&p=1710013#poststop). Just how long ANY tubes last is a good question. There are a lot of variables. That said, the most expensive (e.g., frm Synrad or Coherant) typically seem to last longer than the Chinese tubes (with the RECI being the lost expensive and longest lasting of the Chinese ones). When it comes down to "how many dollars per month of tube life", the answers are very hard to determine. Typically, the big brands have better support, better build quality, and maybe better software support - which may or may not matter to your specidic use. For my first laser I chose a used (with warranty) Epilog as I am a long way from anyopne who knows about lasers and I depend on it for my business. When it comes to a replacement, I am not sure which way I will go.

Rich Harman
09-04-2011, 1:17 AM
Also look at this (http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?170732-Lasers-do-you-get-what-you-pay-for&p=1757099&highlight=#post1757099) thread for a quality comparison.

Rodne Gold
09-04-2011, 3:37 AM
Short answer : if you a newbie and need spoon feeding and handolding , get a mainstream laser
If you are prepared to fiddle around a bit and go thru a slightly steeper learning curve : go for a chinese laser at 1/4- 1/5th of the price.
Pointless even doing the comparison if you dont have the wherewithall to afford a good mainstream , if you want to get into lasering you have to go "cheap"
My chinese and mainstreams work just as well as each other , tho my chinese machines are a little slower at engraving. My staff prefer to work on the chinese machines as they are easier to use and quicker cutting etc.
The mainstream suppliers will always rubbish the chinese machines as they are a HUGE threat to them.
Forget 20 000 hours outa a mainstream tube , all of mine , and I have had many , have never given me more that 3 yrs service , 1400 hrs a year (7 a day x 200 days). No idea how long my stock and reci tube will last , time will tell, tho at $170 and $400 a tube , its a painless replacement vs the $3500 odd for a "mainstream" tube.
Choice is yours!!.. read the threads to make it an educated choice.
"despatches from china"
and
"chinese lasers , they are here!!!"

Read vincent de klerks thread and do other searches for chinese , you will find all the stories there
Other forums also have references , like cnc zone and there is even a forum for support of chinese lasers

Vicki Rivrud
09-04-2011, 9:17 AM
Great response, Rodney! Especially since you have both types.

I love my Chinese laser and it is still running and running very well after all these years.

These forums are what got me through the tough learning curve and I still continue to learn new tips & techniques. Years ago someone here told me to know my equipment like I know my boyfriend, partner, whatever. Best advice I got and I crawled all over my machine and pretty much know each part and what it does, how to replace it and where to get it.

A Chinese warranty will expire before you know it.

The Chinese laser is not for the faint of heart! Keep in mind that support and correspondance will be sparse and almost unintelligible until you figure out what they are trying to tell you and sometimes the "Sales people" haven't a clue & then there is the time differance, which can play havoc when something goes amiss.

Your equipment is half the battle the other half is technique and file preparation & software.

Do your research and start reading in the forums to get a head start.

Happy lasering,
Vicki

David Fairfield
09-04-2011, 9:45 AM
I guess I would add a personal opinion. When I'm in the market for a newer, bigger more powerful laser, I'll buy another American one. I have not used a Chinese laser, so this is just one man's opinion.

I use a few Chinese hand and power tools in my shop, they are inexpensive and mostly very good value for the $. However, with every one of them, there is some darn thing that should be better, or just isn't right. I use them a lot, but for rough, fast jobs. For precision work I turn to American/European equipment every time. This goes for simple hand tools, to power tools.

So just based on that general comparison, I believe a US made laser will give me better performance, especially at the edge of the operating envelope. That is so important for the work I do, I won't take a risk on a Chinese laser. If I could actually experiment with one, hands on, I may have a different opinion. But I would be real surprised if a Chinese laser could consistently and reliably match what I can do with an Epilog.

As far as costs go, I would also consider the price of a used American vs new Chinese. My 2006 Epilog runs as good as new, still on the original tube, with about a 5% decrease in power output. So if the price were right, and I had strong indication the previous owner followed maintenance procedure, I would not hesitate to buy a used Epilog. I believe you can call up the Tech department and get some sort of history of the machine. So check that out too.

HTH
Dave

Khalid Nazim
09-07-2011, 11:15 AM
Thanks everyone for your replies. Having read all that's posted on this subject, I realized that my decision needs to be based on what I can afford and for me that is a Chinese Laser. I am a complete newbie in this business but I plan to go through a detailed training program to learn the machine thoroughly. I am also banking on the ever present support and help available on Sawmill Creek :)

Regards
Khalid

Uros Sovilj
09-23-2011, 4:47 AM
Hi

I bought Chinese laser few month ago and must say i am pleased to do that. I was totaly newbie, infact i newer saw laser machine before. Machine work great. If i compare my products with other made by leading machine brand there is no difference. I had some problems but were quick solved via skype with their tech support. Can't tell you about tube life time since i still use first i got with machine but with price for spare one i belive that cost per hour is still lower than with brand name one.

One of things that made my mind to go with Chinese was thought that if buissines go well i can still by one of expencive machine for better quality and use Chinesse as spare one and if i can't brake throuh on market i will lose few times less than if i bought an expencive on on start. Now i don't regret purchase since everything works great.


Regards

Mike Null
09-23-2011, 8:14 AM
My Trotec is now in it's 6th year without the first service issue or parts replacement. My tube has well over 7,000 hours on it and I have the peace of mind to know that when I turn it on it's going to work as I want it to.

Chinese machines are certainly tempting but I would go back to Trotec if I were buying another.

Michael Hunter
09-23-2011, 9:38 AM
I agree with everything Rodney has said - do read all his posts.

The tube in my Epilog is beginning to fail and will cost a LOT to have fixed. Can't afford the new Trotec that I would really like, so went to look at a Chinese made system. Bear in mind that I am comparing a brand new, good quality, Chinese model to a 7-year old Epilog. Here is my take on it ....

The engraving quality was generally OK - acceptable but nothing special.
The power regulation to the tube was not up to scratch, leading to problems on anodised aluminium.
Setting up for a job took much longer than for my Epilog, and focusing was a bit hit-and-miss.
Engraving was very much slower (even with the same power tube). Cutting was the same speed or perhaps a bit faster.
There is no attempt to get a laminar flow of exhaust air across the job, so more cleaning up needed after engraving.

So -

For business use doing the same or similar things day after day on a non-critical material, then the Chinese job would be a great buy.

For a typical jobbing shop (like mine) where each job is completely different and where quality really counts, then a Chinese laser would be a pain.

For hobby use, the low cost of the Chinese machines outweighs almost everything else.

The glass tubes won't last as long, but yearly replacement at a few hundred ££ ($$) is probably better than getting landed with a HUGE bill later on.
(This assumes that you can change the tube yourself - getting a man in to do it for you would change the economics drastically).
Other spares are very much cheaper too - motors, motherboards etc. at a fraction of the cost.


The LaserSketch software (common to many makes of Chinese lasers) has some real advantages over the "printer driver" route taken by the mainstream Western makers. For myself though, I like the way that anything I draw in Corel comes out just right (WYSIWYG) without any pratting about.