LN Low Angle Block Plane or Veritas version

[Michael Ballent]

I am about to take the plunge and get my first plane. I am looking at the LV/Veritas low angle block plane or the LN low angle block plane. Anyone here ever compare the two? The LV seems to be on back order but I can get the LN locally anything particular features set one above the other. I have heard that they are both pretty highly regarded, so I do not think that either one is a bad choice. Just want to get your opinions.

[Mark Singer]

I have the LN 102 and their 60 1/2...both low angle. I love them both!

[Doug Shepard]

I can't give you a comparison. I only have the LN and I love it. If you do end up going with LN, check this site out before you buy. They've got the lowest LN prices I've been able to find.
http://www.finetoolj.com/ln/home.html

[Tom Scott]

I have the same two LN block planes that mark does. They are fantastic tools.
On the other hand, I have never heard anything remotely critical (besides appearance, which some don't like) about the Veritas tools. But, I can't compare.

Tom

[John Weber]

Michael,

I actually don't own a LN LA Block, but I have a 103, and several bench planes. LN's in general are joy to own and use. I have both a 102 and a 60-1/2 on my list. I've handled the Veritas, and they are nice and a very good value, but the LN's are just wonderful. I don't think you can go wrong, but if it were me I would pay a bit more for the LN. I have several Veritas shoulder planes and scrapers and feel they make a quality product.

John

P.S. Fine Tool Journal is an excellent source for LN planes...

[John Miliunas]

Afraid I can't give a comparison, either. BUT, the LN is near and dear to my heart, as the 102 was my first real hand plane purchase.:) I have a couple LV's and they too are fine planes, but there's just something about those LN's!:) :cool:

[Corvin Alstot]

I have not tried the Veritas either but both will serve you well.
I have the LN 102 and its a great little tool.

[Steven Wilson]

I have the LN LowAngle Adjustable Mouth Block plane and it's fantastic. I have a bunch of other LN planes but that one gets used the most. It's also a very rugged plane, I've droped mine a couple of times on to concrete and it's survived. It's a great plane at an OK price.

[Jim Becker]

I have the LN low angle adjustable mouth block plane and wouldn't give it up for twice the price I paid for it!! But the LV has a lot of good comments and is also worthy of consideration.

[Michael Ballent]

Wow, Seems like everyone loves their LN planes... So anyone out there have a LV/Veritas version, looks like the LV is getting beaten up. I did not mention this but I am looking for the 60 1/2 version from either company.

[Mark Singer]

The 60 1/2 LN is a classic....almost every furniture maker , Finish carpenter,I know locally here has one!

[Kevin Brown]

Ok Michael, I'll be the odd ball here, I use the LV (http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&p=32685&cat=1,41182) and have been quite pleased with it, and theres no doubt the bronze beauties are nice, but if someone wanted to trade plane for plane I'd keep mine because it's what I'm use to.

Bottom line, there is no right answer, you can't go wrong with either one. If your the type of guy that has to have matching planes from the same manufacture than go with the LN they have a wider selection for your future purchases :D because THERE will be FUTURE PURCHASES!! :D :eek: :D

[James Mittlefehldt]

I have the Lee Valley Veritas low angle block plane with the adjustable throat and frankly I wouldn't trade it for the pretty bronze ones. I am sure they are excellent planes but I suspect that they are at the end of the day no better than the Lee Valley.

It comes down to what do you want personally, I have used my poor little Veritas for everything under the sun and it always delivers, I cannot say enough good about it, and there is of course a bit of a discrepancy in the price as well.

I am sure whatever you buy you will like it very much but the Veritas deserves serious consideration.

I should add to all you other lads I sent an E-Mail to Lee VAlley yesterday asking about their Primus scrub plane, I did not want to buy it if they in fact are coming out with a Veritas scrub plane in the near future. They answered me today and said they are indeed bringing out a scrub plane sometime this year but they were unable to give a firm date or price yet, there is something else a lot of you will just have to have.

[Kevin Brown]

Hey James,

Thanks for the heads up on the scrub plane!

[Jim DeLaney]

Another vote for the Lee Valley. I have both the LA block plane and the 'apron plane.' I like them both. For about the price of one LN, you can buy them both, too.

[Mike Holbrook]

I think the LV, LA Jack plane back order problem is no more, I received mine the end of last week. I also can not say enough good things about LV and their planes. I have the LV, LA Block plane too and their excellent shoulder and scraper planes are high on my list. I like the LV plane iron adjustment feature better. I imagine the "old timers" will tell you the old system is just is good, but I think the LV system is easier for a new user to grasp and get good results with. The reviewers seem to like the LV system too.

The LV is a little larger plane 15" to the LN 14". The LV blade is 2 1/4" vs 2" for the LN. Although I have not used the LN I have heard some who have used both state that the LV is a little more versatile than the LN which may be important in your first plane.

[Louis Bois]

I also have both the LV low angle and apron plane and I must say that they've been berry berry good to me. I think the weight of the LV is a bit more than the LN, so if that's an issue you may want to think about it. I agree that the looks of the LV aren't "traditional" by any means, but that's quickly forgotten once you see those end grain shavings.

There's no subsitute for first hand experience though...and if you have an opportunity to handle either of them, I highly recommend it. Having said that, you can't go wrong with either one.

Good luck!

[Tom McMahon]

At the bottom of your original post it says "Which gloves should I buy to box like Ali" The answer is, if you can box like Ali it doesn't matter which gloves you buy. The answer to your plane question is the same. It also depends on what you do. I have a 10 dollar true value hardware plane I use on green treated lumber when building decks, tuned up it works fine for that, but I don't use it to make fine furniture. Somtimes I think we spend to much time worrying about what tools we need next and not enough worrying about what we make with them. I'm just as guilty as the next guy. I probably have close to a hundred planes and I like them all.

[John Dingman]

I have the LV Apron plane and I like it a lot. Great size and a real good little worker. I am considering the LN 60 1/2 or the LV LA Block Plane next, so I am glad you brought this topic up.

John

[Tom LaRussa]

I am about to take the plunge and get my first plane. I am looking at the LV/Veritas low angle block plane or the LN low angle block plane. Anyone here ever compare the two? The LV seems to be on back order but I can get the LN locally anything particular features set one above the other. I have heard that they are both pretty highly regarded, so I do not think that either one is a bad choice. Just want to get your opinions.
Michael,

Let me show you how a master of tool-logic would go about making this decision.

First, I start with the proposition that I need a good block plane. [fn1]

Looking around, I see that for just $65 I can get a Veritas Apron Plane. http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&p=41189&cat=1,41182

But, looking a bit further, I see that for just another nine dollars I can get a cast-iron Lie-Nielsen block plane. http://www.lie-nielsen.com/tool.html?id=102

BUT, I thinks to myself, LN would not make its planes in bronze were it not better than cast iron, and the bronze is, after all, only $20 more at $95. http://www.lie-nielsen.com/tool.html?id=102

Golly though, it sure would be nice to be able to adjust the mouth, and for just a few dollars more I can get the Veritas Standard or Low Angle, either of which is adjustable. http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&p=32685&cat=1,41182 http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&p=47881&cat=1,41182

But gosh, I really want to make the right decision and get the best possible tool that I can hand down to my great-great-grand children. Maybe I should just pony up a few more bucks and get one of the LN adjustable mouth blocks for $150? http://www.lie-nielsen.com/tool.html?id=60_5 And while I'm at it, I guess I really should get a holster too, since I don't want the little dear to be damaged. And they are only another $35 after all.

But jeepers, $185 is quite a bit of money to spend for one small plane.

Sheesh, for the same money I could get the Veritas Standard (adjustable) as well as the Veritas apron plane, (not adjustable, but low angle for end grain).

Oh it's a tough one for sure.

What to do, what to do, what to do?

I guess I really can't say, since in this case it's actually your decision rather than mine.

But for sure you obviously must get one of the following:

[1] an adjustable LN with holster; or,
[2] an adjustable Standard Angle LV plus the (low angle) LV apron plane.

Footnote:

[fn1] Need = I want it, I can afford it, therefore I am going to buy it. ;)

HTH,

Tom

[Bob Reeve]

I just received my LV low angle block plane today. Out of the box without any cleanup or honing it works great. I love the adjustable mouth. I also happen to like its different looks. They have a winner.

[John Hossack]

I dont have either plane. I have a few LV planes and like them.
However, when I look at these two planes I note that the LN toe
(and hence throat gap) is adjusted with a lever like the Stanleys. The LV involves loosening the knob and pushing the toe forward or back freehand. In my opinion, the lever of the LN (and Stanley) has a few advantages:
(The lever is the part sticking out from under the screw down knob that locks the toe)
1. It is easy to adjust in fine increments
2. If the plane is dropped or shoved with a lot of force there is a much smaller risk of the toe hitting your blade which is always a bad thing.
(The LV plane has the shell extend beyond the toe to minimize risk of crashing)
Note that with the lever there is an element of backlash that you
would be wise to take account of if you are trying to minimize risk of crashing - or even just creeping along due to the forces due to planing.
For me, this difference would have to be weighed against the extra $50 of the LN.

[Mike Holbrook]

The LV has one movable arm which turns & controls both blade adjustment functions. The LV's also have screws on either side of the plane body that can be tightened to hold the blade in place. The block plane reviews in both Wood and The Fine 2005 Tool Guide loved the LV adjustment system and rated it better than the LN system. LN still won best overall, for "superior feel". LV's two block planes won best value in both poles.

I bought the LV block, the two extra handles (which IMHO makes the LV the most comfortable to use) and an attachable Chamfer Guide system, all for less than the LN. I felt that the LV was more versatile. No denying that the LN is one beautiful plane with great feel though.

[JayStPeter]

I have a LV LA Block and the LN LA Rabbeting block. To be honest, I like them both equally. The LN feels a little nicer in use, but the LV is much easier to set and adjust. When I need to trim a tennon, the rabbeting block is awesome. Otherwise, I reach for the LV first, once it's dull, the LN does duty until sharpening time.
So far, I have some older Stanley bench planes and a single LV. The LV almost always gets the call as I hate adjusting the blades on the Stanleys (even the BedRock). I would fear that the LN LA block would be similar. The rabbeting block is a little easier as I can hold the sides of the blades in place while adjusting.
My long term plan is a drawer full of LV. The rabbeting block may even go away once I get some shoulder planes.

Jay

[Michael Ballent]

It appears to me that the consesus thus far falls into the following categories:

LN 60 1/2 costs more but feels great when using it
LV LA Block Plane better bang for the buck and fairly easy to adjust

Since I am new to the world of planes I feel that I should lean toward the plane that is easier to use/adjust so I am thinking that the LV could be the better choice for me. Anyone have any other opinions?

[Gary Herrmann]

Was the first plane I bought and I've been very happy with it. I flattened the bottom and otherwise tuned the plane. Flattened and sharpened (scary sharp) the iron and have gotten very nice thing shavings with it. Took a furniture making class a couple years ago and the instructor was impressed with it, and he had all LN.

I've also got the LV medium shoulder plane - also very happy with it.

I think either one will do fine. I've heard that you don't have to tune up the LNs at all, that they are ready to go out of the box. Not having one, I can't attest to that. I suspect I would check it and tune it if necessary. And if I need to tune it, why pay the extra? LN are great tools, but I just haven't decided to pay the premium yet.

Next purchase will be a Jack. Maybe a 5 1/2. I saw the LN at the WWing show and was very tempted. Didn't pull the trigger. Once I have a need, I may get it, or the low angle LV Jack.

I've heard that the low angle Jack from LV works very well and can take the place of a regular bench plane. I'll do some research and ask a bunch of questions here when I get ready.

Enjoy your decision making process and whatever you choose.

[Mike Holbrook]

LV offers a blade for the LA Jack that is pre-ground at 38 (38 + 12 = 50) 50 is a York Pitch which is suppose to be the ideal pitch for dealing with hard stubborn grain. The LV LA Jack is longer 15 vs 14 and wider than the LN which some feel makes it a more versatile all around plane. The length allows it to function a little more like a fore or jointer plane.

If I had a large plane budget and more experience I would go with the LN as it is probably a little better feel and specialized. Since I am just learning and have to many things I want/need at once, the easy adjustment, versatility and value of the LV won out.

[Keith Christopher]

I have the LN 60 1/2 R and I tell you I agree with Mark and Jim, This is SUCH a nice plane ! You will not be disappointed. I think you can even get the 60 1/2 for like 75$ from LN. might be worth a looksie.



Keith

[John Weber]

The iron LA non-adjustable mouth block is $81 shipped from LN, or the bronze version is $87 shipped from Fine Tool Journal. I like the bronze, but either is a great plane.

John

P.S. FTJ can likely get the iron plane a little cheaper, but it's not listed on the web site...

[Rob Lee]

(snip)
I should add to all you other lads I sent an E-Mail to Lee VAlley yesterday asking about their Primus scrub plane, I did not want to buy it if they in fact are coming out with a Veritas scrub plane in the near future. They answered me today and said they are indeed bringing out a scrub plane sometime this year but they were unable to give a firm date or price yet, there is something else a lot of you will just have to have.

Hi James -

Scrub will be in the May or June catalog... pricing isn't set yet - but the price will start with an 8 or a 9 .... :)

Drawing here : https://www.leevalley.com/home/temprl/scrub.jpg

Small Photo here: https://www.leevalley.com/home/temprl/scr2.jpg

Cheers -

Rob

[John Miliunas]

Hi James -

Scrub will be in the May or June catalog... pricing isn't set yet - but the price will start with an 8 or a 9 .... :)

Drawing here : https://www.leevalley.com/home/temprl/scrub.jpg

Small Photo here: https://www.leevalley.com/home/temprl/scr2.jpg

Cheers -

Rob
Whew!!! An $800.00 or $900.00 scrub!:eek: Rob, must be gold-plated, huh?!:D Seriously, a sub-$100.00 scrub sounds intriguing!:) :cool:

[Roy Wall]

Hi James -

Scrub will be in the May or June catalog... pricing isn't set yet - but the price will start with an 8 or a 9 .... :)

Drawing here : https://www.leevalley.com/home/temprl/scrub.jpg

Small Photo here: https://www.leevalley.com/home/temprl/scr2.jpg

Cheers -

Rob
Great news Rob!! $89.95 sound good:cool: ------does that include A2 3/16" thick blade???

[Mark Singer]

Yes and the Early Bird Special includes The Veritas MarkII at no extra charge....Wow! I'm There!:cool:
Great news Rob!! $89.95 sound good:cool: ------does that include A2 3/16" thick blade???

[Roy Wall]

Yes and the Early Bird Special includes The Veritas MarkII at no extra charge....Wow! I'm There!:cool:
Get in line behind me:D :D :D :cool:

[Rob Lee]

Hi -

Nope - there will be two versions - HCS, and A2...your choice. Personally, I'd get the HCS...A2 will put the price up about $20, but I'm just guessing...costing's not done yet.

Both blades are 3/16"...

Plane is surface ground too... even though it's completely unnecessary...

Cheers -

Rob

[Gene Collison]

Michael,

I have block planes from both LV and Lie-Nielsen, in fact I have got a lot of block planes and love them all LOL!! The one that I reach for very often is the LN 102 and I think it is also a good first plane IMHO. That said, the LV apron plane would work just as well, so the remaining choice is whether you want the more expensive bronze one that won't rust or the less expensive iron one that will. Both will do the job for you and you will find either a very useful tool. LN also makes the 102 in iron as well if you decide to go with LN.

Gene

[Mark Singer]

I agree, Gene forced me to buy it....I been smiling ever since! It will even work as a smoother if you tune it well....it is very well balanced and a real surprise!
Michael,

I have block planes from both LV and Lie-Nielsen, in fact I have got a lot of block planes and love them all LOL!! The one that I reach for very often is the LN 102 and I think it is also a good first plane IMHO. That said, the LV apron plane would work just as well, so you the remaining choice is whether you want the more expensive bronze one that won't rust or the less expensive iron one that will. Both will do the job for you and you will find either a very useful tool. LN also makes the 102 in iron as well if you decide to go with LN.

Gene

[Tony Zaffuto]

First to Rob Lee: do the "ball and tail" handles fit your normal angle block plane as well as the low angle?

To all others: I have an old beat up Stanley 60-1/2. Got it off the _bay with several other planes for practically nothing seveal years ago. Put a Hock blade in it and it is my go to block plane--never leaves my side. My Wife bought me a L-N 60-1/2 about two years ago. Although I use it, the old Stanley is my most used plane. Its smaller in the hand and much lighter, and planes like all the other planes aspire to.

More than anything, a block plane is a very personal tool and almost an extension of your hand and arm. I would suggest trying before buying if you can, and go with what feels natural.

[Rob Lee]

First to Rob Lee: do the "ball and tail" handles fit your normal angle block plane as well as the low angle?

(snip)



Hi Tony -

No - the ball Tail won't go on the Standard block.

One thing many people overlook is the LA block planes (with throat adjustment) are bevel up, and as such, have the same utility as the LA smooths, and LA jacks - the effective cut angles can be varied if desired. Add a ball tail, and you essentially have LA #1/#2 "smooth" plane... The ball tail type handle is a more comfortable alternative to the traditional bench plane tote for a small plane...

For the minimalist plane user (does such a creature exist ? :D ) - a complete "suite" of planes could be:

LA Block
LA smooth (or heavy smooth*)
LA Jack*
LA Jointer*

All bevel - up, all adjustable throat, all with more than 1 blade; blades to provide different effective cut angles. (in our line, the planes marked with '*' take/will take the same 2 1/4" blade).

Long answer - but I wanted to ensure that you could see why we've sized the LA block the way we have - and why the ball tail option is a good one.

Cheers -

Rob