Elementary Turning

[Bob Jones]

You may have seen my other posts regarding getting my "new" lathe up and running. I have a few simple questions before I start turning.
First - I have never made anything on a lathe. I have a bit of experience with furniture making, and that is why I got a lathe. I plan to just do spindle work (for now). Tool handles, drawer pulls, and furniture parts. So, I want to learn to spindle turn (not bowl turn).

I bought a book. Elementary Turning. It is a book meant to be used in a trade school to teach turning to beginners. It is a great book with lots of great pictures. I have read it all the way through and I have a few questions before I start working the wood.

1 - The book recommends that you start by turning pieces in pine. I have no pine and I don't have plans to use pine in my projects. I use cherry and walnut almost exclusivly. Is it worthwhile to buy some pine for practice, or can I get started with cherry just as easily?

2 - The book recommends turning these projects at 3500 rpm. The blanks are 1.75in square by 8in long. This seems really fast to me. My lathe tops out at 3600 rpm. What is a good starting speed for a beginner?

3 - Building on the last question - the book makes no mention of changing speeds. Should I start slow and move to fast?

4 - the book uses spindle gouges (which is simple calls "turning gouges"), a roughing gouge, and skew chisels. That is it. It seems to use skews a lot more than I hear them being discussed. Are there any GREAT resources on using skew chisels? I need to learn more about sharpening them and using them for spindle turning.

5 - how about other great resources for learning spindle turning?

6 - unrelated to the book - tool sources. I need some extras (drill chuck, steb center, live center) and I am wondering about suppliers. Lee Valley sells good stuff, but PEN STATE and Woodcraft sell stuff that is 1/2 to 1/3 the cost. Are the cheaper tools any good? I assume they are all made in China. I hate tools that don't function properly.

Thanks in advance!

[Marty Eargle]

Well, I'm by no means a voice of great expertise here but I'll throw in my two cents.

1 - Don't waste you're time with pine. I'm guessing they suggest this because it cuts easily...but for the most part, pine is horrible for turning. If you've got spare Cherry to practice on...go for it. It's a great wood to turn, let alone learn on.

2 - No need to turn that fast. I rarely go much over 2000 RPMs.

3 - Yeah...rough/true your square wood going pretty slow. I usually rough around 600-800 RPM depending. Speed is less of a science and more of just a "use your gut" type of thing. If you crack something to a speed and it just doesn't feel safe...slow it back down. A faster speed is going to give you a cleaner cut, but most of the time, maxing out your lathe is unnecessary.

4 & 5 - I can't help much but there are a multitude of DVDs out there as well as many great turners on Youtube that will really help you with tool use and orientation.

6 - I've always had decent experiences with Penn State Ind brand stuff. For a large deal of their accessories and what not, they also offer alternative brands that are usually a bit better quality but more expensive. Its really a choice on how much you want to invest. Woodcraft is pretty good about carrying fairly top notch items.

Welcome to turning...prepare to become addicted.

[Keith Westfall]

Do some research and hopefully find a turning club near you. It will be your best resource.

Go slow and not too aggressive until you get a feel for it.

And then soon, you will be trying to remember what life was like before turning ... :D

[Kathy Marshall]

For starting practice pieces I would suggest looking for some green wood (cherry and walnut would be fine if it's something you come by easily). Green wood generally turns very nice although there are exceptions. If you have a Woodcraft in your area check to see if they offer classes. I started with the basic turning class, they go over each tool and how to use it, or check to see if there is a turning club in your area, most have mentors and other members that would be happy to get someone started turning.

3500 seems pretty fast to me, I don't think I've ever felt a need to go over about 2200 and that's mostly just for pens. Not to say it's not right, I'm sure there are plenty that turn spindle turnings at high speed, I just try not to go any faster than I need to to get the job done (the faster something is spinning, the faster and farther it's going to fly if it lets go). I start slower when I'm roughing something, then up the speed once it's round and balanced.

Skews.....either you love them or you hate them. One of the hardest to master. I use one on occasion, but I am not comfortable with them since I haven't used them enough, but there are lots here that do alot of beautiful work with skews (and I bow down to them). It takes practice, practice and more practice.

There are alot of good turning videos on YouTube, Bob Hamilton has a ton of them on just about anything you can think of and he's good about going into detail and showing where and how to use the tools. Do a search for bobham5 (hope that's ok to post mods).

I've bought alot of tools from Woodcraft and am happy with them (mostly chucks and assessories), I've been very happy with the Nova chucks I have. It doesn't hurt to start with some lower end gouges until you get the feel for sharpening. I would also recommend getting a Wolverine (or similar) grinding system, sharpening will be easier and much less wasteful on the steel.

Good luck and don't be surprised if you feel yourself slipping into the vortex!

[Kevin Lucas]

Bob Hamilton has some good youtube videos. This is a set on the skew http://www.youtube.com/user/bobham5#p/search/0/1XCyAcmZRvM
. That is the one chisel you will either love or hate it ) If you can go over a roughly rounded piece with a skew and no catches it leaves a nice smooth surface. One good catch and you have a divot or a squirrely line.

[Reed Gray]

http://www.woodturnerscatalog.com/store/Turning_Tools?Args=
T (http://www.woodturnerscatalog.com/store/Turning_Tools?Args=)his is another good source for just about everything turning related, and probably the biggest selection.

A big second on finding a local club. Biggest learning experience in my 15 years of turning. Demonstrations, workshops, and lots of advice. Of course, if you ask a question, you will most likely get a couple of different answers, but you have ideas to go home and try out. Go to the AAW (American Assn. of Woodturners) site, and find their club directory. Most clubs have a library and mentors.

As to speed, 3600 is a bit fast. I would turn spindles 2 inch diameter in that range, and it is more of a feet/minute than rpm issue.

I agree that pine is not your best choice for first turning wood. Soft, but tends to splinter. If you have some poplar around, or soft maple, that works fine.

First thing I ever turned was some mushroom type drawer pulls. Cut the head off a screw, chucked it up in the drill press, used a block of wood for a tool rest, and my bench chisels. I started drooling, and my flat work has gone to the side now, and I mostly turn bowls.

If you have a stepped pulley lathe, start on the lowest setting. If you have a variable speed lathe, then dial it up a bit. Feeling comfortable is the most important thing.

There are a lot of turning videos on You Tube, some great, some horrible scary. The older shop manuals are way out of date. Most of the catalog stores will steer you to good foundation books and videos.

robo hippy

[Jim Sebring]

You might take a look at Richard Raffan's book "Turning Wood". I found it most helpful when I got started. The best video on use of the skew chisel is probably Alan Lacer's "The Skew Chisel". He's the master of the skew.

Many turning clubs have libraries of books and videos that can be borrowed by members.

[Michelle Rich]

you are very lucky today to have videos & books. When I started there were a few books aimed at school kids. Go find videos on you tube & other places and watch carefully &you should have no problems.

[John Keeton]

Bob, I agree on pine - horrible wood to turn. However, if you can develop a smooth cut on pine, then the rest seems easy. I think that is why it is suggested by many. Tear out if common on pine, and learning to control that with the proper cuts is essential to successful turning on better woods. Poplar is an excellent wood to practice on, as well, and inexpensive compared to walnut and cherry.

I will go against the grain here a little. While nearly all turners love to turn wet wood, I learned on dry wood. It is more difficult to get good cuts, but again, just like the pine, I think that causes one to develop certain skills a bit quicker.

For some tools, PSI does very well. Generally, I think if you are buying something that spins, pay a little extra to avoid run out. If it doesn't spin, you can get by cheaper on some things. That said, I have a jacobs chuck and a steb center from PSI and I have been pleased with them. There are also folks that have the Barracuda line of chucks from PSI and seemed pleased.

The only thing I turn at 3500rpms are finials. I wouldn't see much need to turn other spindle stock that fast. The speed vs. the diameter is the key. Turning a piece of stock that is less than 1/8" at 3500rpms gets you a surface speed equivalent to much slower on 2" diameter stock.

[David Gilbert]

There are lots of good suggestions in the responses above. One thing that I haven't seen mentioned is a safety driver. Here is a link to Oneway's: http://www.oneway.ca/spindle/safe_drivers.htm There may be other manufacturers of drives like this as well.

These drives don't have the points and holding ability of usual drive centers. Alan Lacer suggested that our club use them for our introductory classes, especially for learning the skew. If you get a catch the wood will spin and not create the usual excitement of a catch.

Cheers,
David

[Bill Bulloch]

Several books that I have read suggest starting with Pine. You'll need to learn to make those beads, coves and V-cuts. This will take practice. Pine is recommended because it is a lot cheaper then hardwoods and eaiser to turn. Take a White Pine 2 x 4 and cut it into 1 1/2 x 1 1/2 strips 12" long to practice with. As for speed -- find a speed that you are comfortable with. You'll find that faster cuts better for spindle turning.

[Cecil Walborn]

I would use pine to teach how to turn. Also I would use a spur or a safety drive center, PSI carries both in their cat., and tighten the tail stock just enough to turn and cut the pine. If there is a catch it will slip and not cause any trouble to scar a person. Then just tighten the tail stock more and turn. A speed of about 2000 would be about right for spindle turning. A better book for beginning turners is Keith Rowley's Woodturning A Foundation Course. The book covers lathe turning form the very beginning to the finished piece. Learning to sharpen tools and the use sharp tools is one, if not, the most important thing with turning. Dull tools will scare most people and they will turn no more. Get a teacher form a wood turning club or from an experience wood turner before you beginning. Most books written for schools are not by an experience turner. I did a demonstration using pine between centers using 5 different tools turning 5 spindle legs with one one tool each spindle. Using the skew, spindle, parting, ruffing and a scarper. When you learn how sharpen and use your tool on pine between centers with a very smooth finish you will be then be able to turn anything and any wood on your lathe.

[Betty Fox]

Find a turning club in your area. You will get access to free wood, sometimes inexpensive tools, and all the tips and hints you can ever process. Our local club also has a video library where you can check out Jimmy Clewes for free. Nothing better than a free Jimmy Clewes I must say.
Good turning.

[Michael Mills]

1. I agree with some others that pine can be a good start. When you can get a good cut on it you can get a good cut on almost anything. Buy a 2X4, cut into 8-12” lengths, and rip square. Green wood (limbs in the 2-3” diameter) are also good in that you are starting out sorta round. Beware of wet oak as it can really rust your tools and lathe.
2. Agree that somewhere around 2000 should be good.
3. Changing speeds, I seldom change speeds on a spindle, at least no more than once
Bowls are a different matter due to the diameter.
4. For the skew, Alan Lacer’s The Skew, the Sweet Side, the Dark Side.
For general spindle turning, if it is available from Hartville Tools, Doug Hout’s introduction to Spindle Turning. He really does a good job explaining the basics of the tools, tool rest position, and other topics I have never seen anyone else address. (Dave does use a piece of ripped 2X in the video).

[Bill Wiggins]

Although I've had my lathe for several years, I never did a lot of turning on it until this year. So I also consider myself a novice. But here's what I've learned.

Pine and/or green wood - I started on pine, I taught my grandson on pine. Yes it's horrible wood for a finished piece, but it's easy to turn and I didn't care how much of it got wasted. I just started using green wood last year. I LOVE using green wood for turning, since it's fairly easy. But I'm still learning the techniques for preventing checking on the finished piece. Also be prepared to get very wet while turning green wood.
Lathe Speed - As people suggested here, rough out on a slow speed and increase speed as you get to more detail. I always finish the piece at the highest speed on my Jet Midi lathe.
Skews - I've ruined many pieces while learning to use a skew. I now avoid it whenever possible. They scare the hell out of me. But I've yet to find a way to get the fine detail without using one. Watch the YouTube videos about how to use a skew.
Tool and Accessory Sources - I got most of my stuff at the local Woodcraft shop. They have an extremely helpful staff. I recently purchased a 4 jaw chuck and a bottle topper chuck. They were the best investments I've made to date.

Just my suggestions from a Novice.

[Alec Moseley]

Alan Lacer has two videos (at least) on skew usage, and they are excellent. Shows how to sharpen, present to the piece, etc.

When I first started learning skew turning (this would apply to any spindle turning), I was chewing up wood pretty fast so I ripped some 2x4 pine studs into spindle blanks. You will probably waste a lot of good cherry learning to turn unless you learn a good deal faster than I did.

[Bob Jones]

Thanks for all of the advice! I have a lot of research to do now. Last night I decided to quit stalling and just turn something. I ripped a 2 x 4 down and went to work. It was pretty rough, bit it was round! It was big fun. After I learn a bit more I hope they will look a bit better. I will try to post pictures later. Thanks again!

[Will Winder]

Bar none the sharpening has been my biggest challenge so far. I got a lathe about 3 weeks ago and have been practicing on 3" diameter maple branches.

So far I've been making mushrooms and find it to be great practice. Trying to make a bell curve up top and doing a little bit of hollowing underneath without leaving tool marks isn't easy. You can also opt to leave a natural edge for a little more challenge.

If the tools that came with your lathe are anything like the ones that came with mine they could be ground very poorly. The grind that came on mine were so bad it was nearly impossible to use any of the gouges without catching. Even when they didn't catch all I could get was dust instead of shavings.

[Bob Jones]

I hope cedar is just as good as pine for practicing. The 2x4s at the lumber yard were less than 1.5 inches thick so I bought rough sawn cedar which was thicker. We shall see.

[Kevin Lucas]

Cedar works great since its relatively soft. It cuts nice and as a bonus the shop smells good )