Black locust one-piece slab workbench top

[Trevor Walsh]

Today I got a quote for a single piece of wood for a bench 5" by 22" by 6-7 feet. The only material around that big is black locust, I know even asking is against the prevailing wisdom for benches. But I'm smitten with a one piece top, my only concern is the BL being insane to work with, but then again maybe I don't care? I don't know yet. The BL certainly isn't the cheaper or easier option, but it's one piece. and apparently BL is also very stable, and heavy. Thoughts on this?

[Andrae Covington]

Today I got a quote for a single piece of wood for a bench 5" by 22" by 6-7 feet. The only material around that big is black locust, I know even asking is against the prevailing wisdom for benches. But I'm smitten with a one piece top, my only concern is the BL being insane to work with, but then again maybe I don't care? I don't know yet. The BL certainly isn't the cheaper or easier option, but it's one piece. and apparently BL is also very stable, and heavy. Thoughts on this?

Well it would probably never rot.;) I've never worked with black locust so can only pass on some things I've read. It has been used for boat building, so it seems if the wood can be worked into something with that complex of a shape, a workbench would be quite possible. Apparently the physical properties are similar to purpleheart, so if you have any experience with that wood, it would give you a good idea. I have read that it becomes more rock-like over time with exposure to weather, so it would be worth asking your supplier if this is recently cut and kiln-dried or if it has been sitting for a few years. As the years go by, you might eventually find it impossible to replane the top? Perhaps staying indoors will prevent it from turning into petrified wood.:p

[Trevor Walsh]

That's a good point, I'll add that to my list of questions. I certainly don't want to get into geology. I was reading that the antioxidants in the wood will keep it intact for over 60 years in dirt in the forrest. Wow.

[Simon Frez-Albrecht]

I recently worked on a wood bridge in which we used Black Locust for the contact blocks between the bridge and the concrete footings. I didn't get to do any milling on the blocks, but I believe the woman that did used regular tools, power and hand, to do the task. The timber we used was fairly green, air dried for about 5-6 months, so that probably played a factor. Sorry I can't be of any more help.

[Prashun Patel]

If it's like purpleheart, then GOOD LUCK. PH is splintery and hard to level without tearout. Sandpaper is no match for it PH, and will really test your planing skills.

[Jake Elkins]

I had resawn quite a lot of old BL barn beams for various furniture items. I think a comparison to ash is better than purpleheart. This stuff was a bit hard/brittle, but it was 125+ years old. Dense stuff, I see no reason it wouldn't make a good bench. And, I can verify the anti-rot properties: there wasn't even a hint of rot/bug damage in any of these beams, much less than W. oak beams. Good luck

[Bob Smalser]

... a single piece of wood for a bench 5" by 22" by 6-7 feet...

You have several hardwood species locally that large. White Oak, Sweetgum and Tulip Poplar come immediately to mind as the most common, with Black Locust being a smaller tree than all three, and Tulip the largest.

The problem with one-piece slabs that wide is they are usually taken from the center of the log and look like the center-cut 2X12's below. Namely two nice vertical-grain sections separated by pithwood, which is prone to checking and warping. The wise solution is to cut out the unstable pith area and edgejoin the VG sections.

http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL12/1104763/18208631/286276040.jpg

[Trevor Walsh]

Good points everyone, I'm asking the guy (from Bark House) if I can get photos of the endgrain slabs, and check out what sort of thing I'm looking at before I commit. Jake, what a relief to hear that you'd compare it more to ash. I like planing ash. If the grain is sucky, I'm also seeing what they have in the 5" by 10-12" by 6-7 feet range, and will glue up a top. If they have something pretty like cherry that big I'd go two boards to get a cherry bench. We'll see what they say...

[Jamie Bacon]

If I were to build another bench, something more like a slab top bench, I think I'd opt for a nice 11 or 12 inch wide by 3 or 4 inch thick front section and edge glue a 1 1/2 to 2 inch piece of 12 inch wide to that. I really don't think that it's necessary to have a full thickness bench for the full depth of the bench. You mainly just need the thickness in the front section.

[Trevor Walsh]

Nothing against you or your suggestion Jamie, but I think the mass is important. The bench is destined to be a close version of Schwarz's 18th C. French bench. I even found a pair of sheldon style quick action vises.

[Jamie Bacon]

No problem. I kind of figured that's the design you were gonna be using when you started talking about a single slab top. That Schwarz bench in cherry is a beautiful piece. I know many agree with you on the importance of mass, and while I would never argue that mass is a bad thing, I've done quite a bit of hand planing on my Nicholson style bench, made with 1 3/4" SYP, and I've never had it budge on me at all. Hope your able to find the wood you're looking for. I love following along on a good bench building thread. :)

[Trevor Walsh]

After I sort the wood out, I just need the space. Currently I'm renting a room in the house of a buddy, his basement is a workshop with harbor freight benches and a good hybrid Tablesaw and bandsaw. I hate the benches. I'm thinking of renting the whole house from him, mostly to get all of his stuff out of the basement. Then I can add some wood floor, build a bench that will be exciting to remove from a Philadelphia row-home's back alley steps.

I agree that bench threads are a lot of fun. on the FalkFestool forum, there is a cool split top Roubo in ash, Groggy's workbench and a hand tool build going on by a guy Fred West. TF is an interesting and small group, but very fun.

[Salem Ganzhorn]

My experience has been the same. My bench is 3" thick and it is all I can do to move it when I have to.
Some other points: you will not be able to move a slab that size without help. When making a bench you have to move and flip it alot. Just trying to flip it yourself on saw horses would be downright dangerous. Also holdfasts may not work very well. Mine work great in my top but are finicky on my 4" thick legs.
Salem

[Will Boulware]

Just food for thought, the Dominy family bench was set up like this IIRC. Doubt it walked around a lot on it's own. :)

[john brenton]

I think the Dominy bench was something like 12' or something, though. I kind of followed suit on my bench with the splayed back legs and tool tray (in lieu of just a plank) to make the top full width. But the overall length is 7' 10", so the length makes for good heft and stability.

Just do it Trevor...I want to see the pics! This was the first thread in a long time where I read the title and got a "shiver up my leg". I thought there'd be pics.


Just food for thought, the Dominy family bench was set up like this IIRC. Doubt it walked around a lot on it's own. :)

[Dave Anderson NH]

I love Black Locust. It is hard, dense, and as we say in New Hampshire, "one black locust fence post will outlast 3 post holes." A friend built a strip sailing dinghy out of it with a mahogany transom and a a centerboard trunk. I got to help some and found the wood reasonable to work with. I also scooped up the cutoffs and made a bunch of file handles and other things. I found Black Locust wonderful to turn, hard but well behaved to chisel and plane, and gorgeous in its variations in color.

[Frank Drew]

Trevor,

Nothing wrong with locust as a benchtop material, and, however this turns out, it will be a good learning experience for you.

Do you know when the slab was sawn?

[Terry Beadle]

Black locust is not as light colored as rock maple ( for example ). When you evaluate the BL slab be sure to consider if there is sufficient light from the work surface to be able to see the adjustments you will need to make with hand planes and other cutting tools.

A single slab in my opinion is not as good as a two part or three part edge glued work surface. The grain patterns as pointed out impact greatly the stability and maintenance flattening issues. The drying process for such a big slab is also an important consideration. Such thick massive wood is never dried enough by any supplier now a days. I built a red oak slab coffee table with a 6 foot length, 2 inch thick and 2 foot wide dimension. I had to let it acclimate for almost 2 years and once completed, it still has some unplanned movement. Luckily does not affect the piece but a work bench is a different animal. A work bench has heavy duty stresses that a coffee table will never have.

Just some thoughts.

All that aside, it would be great to have a single slab big enough, thick enough, and dry enough to do a work bench out of. Maybe if you lived in South America and could get access to some old growth lumber that had been sitting and waiting just for you. Lets hope !

Enjoy the process...it's the best ! Good Luck and keep us posted.

[Ben Beckham]

I tend to think the benchtop should dent before whatever piece of furniture you're building on top of it does. So maybe a really hard top would be a bad thing.

Then again, I am currently lusting after two large solid slabs of Live Oak to make a split-top Roubo, so what do I know? :)

[Bob Smalser]

I suppose the best lessons are learned the hard way, but notice that wide, thick slabs are used by Nakashima, Maloof, Krenov, et. al. largely in pieces that don't have to remain absolutely flat. Mainly because they absolutely won't remain flat.

http://www.craftinamerica.org/artists_wood/pic_18.jpg

Work bench and assembly table tops need to remain sufficiently flat to use as index surfaces for glueups, and are most often made using kiln-dried 4/4 or 5/4 stock either glued or bolted up on edge like another surface intended to remain flat...a bowling alley surface.

http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL12/1104763/7297605/271071449.jpg

And accordingly, even these tops need to be soft-mounted so they don't cup as the humidity changes from season to season. Plus however many coats of finish are applied to the top also need to be applied to the bottom.

http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL12/1104763/2594265/36332508.jpg

All this is boring, conventional wisdom...but it didn't become that without reason.

[Trevor Walsh]

I'm sorry to say my original plan might need some thinking over, the largest slab they have will just clear 17" after squaring. I was hoping for 20-22" I'm getting some information about 12" wide stuff that would glue up (Walnut bench?) but the price plus shipping is going to kill me. The BL slab was going to run $450 with $400 delivery from NC to PA. A two board top in and of the woods they had was going to cost more than the single slab... I'm in the process of finding out just how much more (this just in the walnut they had is curly and would run $2500, aka not walnut, maybe cedar or soft maple what will they say?). I may go with a reclaimed pine top. Thanks for all the advice, cautions and reminders guys.

[Frank Drew]

Trevor, This might be a blessing in disguise. As others have mentioned, there were some potential problems with your plan to use a one piece slab top of unknown dryness. Add to that the high shipping costs from North Carolina... IMO you're better off going to Plan B, finding some material locally and laminating your bench top. I understand why your original ideal appealed to you, but a workbench is primarily a tool and as such has to be predictable.

[Trevor Walsh]

Yes Drew, I think I went a little overboard when the one piece seemed possible to acquire, the practicality of the though just got left behind. I should be able to find some barn beams ad a local reclaimed lumber place, I might be able to go a 2 or 3 board top from some mid 19th C. factory building wood. Then option three would be a 2by lamination.

[Jamie Buxton]

It is a shame to make a wooden bench top so thick just to get mass. If you want mass, use concrete, and save the wood for the furniture you're going to build on the bench. Seriously. Make the top a couple of inches thick. Fasten concrete to the underside to increase the mass. Concrete's weight/dollar is way better than wood.

[Tony Shea]

For that matter Trevor, you should eventually be able to find some reclaimed old beams of oak even. Lots of old post and beam buildings used oak as it was much stronger and considered a reasonable structural timber. I've seen many adds for reclaimed oak in the past couple years in the local classifieds. I personally should have gone this route.

[David Keller NC]

Trevor - If you want oak of large dimensions, and are willing to pay shipping, you may want to give Scott T Smith a call (he's an SMC forum member). He typically has oak (both white and red) in enormous sizes. His website is:

http://www.quartersawnoak.com/

[Trevor Walsh]

I'll check that out David, thanks for the link.

[Trevor Remster]

You might just go down to your local full service lumber yard and take a look at Glulam beams. They are beams made by gluing up 2x4 SYP, or 2x6 SYP boards on edge. You can get these in a variety of widths and up to 24" wide. Thicknesses are usually 3-1/2" and 5-1/2" thick. You just tell them how long you want your piece and they will cut it to length for you. These things are flat & straight. They can be bought in architectural grade which is clear SYP for the most part, or the normal construction grade which is the easiest to find and might suit you even though it will likely have some small voids from wane contained on the individual boards used in the glue up. You won't likely find these at the Borg. I know this isn't as sexy as your original idea, but this route saves a lot of trouble doing the glue up. My local supplier usually has some returns, or damaged beams that can be picked through for smaller pieces suitable for a workbench top. I went this route for the top on my tablesaw outfeed table. I bought two short scraps both 8' long glulams 18" wide and 5-1/2" thick for $150.00. BTW, you can also buy these things 3-1/2" x 3-1/2" x 10' long and 5-1/2" x 5-1/2" x 10' long which can be cut to length making great legs for your bench.

[Paul Incognito]

Trevor,
If you want to stay fairly local, try one of these guys,
http://www.barnyardboys.com/index.html I've gotten a lot of reclaimed lumber from these guys, great to deal with and reasonable prices.
http://www.lioncrestlumber.com/ I've dealt with Dave and Vanessa a bit. They can not only get the wood for you, they have a pretty complete millwork shop to surface and dimension. They'll also mill wood that you don't buy from them at a reasonable price. And they're really nice people who are great to deal with.
No affiliation with either, just a happy customer.
Hope this helps,
Paul

[Trevor Walsh]

Thanks Paul, I'll add them to the search.

Trevor, I have seen 2by gluelam at the borg... But I didn't know (now guess it whould) that gluelam could be had in 5 1/2" thicknesses. we have a Tauge Lumber pretty close, but they might rape on price... I'll do some digging on that end. As long as I'm planning on gluing, I guess gluelam is okay too. I might go the architectural route. I have some salvaged 8x6 beams I intend for the legs, the running joke for a while was to use a double tenon and dovetail...but that is too much work, even for how funny it would be.