Tiny piranhas have eaten my fingertips!

[Bill Moser]

Well no, not literally, but, after about 16 hrs of sharpening chisels and plane blades this week, that's pretty much what it looks like. This is a longish post, so here's the executive summary of my questions:
What's your sharpening routine?
How sharp is sharp for you?
Here's my sad story: I'm trying to turn over a new leaf in sharpening. I recently finished a coffee table (walnut/maple) , which, including dressing of rough lumber, took me close to 3 weeks to complete. I kept up with sharpening pretty well for almost the first two weeks. What that means is that I set aside a half day or so a couple of times to resharpen stuff. The last week+ I saw the finish line ahead, so I deferred all sharpening. I had extra blades and chisels, and apparently was willing to simply apply more muscle when the blades started to get dull. After I finished the table, I realized that this pattern was perhaps not the best course. So, I used the latest sharpening marathon to figure out that I'm perfectly capable of sharpening freehand -- once I get rid of the micro-bevels and ruler-trick. Freehand sharpening seems to be faster than using jigs. Starting with a pretty dull blade, I can go from removing the blade from the plane to re-installing in < 5 minutes, but I'd like to decrease this time as much as possible. The goal, I think, is to reduce the sharpening time to a level where it becomes part of the natural activity of woodworking, rather than some set-aside time. Any help/insight/tips in this regard would be greatly appreciated. My current sharpening setup is:
extra-coarse, coarse, fine, extra-fine diamond stones
4000 (purple) and 8000 (green) grit shaptons
I also have a hand-cranked grinder, but prefer to avoid using that...
Regards,
Bill

[Jessica Pierce-LaRose]

It seems like what is sharp is always a moving target for me - I've been working with softwoods lately, which is sort of a first for me; building some quick stuff out of home center S-P-F. A not perfect plane blade still get's a decent finish, but it really makes you realize how sharp (or not) your chisels are. Unless you're razor edged, you bruise everything before you cut. But oh, it's so fun to be able to just whack out huge chunks of waste with a single sharp mallet blow...

[Trevor Walsh]

At the shop I work in, and through some experimentation, I believe diamond stones are not quite as flat as other media. In the shop we use diamond plates for rough grinding or backs, then use Shaptons for the rest. At home I use Norton waterstones flattened on glass with sandpaper.

Once I have a flat back it only ever touches a 8K stone or a strop, we grind primary bevels on a bench grinder, then use 500, 2K and 8K shaptons. Stropping is a huge boon in the chisel area. Grinding of these tools is infrequent at best compared to the work done. As an example, this week I've been building a blanket chest with 20 inches of dovetails in each corner (80in total) my chisels were ground months ago, during the dovetailing I honed at 8K two times and stropped about 10 times. I use a 1/4" and 1/2" chisels for most of the work, a 1/8" in spots and a 3/4" for a few specific cuts.

[Bill Moser]

At the shop I work in, and through some experimentation, I believe diamond stones are not quite as flat as other media. In the shop we use diamond plates for rough grinding or backs, then use Shaptons for the rest. At home I use Norton waterstones flattened on glass with sandpaper.

Once I have a flat back it only ever touches a 8K stone or a strop, we grind primary bevels on a bench grinder, then use 500, 2K and 8K shaptons. Stropping is a huge boon in the chisel area. Grinding of these tools is infrequent at best compared to the work done. As an example, this week I've been building a blanket chest with 20 inches of dovetails in each corner (80in total) my chisels were ground months ago, during the dovetailing I honed at 8K two times and stropped about 10 times. I use a 1/4" and 1/2" chisels for most of the work, a 1/8" in spots and a 3/4" for a few specific cuts.

Yikes, I've been using the coarse diamond stone to flatten the shaptons -- maybe this is a bad idea?? Also, if you're going straight to the 8000 & stropping, how often do you do that? To be more specific, say you're chopping a few 5/8-inch wide, 1.5 inch deep mortises in walnut or cherry -- not that I've ever done that :) -- how often do you go back to the strop? and to the 8K?

[James Owen]

My sharpening routine is to use diamonds -- usually up through XF or XXF, but sometimes through 8000 mesh -- for initial flattening/sharpening of a new tool and for flattening/sharpening a vintage tool that needs some TLC. I follow-up with 800/1200/4000/8000 grit waterstones, as required, to sharpen and start polishing, and then do final polishing with a 2000 grit ceramic stone. If it is a previously-sharpened tool that has gotten "dull" through use, then I usually start around 1200 grit and work up through the waterstones and ceramics. If it just needs a touch-up because of use, then I usually use an 1800 and/or 2000 grit ceramic stone.

As with many others, "sharp" seems to be a moving target. What I thought was "sharp" a year ago, seems a touch dull today, and I suspect that the same thing will apply next year....

If a vintage tool is in really bad shape, I sometimes use a sharpening guide, mainly for speed, to correct the problem(s), and also use one where I need a specific micro-bevel angle (mortise chisels). Otherwise, all of my edged tools get sharpened with a flat bevel, and are done freehand. I don't use a hand or electric grinder, except for HSS turning tools.

The key, I think, with a tool that has been dulled through use, is to not let it get too dull. Kinda like what carvers call "bench discipline" -- many carvers will periodically (every 10 or 15 minutes) re-hone -- it delays having to re-sharpen, and also helps to largely avoid the problems that a dull gouge, etc. can cause in carving. The same principle can be applied to bench chisels, plane irons, etc.

If re-honing is all that is required, it generally takes me less than two minutes, mostly depending on tool disassembly/re-assembly time; YMMV. Besides quickly getting you back to woodworking, it has the bonus of all of the usual sharp-tool advantages: leaves a better and more consistent quality surface, reduces the probability of tear-out, makes pushing/pulling the tool easier, and is much safer overall.

[Dave Anderson NH]

There are 2 majors tricks to sharpening from my point of view and neither have anything to do with the media you use. I don't care whether you sharpen with oilstones, waterstone,ceramic, diamond, sandpaper or a shingle off of your roof.

Trick 1 is the harder one to accomplish and is best stated as: Sharpening must be convenient and the gear to do it must be readily available for immediate use.
You will not sharpen soon enough or often enough unless everthing you need is with in easy reach. No one wants to interrupt the flow of work to go search out the gear, set it up, and then sharpen. Set aside a spot or have a mobile setup that is well organized. In my shop I have a dedicated sharpening bench 24" x 48" kitty corner to my main bench and I have a dedicated grinder on a pedestal 1 step to the left of my lathe.

Trick 2 is to only sharpen to the level necessary to accomplish the task. As an example, I would categorize my chisels in 4 classes: bench, mortising, paring, and the beaters. The mortisers might only go up to 1000 grit, the bench chisels to 6000 grit, and the paring chisels go to 8000 and then get hit with 1 micron diamond paste or the 1/2 micron green crayon. Similarly a plow plane, a scrub plane, or a jack plane does not need the same level of sharpness as a smoother. I work hard on maintaining a mental state where I do not allow sharpening to become a fetish.

Time spent sharpening is time not spent working the wood.

[Gordon Eyre]

Interesting how I came across this thread after spending the morning sharpening plane irons and chisels. I had a one chisel and one plane iron with a pretty good ding in the blade. I had just bought a Veritas MKII honing guide and some Norton water stones and must say that things went great. For the two in poor shape I started with the 220 grit stone and then progressed through 1000, 4000 and 8000. They did a great job and with the secondary bevel the blades were very sharp. It took a while with a file and then the 220 grit stone to resurrect the one chisel; however, it is now very sharp and has a polished edge.

I also bought a piece of float glass and use wet or dry sandpaper to polish some of my tools with 6000 grit and it works great as well. I have never used tools with such a sharp edge and it is fun. I have been struggling along with three oil stones and nothing in the high grit range. I had just spent several hours reconditioning my two planes and now with the sharp blades they are a joy to use. Course I also bought a low angle LN moving mouth block plane and with the newly touched up blade it turns end grain into a polished looking thing of beauty.

[Tony Shea]

It took a while with a file and then the 220 grit stone to resurrect the one chisel; however, it is now very sharp and has a polished edge.



Yikes, a file huh? I'm suprised the file did much of anything to your chisel. Might I ask what the make of the chisel is? Once you get up in Rockwell hardness above 55 or so a file should basically skip off the metal. Not sure of the specs but I think a file is softer than most chisels.

I would highly reccomend a grinder. They make extremely quick work of re-establishing bevels and creates a hollow grind that is very condusive to free handing on your stones. I would be lost without one. There is certainly a learning curve, especially with over heating. But once you have a few junker chisels/plane blades under your belt you will no longer worry about burning an edge. Keep a cup of water handy and things will go smoothly.

Others here are much more knowledgable and should be able to guide you in the right path, they have me.

[Peter Scoma]

8 posts into this thread and no one has pointed out the obvious.

Best way to avoid frequent sharpening sessions during a project.............

Buy more tools!!

PJS

[Bill Moser]

Peter - Nooooooo!!!! That's my problem! I had enough plane blades & substitute chisels to defer sharpening for a long time. All good things must end, and they ended for me in a pile of dull blades. I think I'll stick to the advice of Trevor, James, & Dave, thanks :)

[Steve Branam]

I wasn't quite sure if you were going through all your stones each time you sharpen or not, but you should sharpen frequently enough that you only need your finest 2 or 3 stones. That means it's still pretty sharp, so you're just maintaining the edge, not rebuilding it each time. If you wait until you need to go all the way back to your coarsest stone, you've added a lot of extra time and effort. If you spend about 30 seconds on each face per stone, that's only 2-3 minutes total. Think of it like sharpening a pencil: you don't wait until the tip is gone before sharpening it, you do it while there's still plenty of life left in the tip.

[Trevor Walsh]

Yikes, I've been using the coarse diamond stone to flatten the shaptons -- maybe this is a bad idea?? Also, if you're going straight to the 8000 & stropping, how often do you do that? To be more specific, say you're chopping a few 5/8-inch wide, 1.5 inch deep mortises in walnut or cherry -- not that I've ever done that :) -- how often do you go back to the strop? and to the 8K?

I've not done enough in walnut or cherry for comparison, though the mortise chisel I use the most is a 1/4" number by Ray Isles. It's D2 steel, which is an extremely tough specialty tool steel. I did a table in cherry with 24 mortises, 1/4" by 1 1/4" by 1" deep I sharpened at the beginning and honed once or twice.

In the blanket chest, I sharpened everything in the morning, paired 16" of tails, stropped, paired 16" of tails stropped, touched up the 1/4" on the 8K, paired 16" of tails, stropped, paired 16" of tails, touched up all the chisels, paired 16" of pins, stropped, paired 16" of pins, stropped, paired 16" of pins, ( I had started fret sawing very close to the baseline at this point) stropped, paired 16" of pins, stropped. That took care of the case. Then the base, with 4" of dovetails at each corner I touched up on the 8K and stropped once or twice. If a particular cut wasn't as smooth as maybe I thought it should have been, I stropped, pretty much without thinking. It's just something I do when there is a chisel in my hand.

In the workshop, they have a $$$ diamond lapping plate, which is not just a regular diamond stone it's very flat. They use that for flattening the two sets of shaptons for student use. But I wouldn't go that route for my home shop, too much money for a little plate, the instructor said as much too.

[Gordon Eyre]

Yikes, a file huh? I'm suprised the file did much of anything to your chisel. Might I ask what the make of the chisel is? Once you get up in Rockwell hardness above 55 or so a file should basically skip off the metal. Not sure of the specs but I think a file is softer than most chisels.

I would highly reccomend a grinder. They make extremely quick work of re-establishing bevels and creates a hollow grind that is very condusive to free handing on your stones. I would be lost without one. There is certainly a learning curve, especially with over heating. But once you have a few junker chisels/plane blades under your belt you will no longer worry about burning an edge. Keep a cup of water handy and things will go smoothly.

Others here are much more knowledgable and should be able to guide you in the right path, they have me.

It is a Stanley #60 and while the file was slow it was faster than the stone. I do have a grinder but have never used it for sharpening chisels and did not want to risk burning the edge. In any event it is very sharp now and super polished. I will try the grinder (which by the way has a very nice stone on it) the next time I have this problem. By the way, as you might guess I do not have the greatest chisels, just a mixture of junk. Thing of it is, they work for the uses I have for them. Perhaps this is something I should put on my wish list.

[Harvey Pascoe]

This thread is depressing! I don't go to anywhere near the lengths described herein, but then I am not sure that I should - I don't chop mortises. I use sand paper on my plane blades and then finish up with a 4,000 stone and totally clueless about stropping. My tools seem to work well enough and I continually wonder about the time/benefit/cost of making them sharper. Is spending $100+ for 6000 and 8000 stones provide a benefit worth the price, or is it more a matter of sharpening fetish? No disrespect but it seems some people really go to extreme lengths. Or maybe I'm missing something. I guess I won't know unless I try it.

I have two moderate priced chisels that I use mainly for clean up work and I just spent two hours truing them up to correct years worth of incompetence of unguided sharpening, having just bought the complete Veritas sharpening set up. They look good and work good, so I assume they are good.

[Jim Koepke]

I use sand paper on my plane blades and then finish up with a 4,000 stone and totally clueless about stropping. My tools seem to work well enough and I continually wonder about the time/benefit/cost of making them sharper. Is spending $100+ for 6000 and 8000 stones provide a benefit worth the price, or is it more a matter of sharpening fetish?

I used to sharpen only to 4,000. Then I bought an 8,000 stone. It is something I would do again and suggest others to do.

My sharpening is done as I go. There are dedicated areas in my shop for sharpening. I keep the oil system and the water system apart from each other.

It is much easier to do regular touch ups on a blade's edge than it is to keep using a dull blade and then going through the grits to reestablish an edge.

jtk

[Harlan Barnhart]

My tools seem to work well enough and I continually wonder about the time/benefit/cost of making them sharper.

My opinion: If your tools are doing all you ask of them, don't waste any time or money changing.

[Trevor Walsh]

Harlan also has a point, I think the debate on setup is handy only for someone who hasn't picked a method. Talking about actual sharpening practice is more interesting, assuming the words grind, hone, strop etc. can be used interchangeably among waterstoners, oilstoners, scary sharpers and powerhoners. I'd be interested in how often each of the tasks gets performed.

[Harvey Pascoe]

I work almost exclusively with tropical hardwoods and they practically scream at me when a blade even begins to dull because even a slightly dull blade will not cut or it makes a mess.

Yeah, I can see where 8000 might make a marginal bit of difference but as I was taking off nearly continuous shavings of .002" on African blackwood yesterday I failed to see any cost/benefit.

I don't seem to need to sharpen as often as others mention, but of course that has a lot to do with how much cutting a blade is doing. However, I also wonder if by going to such a fine edge, that edge is not being rolled over that much faster. Edges so fine bend easily, particularly in very hard wood.

Great topic here with a lot of great responses!

[lowell holmes]

Actually, a coarse double cut mill bastard file laying flat on the bench works quite well. You just draw the chisel across it like you would a stone. You will never burn an edge with it. It is a good way to repair an edge.

There is a book called "The Furniture Doctor" that only uses files to sharpen chisels.

There are some very hard chisels that doesn't work on, but I decline to use those anyway.

That being said, I keep a diamond hone on the bench and touch up the edge when needed. I strop the edge with green buffing compound on a piece of mdf. My chisels are always sharp and very little effort is required.

[Bill Moser]

I wasn't quite sure if you were going through all your stones each time you sharpen or not, but you should sharpen frequently enough that you only need your finest 2 or 3 stones. That means it's still pretty sharp, so you're just maintaining the edge, not rebuilding it each time. If you wait until you need to go all the way back to your coarsest stone, you've added a lot of extra time and effort. If you spend about 30 seconds on each face per stone, that's only 2-3 minutes total. Think of it like sharpening a pencil: you don't wait until the tip is gone before sharpening it, you do it while there's still plenty of life left in the tip.

Steve - I had to start on my extra-fine diamond stone, and sometimes back to the fine, (or even coarse for a few nicks), and then on to the 4000 and 8000 Shaptons. I'm also doing about 50 strokes on each, which seems like what I need to raise a burr when freehand sharpening, but these are not usually the full length of the stone. I'm going to try Dave's advice, and try to match the level of polish to the purpose of the tool, so that, and frequent touching up should help. For most purposes, I hope the extra-fine dmt and the 4000 grit shapton will do.

[Garth Jones]

I have been using the method outlined in David Finck's book on making planes, and have been very happy with it. He goes straight from a freshly ground bevel to an 8000 grit waterstone. A few strokes is enough to put a small flat bevel on the blade, and get it razor sharp. The edge can be touched up with the 8000 grit stone. Later on he will use a 1000 grit stone followed by the 8000 grit stone. He makes a case in his book that intermediate grits are not needed and I have found that to be true. My blades are the sharpest they have ever been and I spend very little time on each sharpening step.

I agree with an earlier poster who said that sharpening gear must be convenient to use. I touch up my chisels frequently, but I only spend a few seconds each time.

Cheers,
Garth

[Gary Herrmann]

Pick a system and stick with it. I use diamond stones. I was also gifted with a Tormek recently. I like it. And I use a grinder but that's mostly for reshaping edges and turning tools. Wait, didn't I say stick with one system? Nuts.

But I gotta say - 16 HOURS sharpening? I don't think I could do it.

I did love the title of your post though. I knew immediately it was about sharpening. Having looked at my own abraded and stained with metal filings finger tips from time to time.

I've been mostly turning this summer. As soon as I hear the sound change I check the edge and go sharpen. My grinder is behind me when I'm at the lathe. I need to remember to try the Tormek and see if sharp lasts longer.