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View Full Version : FOR STEWIE: A back saw and a dovetail saw I made



george wilson
07-10-2011, 7:44 PM
Stewie wants to see these handles,but cannot access the FAQ section. I think you need to be a contributor to access it.

I urge everyone to make the small donation. It also allows access to the classified section,and I have made a few good purchases there. It is more than worth it.

Pic. #1 is a handle I liked from a Disston saw. I believe LN used the same handle later on when they came out with their saw.

#2 is from a saw I believe I liked in the Duncan Phyfe tool chest,when it was on loan to Wmsbg. many years ago. Been so long I can't be sure.

#3 is from my original Groves back saw. I liked it so much,I copied it. The last 2 pictures are of the same saws.

Study the curves carefully. Also,the way the handles are rounded. They aren't rounded the same amount all over,like you'd get if you ran a round router bit around them. Especially on the closed backsaw handle,the amount of roundness creates "thick and thin" lines as you'd see in calligraphy. Study the 2 different ways the 2 closed handled saws deal with the lamb's tongue. On the Disston,it is kept smooth. On the Groves,the tongue has a very tasteful "switch back" in it. Either way is perfectly acceptable AS LONG as it is done with GOOD CURVES.

I stamp both the backs and the handles in case they ever become separated. Some future historian will be able to identify a part he comes across.

Stewie,let me know if you see this. I had promised to post it,and somehow it slipped my mind when I was involved in another project. Also study Two Lawyer's handles,and Grammercys,and LN handles.

I encourage you to copy one or more of these handles here AS CLOSELY as you possibly can. Drawing them isn't good enough. By spending considerable CAREFUL time copying something,you will have a much better learning situation than just looking at something. Print out the pictures and enlarge them if you need to. Then,carefully sculpt them out of wood.

When I was young,I spent many hours TRACING pictures of old sailing ships. I had few tools to do much except make models,but I'm sure that looking at GOOD ART like 18th.C. sailing ships,and tracing them helped me to sharpen my own design skills.

How do you know what is good art? Usually something over 100 years old,or older,is going to have a good design to it. These days,anything goes,and taste is in the porcelain oasis.

Jim Paulson
07-11-2011, 8:03 AM
George,

I think the closed handles win out here in terms of beauty overall, especially the lamb's tongue. Those look like museum pieces.

Say for that stock on the handles, it is flat sawn curly maple right? I love the look of it and my efforts of obtaining pear or apple wood has not been successful. So I'm planning on making some handles in something like what you used here.

Jim

george wilson
07-11-2011, 10:18 AM
I have to agree. That closed handle is one of the nicest I have seen. Of course,I didn't design it! I must get to designing some saw handles,though. I was PAID to copy old tools at the Museum. Things like the Marquetry guitar,and the brass "loch Ness" shoulder plane I did design,and lots of other things I can't recall(what I have posted here),too.

Learning to make very close copies of GOOD designs like that handle do help you develop your own sense of design. If you spend hours and hours making a copy,rather than just a few minutes looking at an object,it does help sink into the old,concrete brain,it really does. You must have the SKILL development to make a good copy too,of course.

Chris Griggs
07-11-2011, 12:06 PM
George, you are dead on with spending the time copying the handles, and I fully agree that even just tracing can give you an excellent sense of shape and design. I've just been getting into making saw handles and have found that one of the most helpful things in getting them shaped properly was to first trace over other saw handle patterns.

I've spent hours tracing over Wenzloffs saw handle patterns and then, when adjustments to the pattern are necessary for a particular handle I make sure the changes fit the existing shape of original pattern.

Since I started doing this I've wasted far less wood, and shaping is coming out much nicer, as has my ability to pic out areas where more material may need to be removed. I've really been amazed at how much tracing and copying patterns has helped.

Also, I sure do love the closed groves handle - AWESOME!

Stewie Simpson
07-11-2011, 1:47 PM
Hi George. Thankyou for posting these photo's. My focus is directed straight away to the elegance of the closed handle design. Its natural shaping flows wonderfully to the eye. The finer points within the designs I have read and understood. Your abilities to reproduce such fine examples exemplifies your personal skills as a fine craftsman. On to another subject, I will replace the brass spine on the backsaw. I will forward the new pics to my original posting.

Regards; Stewie.

Klaus Kretschmar
07-11-2011, 2:37 PM
George,

when you showed 3 of those handles a few months ago I was really hooked with the closed backsaw handle. Now watching it again I'm hooked even more with it. All of the shown handles are beautiful but this ons stands out! It's for sure the most elegant closed handle I've ever seen. Magnificent design and perfect execution on the replica!

Klaus

john brenton
07-11-2011, 3:11 PM
Is the first handle as flat as it looks in the picture?

george wilson
07-11-2011, 4:00 PM
Yes. It is like the original Disston handle.

Mike Allen1010
07-11-2011, 6:57 PM
George,

Thank you not only for posting pictures of your saws, but also for your comments about execution and the benefits of copying classic design as a way to build one's design skills. I always enjoy studying pictures of your work and I especially appreciate your insights and suggestions about "how" you went about the project.

I don't always understand how you execute the detail and refinements in your work, but like great art I certainly do recognize and appreciate it. For a novice like me, your experience and perspective is very helpful! The incredibly crisp and flowing lines of the profiles of these handles really stand out to my eye as the work of a true master, and are examples of what I'm trying to say.

Thanks again, Mike

Salem Ganzhorn
07-11-2011, 7:14 PM
George, these look amazing. The crisp details and the way the champher opens up and gracefully closes is amazing.

What tools/techniques do you use to make those swooping champhers?!?
Thanks for sharing!
Salem