A boxwood turning I just finished today

[george wilson]

Been showing some old work,but I am still working in my home shop. Iffy whether I might have something worth while to show,though.

I wish I had laid a dime in the pictures,because these turnings are very petite and very delicate. 1/2" maximum diameter. This is for an 18th.C. ivory swift. A swift is something that expanded outwards like an umbrella,a you wrapped your yarn around it (to measure it,I suppose). I don't use these items,so may not always know exactly what they do.

The original boxwood shaft was too short to remain on the swift when it is collapsed,so my customer wanted a longer one.

This was a VERY FUSSY job. First,get box that won't warp(not easy). I have some Maraciabo which also was used in making the folding rules. It looks very much like the boxwood on the original part,too.

Next,cut non standard threads perfectly without ANY shattering allowed. Next,turn the little decorative head,without any crumbling off allowed on those very thin edged details. Finally,TRY to stain the new part to match the original. This is really a hard thing for me to do. It is very difficult to match what 200 years of light have done to boxwood. I got reasonably close,but am better at matching old ivory.

You've GOT to respect those 18th.C. craftsmen who did this work with a treadle lathe and hand propelled threading combs. There were threading lathes as seen in Diderot,but most work was done by just learning to move the threading tool along at exactly the right speed. no doubt these were specialists who only ever did such work every day.

The ivory piece screwed onto the new thread is a little water cup to moisten the finger tips. The other end screws onto the ivory clamp.

[Joel Moskowitz]

George,
Nice stuff. I happen to like fussy little turnings very much.
Have you ever heard/read about Bill Jones? He is the last of the apprenticed ivory turners (now in his 80's) and wrote two books on turning. Part of his job was chasing threads on everything. even simple stuff like ivory studs are threaded together to save ivory and chasing threads was a typical operation done dozens of times in a day. It was not a specialist operation at all - just something practice made easy. Boxes with screwed on lids were a mass market item and a simple chess piece could have 4 or 5 screwed joints.

[george wilson]

I haven't heard of him(that I can recall). I have made replacement parts for ivory chess sets that were threaded together. They were white,and red. The red stain on the ivory was cochineal. But,if you don't do the process correctly,cochineal makes more like a purplish stain. They made a lot of those sets in China. They always had the same thread,27 tpi,I believe. At least,I made myself a threading comb that size. Just noticed it the other day while using my lathe. I haven't made replacement parts for those chess sets for several years. Folks don't know about me,or don't want to spend the money,I guess.

The castle had the most parts,I think. The little spire on top was easily lost. I suppose they threaded them together to save ivory. Any other reason? Threading ivory is a tricky business till you get the knack. It is very treacherous,and can blow up into pieces in a nano second. Watch out,eyes!! It's violent!!

Those threading combs had straight up and down teeth. No effort was made to angle the teeth to help produce a lead on the threads. I made mine with a lead. Someone complained about there being no lead on those combs in a 19th.C. book I read.

[ray hampton]

how hard would it be to cut threads with a file and or knife ?

[george wilson]

You would have to be very very skillful to file threads in and have them be the correct lead,and diameter,and look smooth. A knife would not be suitable. I have seen hand chiseled threads on large cider presses,where the threads were,say,8" in diameter,and maybe over 1" wide per thread. Then,they were rough and full of random facets.

[ray hampton]

but the early blacksmith and or gunsmith made their own files that they could cut threads with in metal and wood

[Joel Moskowitz]

I haven't heard of him(that I can recall). I have made replacement parts for ivory chess sets that were threaded together. They were white,and red. The red stain on the ivory was cochineal. But,if you don't do the process correctly,cochineal makes more like a purplish stain. They made a lot of those sets in China. They always had the same thread,27 tpi,I believe. At least,I made myself a threading comb that size. Just noticed it the other day while using my lathe. I haven't made replacement parts for those chess sets for several years. Folks don't know about me,or don't want to spend the money,I guess.

The castle had the most parts,I think. The little spire on top was easily lost. I suppose they threaded them together to save ivory. Any other reason? Threading ivory is a tricky business till you get the knack. It is very treacherous,and can blow up into pieces in a nano second. Watch out,eyes!! It's violent!!

Those threading combs had straight up and down teeth. No effort was made to angle the teeth to help produce a lead on the threads. I made mine with a lead. Someone complained about there being no lead on those combs in a 19th.C. book I read.


George,
I think you will find the books fascinating. Bill Jones "Notes from the Turning Shop" and "Further Notes from the Turning Shop" Last I looked they were both out of print but it is worth the search.

Saving ivory was important, and threading sections together was done totally instantaneously and freehand with chasers. It makes total sense if you think about it. The number of chess sets made was pretty small considering - he is a third generation ivory turner and I think his father made a specialty of chess sets but it wasn't a bread and butter item.
On an ivory pair of shirt studs, which he made by the thousands, if you turned the entire piece from one chunk of ivory you would not only waste all the ivory at the back where the stem is, you would waste tons of time turning the blank down. So they used bits of ivory - which were lots cheaper, and added a thread.

[george wilson]

Ray,where did you hear that? How do you file threads inside a hole? I worked in a museum 39 years as toolmaker. We used screw plates and taps. I made some of them. You have to make taps,then use them to thread holes in a screw plate. The threads of the taps were originated with threading combs usually.

Joel,You'll get no argument about saving ivory!! It's even MORE important now. As I mentioned,threading was to save ivory. I did leave it open to see if you had other reasons to thread ivory.

[Joel Moskowitz]

George,
if your comment #8 is about my post - it's all in the Jones books.

[george wilson]

My first comment was to Ray. I should have put his name up.

[ray hampton]

Ray,where did you hear that? How do you file threads inside a hole? I worked in a museum 39 years as toolmaker. We used screw plates and taps. I made some of them. You have to make taps,then use them to thread holes in a screw plate. The threads of the taps were originated with threading combs usually.

Joel,You'll get no argument about saving ivory!! It's even MORE important now. As I mentioned,threading was to save ivory. I did leave it open to see if you had other reasons to thread ivory.
george, first you file the threads on a piece of steel to make a tap then use the tap to make a screw plate and die-set, I were a novice gunsmith-seller[ long time ago]

[george wilson]

Thank you for informing me,Ray. I were never a novice gunsmith.

That could have been done in medieval times,but not too recently. Not impossible a remote frontier gunsmith could have done it. At a certain point,you can starve making files and threading tackle. You need paying work,like actual gunsmithing.
In Germany in the old days,they made apprentices make their own files,and file out a perfect cube of steel with them. That was more a training exercise,and a development of iron will type thing,though,I believe. I have spent thousands of hours removing large amounts of steel with files when I was young and poor,having nothing else. Guess it paid off for me.