Stairway Tread nosing question

[Sean Rainaldi]

Hi,

I am finishing up the staircase I built and am now planing down my white oak treads. I used 3/4" baltic birch for the sub treads and will be nailing or screwing down the oak onto the birch so the total tread thickness will be 1 3/8". Most of my top treads are being planed down to 5/8" mainly because that is about as thick as I can make them to get our the warping and bowing - most of my lumber starts out at 7/8. So I am gluing them up.into a 10" wide tread - will be 9" after accounting for the nosing.

I have enough thick boards for my nosing to meet the nosing requirement. My question is - do you think if I went with either 3/4 or 7/8 inch radius (thick) nosing, attaching that last nosing board to the 5/8" tread (rabet on the underside of the nosing) - is 5/8" enough meat on the edge of the oak tread to glue to - to prevent that thicker nosing from eventually breaking off the glue joint...with the constant foot traffic on the edge of the tread?

I was planning on both gluing the nosing to the oak tread edge and also gluing it to the sub tread and the screwing the underside of the nosing piece to the underside of the sub tread via pocket holes.

In my state they require a minimum of I believe 3/4 or 7/8 nosing on the tread but tread thickeness is not specified.

I have three stringers by the way.

[Chris Padilla]

My question is - do you think if I went with either 3/4 or 7/8 inch radius (thick) nosing, attaching that last nosing board to the 5/8" tread (rabet on the underside of the nosing) - is 5/8" enough meat on the edge of the oak tread to glue to - to prevent that thicker nosing from eventually breaking off the glue joint...with the constant foot traffic on the edge of the tread?

I was planning on both gluing the nosing to the oak tread edge and also gluing it to the sub tread and the screwing the underside of the nosing piece to the underside of the sub tread via pocket holes.

Your plan sounds good to me.

[Chip Lindley]

After you achieve a "perfect" fit between the half-round nosing strip and the edge of the tread and kickboard, attach the bullnose with plate joiner or with a long hardboard spline in a routed groove. Use one of the brands of Roo/Gorilla glue to attach. I shot 18ga. brad nails in only to hold until the glue dried. I did my stairway like this almost 10 years ago and the bullnose has survived nicely.

199041

[Sean Rainaldi]

Thanks Chip.

What radius round over did you use?

[Charles Lent]

I agree with everything except for the Gorilla Glue. Titebond II or a similar product would be my choice. I have built 2 stairways using Titebond products and neither one has had a squeak or other failure develop.

Charley

[John TenEyck]

FWIW, the glue strength tests I've read showed Titebond was substantially stronger than Gorilla Glue.

[Chip Lindley]

I used a 1/2" roundover bit on both edges of 1-1/16" stock. After sanding it looks nice.

[Peter Quinn]

I make a lot of treads professionally, and my advice is you DO NOT glue a thick nosing tomthe edge of a thin tread, this is not a strong situation even with a good glue joint. It may last, it may not, you find out when granny takes a slide down a flight of stairs. Typically we add thickness to the bottom of the tread the width of the nosing , the glue line disappears easily in the round over so it looks better too.

For example, say you need a 7/8 thick nosing that overhangs the riser 1 1/4"' and your tread is 5/8" thick. I would glue a 1/4" X 1 1/4" strip to the underside of the leading edge. We usually shoot a few brads in to hold the location then clamp them up in stacks of 4-5 opposing nosing at each tread. This way each tread acts as the other cauls. The round over is typically a bit over the thickness of the tread to create more of a thumbnail than a perfect round. We use a 1 1/8" round on 1 1/16" treads for example. This gives your foot a bit more traction as it leaves the stair.

[Sean Rainaldi]

Thanks much Peter!

AH I got it - at first I was confused - you mean then that the nosing of the tread is the tread itself....i.e. for example for a glued up 10" wide tread the leading edge of the tread is itself the nosing and then just add more thickness on the underside of the leading edge? The glue joint is on the underside of the leading edge of the tread and the strip underside is just for appearances right?

If thats correct - my question is.....you really only have 5/8 thick oak on that leading edge and the underside is just filler for appearance...so my question is, is 5/8" white Oak thick enough to provide enough strength for a 1 or 1 1/4" over hang?

I wanted to go thicker on the treads but although my oak boards are beautiful many of then needed to be planed down to 5/8 to get out all the warp and surface imperfections...

...also, the edge of that 1/4 strip on the underside of the nosing that buts up against the riser....should that be either attached or glued to the riser for extra strength...or is that not necessary?

[Chris Padilla]

...also, the edge of that 1/4 strip on the underside of the nosing that buts up against the riser....should that be either attached or glued to the riser for extra strength...or is that not necessary?

I think if you cut the tread just right, the overhang should be relatively snug up against the riser and thus support it. Since the top of the overhang is a continuous board (using Peter's idea), it will take the brunt of force over time and not the glue line/overhang piece. I suppose you could glue it to the riser but I wouldn't: you might have wood movement issues (boards cracking) if you glue up the entire staircase this way as they won't have any room to move as the seasons change.

Modern PVAs (yellow glue) like any of the TB I - III are very strong and stronger than the wood. Glue up some scrap oak and test it yourself. I bet the oak breaks somewhere other than the glue line.