casting resin questions

[allen thunem]

anyone out there willing to share some thoughts, ideas, or insights on how they cast blanks for pens and anything else turnable? or a sight or publication or video that deals with this?
I don't think i'm the only one out here who has questions.

[Lionel Mercier]

Hello Allen
I tried this technique twice
The resin used is the epoxy (A + B)
I poured the resin into a form close to what I wanted to turn
in this form, sticks of wood that will be visible in the resin were stuck
it was in order to turn a bowl and the core was occupied by waste timber (not to squander)
Some comments:
1/ Problem with the bubbles that remain in the hollow ceiling
2/ explain what we will do to the resin merchant (he know the product)
3/ use the resin as soon as possible after opening of the bottles (it does not keep more than 6 to 8
months)
For more information:
http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?117935-Champagne
and the second attempt, I don't remember showing here on the creek, there is the link on the AFTAB
forum (text is in French but there are pictures)
http://www.aftab-asso.com/html/forum/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=4169

Good luck, Lionel.

[David Warkentin]

There are piles of info on IAP about casting...Hope I can post this here. If not please remove it, moderators.

[Greg Ketell]

Alumilite makes some really pleasant resin to use. It is a two part, 1:1 ratio urethane (I think) resin that has no smell to it at all. The Water Clear http://alumilite.com/ProdDetail.cfm?Category=Casting%20Resins&Name=Alumilite%20Water%20Clear was developed with the help of a pen turner and will turn easily and polish up like glass with no extra coating needed. You mix your additives to part B and when you have the color just exactly the way you want it you double your additives. When it is smooth and well mixed you add equal parts of Part A. Mix gently so you don't get a lot of bubbles, then pour into your mold. It will be ready to turn in 10 minutes or so. Applying pressure helps eliminate any bubbles you might have created but is not absolutely necessary.

Polyester resin is what a lot of pen blanks are made from and I can tell you that it STINKS, both in the casting and the turning. It is a 1-part with activator. You mix the color you want then add the activator and mix that in very thoroughly. You add a few drops of activator per ounce of resin. How many drops depends on temp, humidity, tints, fillers, its mood, etc. Very temperamental. It takes hours to fully set which gives you time to apply vacuum and pressure if you want to be 100% sure of no bubbles. The surface remains tacky so you can add layers if that is the look you are going for.

I've made pen blanks using both and MUCH prefer the Alumilite.

Here are a couple of samples I've done:
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[Jim Burr]

There are several kits you can pick up from the big suppliers...CSUSA, Woodcraft, etc that will help you get started. They are pricey, but you can decide if you like it. Check youtube for "casting pen blanks" one of the helpful guys from IAP has some great videos on casting...it's how I started. For simple coloring, powder coat dye powder can be purchased at HF...red, black and white, IIRC. Pearl EX is great stuff for coloring. Ebay usually has a 30 ct sampler for cheap. Cut up an old cutting board to make a 1x1x6 mold and fasten it with Stainless screws for re use. After I fill them, I'll rattle it on the bandsaw to shake out the bubbles. I cast 8 blanks last week, turned Jr Gent last weekend and sold 6 in a day. Not a bad way to make spending money!

[Grant Wilkinson]

Just to take a different position than Greg's, I, too, have used both and prefer the stinky poly resin. :-)

As stated above, you will find many articles on casting pen blanks on penturners. org. There are as many ways to do it "right" as there are people doing it. However, the information is excellent. I have found that using poly resin, heating it and the molds, and using pressure is damn close to being fool proof as far as voids and bubbles are concerned.

Have fun. The possibilities really are endless.

[Greg Ketell]

ah yes, youtube. Do a search for user Grub32. He has many good videos about casting. He too uses PR.

[Jim Burr]

What are using for tint and color Greg?

[Greg Ketell]

What are using for tint and color Greg?

Pearl ex by Jacquard for the metal-look and alumilite dyes IF I think the colors need adjustment. Not often. I usually use two mixes per color. You can really see it in the green&yello blank. For each color there is one mix that is primarily the color and then another that is mostly sparkle.

[Lupe Duncan]

As Greg said Grub has some videos on YouTube.

I prefer Silmar41 from US composites for acrylic blanks. Its a polyester resin and It does smell but no more than my wife's "Finger-nail" stuff. I just use it in a well ventilated area and I like it better than the Alumilite for Acrylic Banks. No CA coat for that "wet Look". If I were to make a hybrid Acrylic/Wood blank THEN I prefer the the Alumilite.

Silmar41- stinky, cheaper, doesn't necessarily need pressure, can get "chippy" while turning, Polishes to a HIGH gloss more tempramental while pouring different colors together. Just takes practice to get the "swirls" from blending.

Alumilite- more expensive, 1:1 mix ratio BY WEIGHT is critical, no harsh odor, NEEDS pressure pot to eliminate bubbles, turns very nicely, not as high a gloss as Silmar41(more of a matte finish), Short work time about 10-15 min.

My colors I get online but hobbylobby or Michaels will have Jaquard brand micas for the pearl look. I use Mixol dyes for PR and the alumilite dyes for alumilite,,,... With the Jaquard you rerallty dont need any other colors untill you really get into it.

Its a Blast......

[Faust M. Ruggiero]

I don't mix and pour resins myself but I have an acquaintance who carves original items then makes molds and pours copies. Like many of you, bubbles troubled him in the beginning. He solved that problem by allowing the filled molds to cure in a vacuum chamber. If you only pour small items like pen blanks, you can probably make one from a piece of steel pipe and a few fittings connected to your lathe's vacuum system.
faust

[Greg Ketell]

As Greg said Grub has some videos on YouTube.

I prefer Silmar41 from US composites for acrylic blanks. Its a polyester resin and It does smell but no more than my wife's "Finger-nail" stuff. I just use it in a well ventilated area and I like it better than the Alumilite for Acrylic Banks. No CA coat for that "wet Look". If I were to make a hybrid Acrylic/Wood blank THEN I prefer the the Alumilite.

Silmar41- stinky, cheaper, doesn't necessarily need pressure, can get "chippy" while turning, Polishes to a HIGH gloss more tempramental while pouring different colors together. Just takes practice to get the "swirls" from blending.

Alumilite- more expensive, 1:1 mix ratio BY WEIGHT is critical, no harsh odor, NEEDS pressure pot to eliminate bubbles, turns very nicely, not as high a gloss as Silmar41(more of a matte finish), Short work time about 10-15 min.

My colors I get online but hobbylobby or Michaels will have Jaquard brand micas for the pearl look. I use Mixol dyes for PR and the alumilite dyes for alumilite,,,... With the Jaquard you rerallty dont need any other colors untill you really get into it.

Its a Blast......

I agree with Almost everything. Just a couple of "points of dispute".

The original Alumilite Clear was a matt finish and needed CA to get to a high gloss. But the Water Clear polishes up just as well as PR. And pressure is only needed if you mix a lot of air into it while mixing the A&B parts. If you are careful, no pressure is needed. That Sage-green block had no pressure and there were no voids. And it was cast at the kitchen table. :-)

[Jim Underwood]

If I were to try it, (and I might one day), I'd probably use a combination of heat and vacuum to pull bubbles out of the casting, then pressure to compress whatever bubbles were left in.This assumes a longer working time, of course...

That's what several IAP casters do, or so I've read...

[Lupe Duncan]

I agree with Almost everything. Just a couple of "points of dispute".

The original Alumilite Clear was a matt finish and needed CA to get to a high gloss. But the Water Clear polishes up just as well as PR. And pressure is only needed if you mix a lot of air into it while mixing the A&B parts. If you are careful, no pressure is needed. That Sage-green block had no pressure and there were no voids. And it was cast at the kitchen table. :-)

Well I guess YMMV.....
I cant get a "Wet Candy" look on the New water clear Alumilite not the same way as I can with the PR. and I tried without the presure and got a blank that oozed out of the mold filled with bubbles. Kinda looked cool, like red soda. I still may turn it....

Greg, got a pic of your Sage green sample turned and polished?

[Jim Burr]

I have to back Lupe on the gloss point. I can get a good semi gloss with alumilite...but the PR wet sands to a great taffy gloss if indeed thats what you are looking for.

[Greg Ketell]

Well I guess YMMV.....
I cant get a "Wet Candy" look on the New water clear Alumilite not the same way as I can with the PR. and I tried without the presure and got a blank that oozed out of the mold filled with bubbles. Kinda looked cool, like red soda. I still may turn it....

Greg, got a pic of your Sage green sample turned and polished?

So pressure doesn't make it set; it sets with or without pressure so if it didn't set then you had a chemical reaction. Wanna see a good one? Add one drop of water to your mix. But be prepared to clean up quite a mess!!

Here is the sage pen and one of a clear blank with rose petals. You can see how clear it is and you can see the shine on all of them. Click for bigger versions.
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197360

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[David Warkentin]

That rose petal pen is cool. Got any blanks?

[allen thunem]

thanks for all the insight. i guess what i was really asking is if anyone will share techniques on how they get fishing flies and rose petals and such into their pen
or whatever?

[Jim Burr]

Ha!!! Sorry Allen...we get carried away sometimes. There is a great tutorial on IAP addressing feathers and the like. For flys...stick with #1's, the others have been found by others to be to big to cast.

[Greg Ketell]

That rose petal pen is cool. Got any blanks?

I've asked my friend who made the blank if he has any more. I'll let you know if he does.


thanks for all the insight. i guess what i was really asking is if anyone will share techniques on how they get fishing flies and rose petals and such into their pen
or whatever?

Ahhh, ok. Well, if you are trying to do thinks like the rose petals, grass, hay, beans, etc, you use VERY dry material, pack it into your mold pretty tightly, then pour your resin over it over-filling the blank a little (to account for the nooks and crannies that will absorb the resin slowly). Then you apply pressure and let it set. If you are casting very porous material like grass or cloth then PR is better because you will want to apply pressure then open it and add a little more resin then apply pressure again. If it is solid items you are casting then a single pour would be enough. Once the blank is done curing you just cut it, drill it, and turn it like any other blank. If you use transparent or clear resin then you will want to paint the inside of the hole before you glue in the tubes. On the rose pen I painted it with a pearlescent paint followed by gold paint.

For the flies it is a multi-pour process. You use a vertical mold and cast the body (where the tubes will go) then after that gels you cast a little bit of clear. When that jells you set you fly or any other item to encase into the clear just enough to hold it into place/direction you want it and cast the remaining clear. Honestly this works better with bottle stoppers where you have more room. But I have seen it done with pen blanks for BIG pens.

[Tim Rinehart]

Greg, beautiful pens...I really like them both. The color of the green one is great and the ivory back tone of the rose petal one is very rich looking.


For anyone interested, I just read a nice article today in Woodturning Design, June issue, with an article on this topic by Kurt Hertzog. He talks about the PR he uses with great tips on mold making and so forth.

[Greg Ketell]

Greg, beautiful pens...I really like them both. The color of the green one is great and the ivory back tone of the rose petal one is very rich looking.

Thank you!! The green one is my favorite kind of pen to do. The customer sent me a picture and said "can you make a pen like this?":
197389

I think I got pretty close! She was definitely happy!!

[Shawn Koehn]

I too would be interested in one of your rose petal blanks. I need to make pen for my brothers wedding probably an areo pen.

[Greg Ketell]

That rose petal pen is cool. Got any blanks?


I too would be interested in one of your rose petal blanks. I need to make pen for my brothers wedding probably an areo pen.

I talked with my friend. He has two "blocks" of rose petal blanks. Each will make 3 full-size blanks (and maybe one sierra). One block is the dark red rose petals I used the other is a mix of yellow, orange, white. I honestly don't know what those would look like turned. He asked for $10/blank.

If you are interested send me an email and we can finish the conversation off the forum so we don't break any rules.

[John Terefenko]

anyone out there willing to share some thoughts, ideas, or insights on how they cast blanks for pens and anything else turnable? or a sight or publication or video that deals with this?
I don't think i'm the only one out here who has questions.



Allen you got alot of great replys and all I can add is do check out both the IAP pen turning site and also the Utube sites for videos. I use Silmar41 and find it very easy to control and yes it does smell but as all things you provide good ventalation when working with it and use safely.

As far as coloring goes the use of pigments and pearls need to be sampled and records kept to duplicate if ever needed again. To me there are way too many people and companies that sell already made colored blanks and unless you are trying to duplicate a certain color for teams or something else there is no need to cast these.

To me the real money maker and real value to casting on your own is to clear cast. This is to embedd objects in a clear resin and use for many things such as pens, bottlestoppers, pare weighjts and fishing lures.

Here again I use Silmar41 and do use a pressure pot from HF. I never go over 45lbs so it is plenty safe to use for this application. Pressure is need to disapate the small tiny bubbles that can develop when pouring. I always heat my resin before adding the catalyst and this helps to thin the resin and elimainate most bubbles. I also pour to a side to help eliminate bubbles. But so many things can be clear casted and the imagination is the only thing holding one back. Here are some examples of some metal braidings I used to cover some pen tubes and then cast in clear resin. Good luck and have fun.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v233/JTTHECLOCKMAN/IMGP0619.jpg



http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v233/JTTHECLOCKMAN/IMGP0622.jpg

[Greg Ketell]

Those are gorgeous pens, John! Do you recall what the source of the braid was for the "sierra" on the far right?

[John Terefenko]

Those are gorgeous pens, John! Do you recall what the source of the braid was for the "sierra" on the far right?


Thanks. From left to right they are brass, stainless steel, copper and chrome. I got the chrome braiding from here http://cableorganizer.com/cable-sleeving/