A Hart inspired failure

[David E Keller]

I keep seeing these graceful vase forms that John Hart posts, and I very much wanted to emulate that grace in something... I failed:mad:. This is a piece of spalted silver maple that I roughed out about 18 months ago, and it seemed like a good choice for the inspiration piece. The collar is holly. It's about 10 inches tall and just finished with shellac at this point.

The proportions are all wrong and the whole thing looks frumpy to me. I like the colors, but the base is too wide and the neck too small. Sorry I ruined your good name by association with this piece, John:o.

Let 'er rip boys and girls... Brutality is encouraged and expected.:D
195042

[Ted Calver]

David...don't be so hart on yourself. John doesn't have any Freudian images hiding in the grain on his pieces. Looks pretty cool to me. :) :)

[Richard Madden]

Don't be so hard on yourself. I certainly would not call it a failure by any means....no, wait...maybe it is, and maybe you should send it to me for proper display...I mean disposal.
Heck, if you see things you would change, then go ahead and do another. Personally I think it's nice.

[Curt Fuller]

About the only thing I see that could be improved is the curve on the lower 1/3 of the form. It seems to straighten out. Continuing the curve would give it a smaller base and a more delicate look. But I think the wood is beautiful and the neck and upper 2/3 look really great. You just haven't quite finished the lesson from Mr. Hart.

[Roger Chandler]

David........nice piece of wood, the curve is nice, and I agree with you that if the base and the neck were more in proportion you would have hit a home run.........this is probably a good triple! Hollowing that deep is a challenge in and of itself........were you able to get real close on the bottom and what is the wall thickness?

[Steve Schlumpf]

I agree with Curt - nothing wrong with the top section... just seems that the foot and curve leading to it are a little off. Seeing as how you were modeling this after Hart.... did you make sure there were plenty of lacquer fumes in the air while turning? Could have something to do with it!

[John Hart]

Yup...I have to agree....Nothing wrong with the top. The variations on the mouth are endless....it's like icing. And when I turn the piece sideways...the bottom doesn't seem that wide. And it doesn't seem that straight either.
This is the exact problem I had. Actually, this piece looks like ALOT of my pieces!! It took me a while to disregard my tendency to say, "that's enough" and then force myself to keep going smaller. I like it. The wood is awesome!!
195049

[David DeCristoforo]

Oh yeah. That's a real piece of crap. Might as well send it to me....

[Tim Thiebaut]

I LIKE this, if I had turned this I would be jumping for joy!!! LOL I have recently been really drawn to holly...and I havnt even been able to find any here yet, but just looking at it I love it, and love the constrasts that you can make with it, and I think it looks great on the neck of this piece.

[Dan Forman]

It's winking at me! ;) A lot going on in that wood.

Dan

[Karl Card]

Personally I like it. It has lots of activity, or the wood has lots of grain activity. When I first saw it the first thing I thought is wondering if that particular piece of wood was a pita to work or turn.

[John Keeton]

I agree with Curt - nothing wrong with the top section... just seems that the foot and curve leading to it are a little off. Seeing as how you were modeling this after Hart.... did you make sure there were plenty of lacquer fumes in the air while turning? Could have something to do with it!I agree with Curt and Steve. But, then, modeling anything after Hart would require it to be "a little off!";) :D Now, his turnings are another matter - they clearly pass the mental health test!:rolleyes:

David, I love the wood combo, and the concept is great. I take it there is not enough wood in the base (lower 1/3) to do anything with. You normally hollow pretty thin.

[Michelle Rich]

Just turn the foot area in a bit, trim the flare a tad on the neck, and she'd sell at just about any gallery. Gorgeous wood, good height, neat collar to match the light color in the vase body..a few nips and a few tucks, and she's a beauty.

[Bob Rotche]

I think the body is actually very nicely done. One could tuck the bottom in a bit more and that may add a bit to the flow and lighten it a little but I really think that part is very well done. My problem with it is the neck piece. If I block that off with my finger, it looks like a classic vase shape. When I add the neck back in, it strikes me as too small (like a very good looking person with a tiny head). I think the shape of the neck piece is excellent and would really add to the whole if it was a bit larger. Keep in mind that I am one of the less experienced members of this forum so take that with a grain of salt and don't be so hard on yourself because you are very close to a beautiful piece.

[Tim Rinehart]

First glance, beautiful piece, and I suspect most would agree. Under the 'critical eye', we can can find stuff in the best of everyone's work. Sure, a little straight at bottom, but I like size of base for height of this vessel. Top could have been a bit larger to proportion of base...but ok as it is.
You took a gorgeous piece of wood and made it something the vast majority will look at and like...and perhaps use.

[bob svoboda]

I agree with the others. Needs less base and more lacquer....Overall a success and a very nice bit of wood.

[Baxter Smith]

Beautiful piece of wood David with a lot of plusses going for it overall. I have turned only one piece of spalted silver maple that had the same beautiful swirling grey on the outside. (I wonder if that is a characteristic of that species?) At the very least, it gives you something to compare to and improve upon when you try the next one! (at least thats how I try and look at most of mine)

[Cathy Schaewe]

I like it a lot. Yes, you could pick a bunch of nits, but for your first try at a new form, I think it's excellent. The biggest nit I would pick, I suppose, is that it would look better if the bottom was turned under a bit, rather than seeming to sit square on a table. See Andy DiPietro's work to see what I mean.

Personally, I'd be quite proud to have turned it.
Also, did you get that deep with your monster?

[Jim Burr]

Great chunk of wood doc...almost looks like Buckeye! My only thought would be a more pronounced radius to the bottom. I'd put flowers in it...give it to Mrs Doc...get the "You should't have" smooch...hit the Lazy Boy with a big 'ol smile...next project!

[Reed Gray]

I don't usually critique, but if it were mine, I would have carried the upward sweep a little higher before rounding over to the top and collar. Nice looking piece. I really need to start doing more hollow forms. Might be an interesting experiment to check the curves with a catenary curve (light pull chain, and gravity curve) and see how it matches.

robo hippy

[David E Keller]

Thanks to all for comments, criticism, and suggestions.


....were you able to get real close on the bottom and what is the wall thickness?
It's hollowed all the way down, and the walls are pretty thin already... Maybe an eighth. The collar practically doubles the weight of the piece.


You just haven't quite finished the lesson from Mr. Hart.

Agreed! 'Grasshopper' I remain.


... Seeing as how you were modeling this after Hart.... did you make sure there were plenty of lacquer fumes in the air while turning? Could have something to do with it!

Perhaps this was my biggest mistake. This entire piece was turned in the absence of lacquer. I'm actually afraid to say this as it may jeopardize my friendship with John... I don't even own any lacquer.:o


...When I first saw it the first thing I thought is wondering if that particular piece of wood was a pita to work or turn.

No trouble at all, Karl. It's very light weight wood, but I didn't have any trouble with tear out or anything like that.


...I take it there is not enough wood in the base (lower 1/3) to do anything with. You normally hollow pretty thin.

You are correct, sir!(Should be read like Ed McMahon) One of the problems I've noticed with returning to roughouts at this point in my turning development is that the things I thought I did fairly well a year and a half ago are really not very good at all. I kind of committed to this form during the roughout, and I removed too much wood from the inside bottom of the piece. I tried like crazy to tuck that curve in more at the bottom, but I just didn't have the wood to do it. I think the piece would look better if it were about 2 inches shorter with a much smaller foot, but I still can't figure out how to put wood back where I've removed it.:mad:


....Also, did you get that deep with your monster?

i did most of this hollowing by hand, but I did go back with the scraper tips to clean up the inside... I'm kind of in a hollow by hand phase right now, so the monster is not getting much of a workout.


...I'd put flowers in it...give it to Mrs Doc...get the "You should't have" smooch...hit the Lazy Boy with a big 'ol smile...next project!

If only it were that easy!:D


I don't usually critique, but if it were mine, I would have carried the upward sweep a little higher before rounding over to the top and collar. Nice looking piece. I really need to start doing more hollow forms. Might be an interesting experiment to check the curves with a catenary curve (light pull chain, and gravity curve) and see how it matches.

robo hippy

Thanks, Reed. I'd love to see some of your hollow forms. Heck, I'd love to see some photos of your bowls(not bowels:p). I'll give the old 'dangling chain' trick a try sometime.

[John Hart]

... I don't even own any lacquer.:o

What? :eek:

I.....I don't know what to say! :confused:

[Reed Gray]

If I ever do learn to take pics and post them, you are all in trouble.

I have never been a fan of small bottoms, err, maybe I should say small bases. I am the kind of guy who can walk into a room with a piece that has a tiny base, not even close the door, and it will fall over and every one turns and looks at me with that 'what did you do' look.

robo hippy

[David DeCristoforo]

What with all of the distracting stuff going on, there has hardly been time to focus or comment on other stuff. I have looked at this at least a dozen times and the simple fact is, I love it! It does "buck the trend" of smallfootedness but the overall shape is very appealing. The light colored collar picks up the lighter tones in the wood and pulls the eye right up to the top. The "larger" base lends a sense of stability that many of these forms lack.