Drum Sanders - some advice please

[Mark Ashmeade]

I'm in the market for a drum sander. I have two specific applications in mind for it:

1. Flattening/sanding end-grain chopping boards. Hand sanding with a belt sander is just too much work for such a simple item to get decent results. I have intentions of making small-scale production runs of these.
2. I'd like to make a good workbench in the next year or so, so flattening the top is on the list. If it's any good, perhaps I'll make the odd one to sell.

I looked at the Delta -260X. I don't like the idea of the belt moving and the head being fixed. For workbench tops, that would mean a lot of fiddling with infeed and outfeed supports. If the head moved and the belt didn't, that would be better. However, it's cheap, a decent brand, and will work dandy for the chopping boards, I think.

I also looked at the Jet 22-44, There seem to be two iterations of this, one with a dog-bone stand, the other with a box stand. They're about $500 different in price, and I can't for the life of me work out what's significantly different other than the stand. This would do just fine for both applications, but I'm still hesitant about the open end. It just seems like it's not as strong as a closed end drum sander. But then again, aeroplane wings are open end and don't fall off. They do flex though!

Then I looked at the dual drum sanders. It seems I can get a Woodtek, Accura, Steel City and Laguna that are all basically the same machine. I can't see any significant difference in them other than cost. I think I'd probably get the Laguna, just so I can say "I have a Laguna machine". These machines appeal because they will do more work more quickly than a single drum. Cost is about the same as the more expensive Jet. They also have the closed end "peace of mind". There's also the Woodmaster, and that seems OK too. The dual drum sanders have the same issue as the Delta in that they move the belt up and down. However, I won't be making that many workbench tops...

So, that's where I'm at in terms of functionality. Cost wise, the Delta would just about do the job, despite its shortcomings for about half of what the dual drums or Jet 22-44 would cost. BUT, if I'm investing in a machine that I have small scale production aspirations for, I think I ought to go a bit higher up the food chain. I don't like green machines BTW - so the Grizzly and Woodtek are probably out. Irrational I know, but if I can't stand to look at the thing, I'm unlikely to use it :)

I'm leaning toward the Laguna for about $2500 shipped. A lot of money, so I'd value any endorsements or counterpoints people can contribute. Thanks in advance!

[John Coloccia]

My opinion is fuggetaboud flattening workbench tops. That's a job for a wide belt IMHO. A workbench top can weight 100+ lbs and those little sanders are just not up to it. I think a little sander would be just right for the cutting board job, though.

As far as making workbench tops, were I wanting to do this I would build the top and then take it down to my local lumberyard and have them toss it on their Timesaver. I think he charges me $60 an hour shop time in 15 minute increments, so a few minutes on the wide belt would cost me a whopping $15. I can flatten a lot of tops like this before I've paid for a wide belt!

Anyhow, that's just my opinion. If I had it to do again, I would probably have a wide belt of some sort instead of my drum sander, and I certainly wouldn't spend $2500 on any drum sander.

[Mark Ashmeade]

Those are fair points, John, thanks. It does beg the question though, what market are the $2500 dual drum sanders aimed at?

[John Coloccia]

I think the market is cabinet makers, specifically doors and things. You can pass through items like that all day long and seriously cut down your sanding time. If that was the kind of work I did, I would almost certainly have some sort of dual drum sander because it would make me money. The rest of us are looking to use it as an abrasive planer, not necessarily a finish tool. For my money, I'd rather have a single drum sander, and then I can do the finish sanding with my Speed Bloc or a ROS. Once the surface is level...I mean really level...finish sanding is trivial. Even if you want to final sand on the drum, you can run a bunch through at a coarser grit, change the grit and run them through again. It takes me just a couple of minutes to change the grit on my Jet. Once you do it once or twice, it's a pretty trivial procedure. I've personally never been happy with the finish I get, though, and always have to follow it up with some sort of ROS sander. The drum can leave a pretty obvious linear sanding pattern especially if it doesn't oscillate.

[David Kumm]

Look at used performax sanders. They are very good. I have a 25x2 that I would sell for less than $1000. They are great for veneer work, raised panel sanding- because often the best grain match puts the boards in opposing directions, taking out a slight cup or bow from a board etc. Not meant to be used instead of a planer but a great addition to it. It also dosn't replace final hand or random orbital sander but gets cabinet doors flat for the final sanding. Dave

[Erik Christensen]

What John said - a home shop drum would be great for the cutting boards but for workbench tops find a local widebelt you can rent.

[Mark Ashmeade]

Thanks guys, so in the "home shop" market, what's the difference between the two Jet 22-44s (other than $500!) I spent a couple hours last night looking at this, and I can't see any major difference. They both oscillate, and both have closed stands. They both seem to have the sandsmart automatic speed control feature too.

[Dan Blackshear]

I thought the dogbone shaped stand was unique to the oscillating sander, I may be wrong though.

Looking at Tools Plus' web site they list a model# 649005k which is the 22-44 without oscillating and then model# 659006k which is the 22-44 with oscillating and the dogbone shaped stand. The price difference is $500

Whichever you do decide on, I recommend the infeed/outfeed tables and they are different for the different model#s

I'll also second what John said, you are not going to run a benchtop through these and get satisfactory results, a benchtop is just too heavy.

[Mike OMelia]

Not sure what the difference is since I cannot see them. I do not think the stand is it. Also, the open stand with casters is not strong enough. I strengthened mine with angle iron from Lowes. But I do suspect you are looking at the difference between the oscillating head and standard head.

I own the 22-44 and it is a great work horse. You COULD use it to flatten a bench top, but that should not be the reason you buy it (if you can get access to a wide belt as stated above). I think you really need to justify the cost of the machine based on the work that you already do (or will do). I do guitars... I use mine all of the time.

Mike

[Mark Ashmeade]

Ok, got it now. The cheaper one doesn't oscillate, I thought I read that it does. Definitely doesn't.

So it's the dogbone one, at $2199. Now the question is... would one of the dual drum sanders do a better or worse job than an oscillating single drum? And does the open end of the 22-44 really matter? I'm guessing not, with smaller workpieces.

[Mike OMelia]

I thought the dogbone shaped stand was unique to the oscillating sander, I may be wrong though.

Looking at Tools Plus' web site they list a model# 649005k which is the 22-44 without oscillating and then model# 659006k which is the 22-44 with oscillating and the dogbone shaped stand. The price difference is $500

Whichever you do decide on, I recommend the infeed/outfeed tables and they are different for the different model#s

I'll also second what John said, you are not going to run a benchtop through these and get satisfactory results, a benchtop is just too heavy.


Not sure I entirely agree. But you would have to set up in and out tables to make it possible. Don't want the heavy ends flexing! Hold down force of the sander is not strong enough. The one show stopper I see is if the conveyor motor can move it along. It is a DC gear motor, so it does have considerable torque. But it may not be enough.

[Mike OMelia]

We are talking about the 22-44 Jet/Performax, right? Mine with the open stand, new, was $1100. Are you talking about the oscillating head with closed stand? (links might help).

My shipping was free as well. If you are looking on Amazon (not a bad idea), use camelcamelcamel.com to check price history.

Mike

[Mark Ashmeade]

This is the oscillator:

http://www.amazon.com/22-44ODS-Oscillating-Sander-closed-stand/dp/B001KQJFRW/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1303412034&sr=8-3

And this is the other (non-oscillating)

http://www.amazon.com/649005K-22-Inch-4-Horsepower-115-Volt-1-Phase/dp/B00020BNB8/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1303412092&sr=8-2

The price of the first one isn't that far away from this one:

http://www.lagunatools.com/sanders/25-Drum-Sander

[Mike OMelia]

Yeah, mine is like the middle one, but open stand. I keep my eyes open for the stand. The laguna is a 3HP. Only issue is that it will only handle 25" max. Perhaps not a problem for you. There is no need to fear the open end. It is very strong and maintains adjustments very well. A little trick is needed to align (see Joe Woodworker).

Guess it boils down to your budget. I like the oscillating concept, but have no notion of its mechanical longevity. Just more parts.

Mike

[John Coloccia]

The one show stopper I see is if the conveyor motor can move it along. It is a DC gear motor, so it does have considerable torque. But it may not be enough.

That was exactly my thinking. I think you'd have to have a pretty large, heavy duty, roller infeed/outfeed setup and even then I question if the conveyor would get any significant grip until a good portion of the bench top was already through the machine, assuming it would move it at all.

I have the 22-44 too, and I use it ALL the time. I'm sure you went through the same decision process when you bought yours.... "They make a 16-32, and a 22-44. I wish they made a 17-34!" :)

[Neil Brooks]

I wish they made a 17-34!" :)

Amen.

Along those lines, I've always said that -- at the casino -- if the game were 22, instead of 21, I'd be a rich man ;)

[Mike OMelia]

Do you have the open or closed stand? (I don't get the 17-34 concept... the models go 10, 16, 22, all 6" increases... was it a humor thing?)

[John Coloccia]

Do you have the open or closed stand? (I don't get the 17-34 concept... the models go 10, 16, 22, all 6" increases... was it a humor thing?)

I have the closed stand.

re: 17"

I ended up with the 22-44 because archtops are typically 17" wide, and I thought it would be convenient to be able to flatten tops and backs before starting the carving...you know, just cleaning up the glue line and dealing with tearout on the figured woods off the planer.

[Mike OMelia]

If by some wierd or strange circumstance you ever come across a closed stand, let me know please. :)