Stop fooling around. I want you to buy a new drill press tomorrow.

[John Coloccia]

So says my wife. She wanted to know why a lot of my drilled holes have tearout on the a portion of the TOP of the hole. I brought her over to the DP and let her feel the play in my Delta.

I've been meaning to upgrade this thing for a while now, but I've been holding out hope that maybe the rumored Grizzly drill press would come out one day. Well, I just can't wait anymore. This thing has a huge amount of play in it abd it's made it impossible to do clean work, nevermind precision work. It's pretty sad when i can drill a cleaner hole with my little cordless Makita.

What do I get? Let's just take Jet, Delta and Powermatic right off the table. I see them everyday, and I'll leave it at that. I also really want a quill lock. I'm not taking about a couple of screws riding on the depth gauge. I want an honest to God lock so that the spindle doesn't chatter when I'm running my Saf-T planer.

What do I get and where do I get it? I've been looking for an old Walker Turner, or something like that, but a lot of them are trashed. I don't have time for a project. I need to unbox it and it needs to work reliably for a good long time, period. :D

I think Rod likes the General, though I don't know which models.

[mickey cassiba]

John, if your'e thinking used, look at Clausing. Well built, industrial grade machines. In BIL's machine shop we had a bunch of them, all picked up at auction or on-line. Not cheap, but not cheaply made either. Parts were readily available about ten years ago, don't know about now. Most of them were height adjustable through the head, and at the table. A lot of them were also available as a bench mount as well...a plus in the machine shop, as we could gang two or three together as finishing stations nest to the screw machines to allow the operator to produce finished parts, rather than moving WIP to another station. We used the reeves type drives(and they were very nice, not like the junk that you mostly see these days)although a couple of them came with step pulleys. I stashed one when BIL shut down the shop. I plan on using it when I get my shop past the "dream" stage.

[David Weaver]

I would wait until you find someone else's finished old iron project. Might cost as much as a newer machine, but it should be better, and you won't have to do it.

I don't know if I've seen a reasonably priced new machine that you could really say "well, that one will be accurate". I've used several, all the way up to 20" size, and any time I try to do something accurate that isn't just drilling a hole through 4/4 stock, I come away feeling compromised.

I don't know what you're doing, but if you're getting really hardcore on precision, could you do what you want to do with a mill? (no, I don't know much about mills. Every time I describe to someone what I want to do making planes, the response is always "you should get a mill, not a drill press if you want any accuracy")

Old is still the way I'd go, though, unless you can find a friend who has an import that is uncommonly good and then beg it off of them.

[Neil Brooks]

So says my wife. She wanted to know why a lot of my drilled holes have tearout on the a portion of the TOP of the hole. I brought her over to the DP and let her feel the play in my Delta.

Family newsgroup, Buddy ;)

Last couple reviews I saw gave REALLY high marks to the floor-standing Grizzly DPs.

And .... for a clandestine wife gloat ... you suck.

*I* thought *I* was doing well with the "when have I EVER told you what tools you could or could not buy ?" Missus, but .... she's never flat-our TOLD me to buy a new tool.

Could ... could your wife call my wife for a quick pep talk ? :D

I presume a few other Creekers could use the same service. Perhaps there's a home-based business opportunity for you and your wife, here ??

[John Coloccia]

I'm actually looking at a PM on the floor at Woodcraft. It's much tighter than the one I assembled a few months ago. That's what gives me pause. I see a lot of these from different manufacturers, and they're all hit or miss with the basic quality. Maybe I'll just take this PM off the floor since it seems reasonable.

[mike holden]

John,
While I dont want to keep you from a new drill press, be sure to replace your drill bits, or at least, sharpen them before bringing your new drill press home only to find the same top surface tear-out as before.
Mike

[Douglas Clark]

Neil hit this on the head; this post wasn't really about what drill you should buy, John. This was a supportive wife gloat, pure and simple!

That being said. I'm interested in hearing what DP you go with, because I've been shopping around for one too. Although, I've been looking for benchtop models. I can't spare the floor space for ground unit. I'm surprised to hear your initial dismissal of the Delta, JET or PM. What gives? Price, fit and finish? And can someone please explain to me why, if PM is that spotty with their QC, they still insist on charging premium prices? Personally, I can't afford anything over $500 though, so we may not be shopping in the same range.

BTW... Neil: I, like you, figure I'm doing OK if I get the same line your wife gives you, which I usually do. However, I've found that the quickest way to get full and explicit support for a tool purchase is if you're buying "safety" accessories. Anything else is hit and miss.

[Chris Matus]

Check your local HD. Here in the East they've been closing out the Ridgid drill press from a lot of stores. I paid $139 for one, but have seen them at other stores for less than a hundred. It's a decent press, especially at the sale price. You might get lucky.

http://www.ridgid.com/Tools/15inch-Drill-Press/EN/index.htm

[Paul Johnstone]

I'm actually looking at a PM on the floor at Woodcraft. It's much tighter than the one I assembled a few months ago. That's what gives me pause. I see a lot of these from different manufacturers, and they're all hit or miss with the basic quality. Maybe I'll just take this PM off the floor since it seems reasonable.

Honestly, I think that's the best strategy. If you can actually touch the candidate before you buy.
If they won't sell you the floor model, ask them if you can exchange the boxed one if the boxed one is considerably sloppier.
I can understand why the salespeople might not want to sell the floor model if they have another one in stock boxed up.

[Bruce Page]

If it wasn’t for the basement I would tell you to ditch the drill press all together and start looking for a Bridgeport type knee mill. There is very little that you can do on a DP that you can’t do on a mill and a mill lets you do so much more.

[Greg R Bradley]

I've looked at around 20 drill presses on various display floors since my fiasco buying a PM2800 around a year ago.

The best of all, with zero "turkeys" is the Delta 18-900L.

I have yet to see a single PM2800 with a good table gear/rack and I suspect issues with all the variable speed mechanisms in the future.

Have you considered the Jet Mill/Drill units?

Sorry I sold my Bridgeport Series 1 and didn't take it home at the time. I can't imagine using that for everyday use on wood, though. We had a 20" variable speed Clausing. We always used the Delta 15" drill press by preference for smaller stuff. Delta does list that in current catalog but they are way overpriced at $3-4,000.

[Callan Campbell]

I'm actually looking at a PM on the floor at Woodcraft. It's much tighter than the one I assembled a few months ago. That's what gives me pause. I see a lot of these from different manufacturers, and they're all hit or miss with the basic quality. Maybe I'll just take this PM off the floor since it seems reasonable.
John, don't forget it doesn't go that low in speed/RPMs. If you have large diameter bits, or want to do something where you'd like a pretty slow speed, you're at a loss with the PM Drill Press. Quality has been all over the map with the current Powermatic DP according to some Creekers. Reread their posts and decide if the possibility of taking the DP to a service center while still under warranty is an easy thing for you to do[Like, where IS the nearest Powermatic Service Center near me?].
Grizzly still seems to be way off in the distance with their rumored Variable Speed DP, so the pickings are slim for that type right now. Lots of multi-pulley units running around. Have you looked at the Steel City DP?
Steel City's demise seems like a premature thing, they are back and ready to go from what I hear.

[glenn bradley]

I'll chime in that the PM2800 does not go near slow enough for me. The table issues are well documented but, several folks have made peace with them. A good DP this side of a mill is a challenge we all face. I wish you luck.

[Randy Henry]

John,
I took a chance and got a PM-2800, even after all the bashing it takes here. My dealer told me if it is not right, he would come get it himself, with a full refund. I took the gamble and I think the d/p is great. Would I want to use it for metal working regulary, no... as I don't want the cutting oil all over the table etc., but it would hold up. I think any model from any manufacturer may have a lemon every now and then, but I have been very satisfied.

[Doug Wolf]

The PM-2800 has a low speed of 400 RPM. Not aceptable for large forstner bits. Had my heart set on one until I saw the 400 RPM.

[Keith Outten]

My experience is that most drill presses are not designed for side loads so you may be better off with a small mill/drill or full size milling machine for your Saf-T planer.
Another benefit is the very healthy spindle locks that are pretty much standard on a mill and of course an XY sliding table that makes dialing in a center to drill very easy.

I wish someone would purchase the Grizzly Woodworkers Mill and write a review (http://www.grizzly.com/products/Wood-Mill-Wood-Metalworking-w-Power-Feed/G9977), how about it John?
:)
.

[Gregory King]

You guys know my take on this drill press already. Greg Bradley touched on it too. Dollar for dollar its the 18-900L. You can shop till you drop and I dare you find a better one in it's category. Ain't gonna happen boys. Buy one, the proofs in the puddin'. I haven't found one thing in this DP that disappointed me. Seems every part in it is beefy. And super quiet.

[Matt Winterowd]

I've recently come to the conclusion that the problem with drill presses in particular is that we woodworkers undervalue them compared to our other machines. We want an extremely precise machine for very little money. Most of us are only willing to spend less than half (sometimes much less) of what we'll pay for other machines, yet we want precision and function that is at least on par with our table saws, bandsaws, etc.. What got me thinking about this was the relatively poor quality of the DP's that we all buy (under $1000) and the broad range of production products that range from about $1500-10k. The old dp's that everyone always lusts after all fell well into that upper tier of cost when new, but for some reason woodworkers who may be willing to spend 3 grand on a bandsaw these days won't even consider spending $1500 on a drill press. Granted they don't have all the "woodworking" features, but you start to see 6" stroke, true variable speed, and real mass and rigidity which are by far the most important features. True, you could start to get into a mill/drill or small mill for that kind of money, but a good drill press still offers a lot of speed and simplicity for doing lots of different tasks, not to mention much cheaper tooling.

I guess my thesis boils down to this: I think a truly good quality drill press is probably worth $1500-2000.

[John Coloccia]

re: stealth wife gloat
LOL....unintentionally guilty as charged :)

re: Powermatic
I don't mean to bash it. The one sitting on the floor at Woodcraft seems like a nice machine. The one I assembled for them a few months was not nearly as tight. The 400 RPM minimum speed, though, was the absolute killer for me.

re: why not just get a mill?
Good question. I've considered it in the past, and I'm considering it again now. That's not off the table

re: the Woodworkers mill
I would truly love to, Keith, but it's out of my price range. Now that I'm trying to get a business off the ground, cash is very tight. It looks like a killer machine, though, and I would love to have one.

re: 18-900L
Maybe in the running. I don't know. I don't need another basket case like the one I have now. It's hard for me to trust another Delta DP with the absolutely miserable performance I've had from mine. I'm trying to give it a far chance, though.

What would make it easy is if manufacturers would just release their runout spec. I'm so annoyed at this point that none of them do that I really do just want to buy a mill instead and go tell these manufacturers to go take a flying leap.

Thank you all. I hope we keep this going until we find a clear winner, here...something that we can reliably buy without having to hope we got one of the "good" ones.

[Peter Quinn]

How about a vertical mill? Bridgeport or similar? I see plenty of used bridgeports for sale here in CT now that many shops replace them with CNC stuff. I use an old one at work that beats any DP I have seen. Most of the WW DP's are pretty much a joke at best, my delta sure is, though it gets the basics done if crudely. It sure would take some rigging to get a mill into a walk down basement but what a joy once its there. I too would love to see a review on one of those Grizzly wood mills...hint hint...nudge nudge.......

[John Coloccia]

I guess my thesis boils down to this: I think a truly good quality drill press is probably worth $1500-2000.

Where do I buy such a thing? Do you have a model number or brand? I also thought it was as easy as just spending a little more money, but I'm just not finding what I'm looking for.

[Matt Winterowd]

Well, you can order any of the Jets through your local Woodcraft.

Example: Jet 354550 J-A5816 15" Variable Speed Floor Drill Press 1HP, 115/230V, 1PH $1749 at Tool Zone.
Ellis 9400 18" Drill Press w/ Power Down Feed $2500 at Tools Plus
Actually, the Jet JDP-20MF is supposed to be a really nice basic drill for about $900, also at any of those retailers.

[Wes Grass]

Solberga, and Arboga, are two Swedish brands that are hard core industrial quality. Geared heads, low rpm, 3 phase ... which lets you instant reverse for tapping ... otherwise possibly a bit of a hassle. Harder is moving the darn things ...

From the small sample size I've seen personally, basically, one of each, these are both a notch up from Clausing.

There's a Solberga on Ebay in Berlin, CT for 2k'ish ;-)

We have one of each, Solberga and Arboga, and a smaller machine that has step pulleys. Don't remember off hand which brand that one is, but it's a really nice machine as well. But nowhere near the beef of the geared heads.

Electro-Mechano is another name that pops into my head.

[johnny means]

I feel your pain, John. I shopped for a drill press for 3 years before finding one I was satisfied with. My budget was $1000 and I looked at both the Delta and the Powermatic in that price range.

I liked the PM's variable speed but found the quill travel to short. I was also turned off by, what I perceived as, the shoddy build. The nifty extension tables were nowhere near level with the table and were mounted with plastic brackets. $900 and they use plastic for load bearing parts. Guess they figured no one would see what was under the table.

I was much more impressed with the Delta and it has a nice long 6" throw, but lacked Variable speed.

In the end, I ended up going used. Seems that's the only way to get anything near industrial quality is spend 2K or go used. I spent $400 and got a much better machine than I would have gotten with my $1000 if I bought new.

[Chris Fournier]

I've recently come to the conclusion that the problem with drill presses in particular is that we woodworkers undervalue them compared to our other machines. We want an extremely precise machine for very little money. Most of us are only willing to spend less than half (sometimes much less) of what we'll pay for other machines, yet we want precision and function that is at least on par with our table saws, bandsaws, etc.. What got me thinking about this was the relatively poor quality of the DP's that we all buy (under $1000) and the broad range of production products that range from about $1500-10k. The old dp's that everyone always lusts after all fell well into that upper tier of cost when new, but for some reason woodworkers who may be willing to spend 3 grand on a bandsaw these days won't even consider spending $1500 on a drill press. Granted they don't have all the "woodworking" features, but you start to see 6" stroke, true variable speed, and real mass and rigidity which are by far the most important features. True, you could start to get into a mill/drill or small mill for that kind of money, but a good drill press still offers a lot of speed and simplicity for doing lots of different tasks, not to mention much cheaper tooling.

I guess my thesis boils down to this: I think a truly good quality drill press is probably worth $1500-2000.

I have come to the exact same conclusions over the years. When people ask me what the toughest operation is in my shop I quickly reply that it is drilling precise holes.

Over the years my Delta 16 1/2 has been good to me but is it a good machine? Not really. As a sometimes machinist I know what I would like and consider to be a good hole boring machine and as Matt points out the budget starts at $ 1500 and I really see the ceiling as being $3000 for new. This is why I still have the Delta! An $800 machine is not going to be that much better than my current Delta - I've checked.

Look up Knuth USA http://www.knuth.de/v2/sprache,8.html for some options. I think that you can find similar machines with different paint colours at lower price points but these guys have a wide selection and good quality; I've seen them in the flesh.

I also agree that the safe-t-planer is a drill press killer with the radial loads. I know that you are not a butcher but even light cuts with that thing are likley tough on a cheap DP.

[Gary Radice]

I'll second the idea to get a used press. Go over to owwm and post a WTB at BOYD. There are lots of OWWM guys in your area so I'd be surprised if something doesn't come up.

[Andrew Joiner]

The Delta 18-900L and PM 2800 have no quill lock that I can see. The Steel City looks like it has one.

Have you looked at the Grizzly G1005Z Mill/Drill?

[John Coloccia]

Unfortunately, a lot of these better drill presses are designed around machine work, and usually require 3 phase, possibly to support the reversing motor. Other than that, the Mill/Drill seemed reasonable.

[John Coloccia]

The Delta 18-900L and PM 2800 have no quill lock that I can see. The Steel City looks like it has one.

Have you looked at the Grizzly G1005Z Mill/Drill?

That Steel City is in the running. I like the split head design. I'm concerned at it's very low price.

I'm looking at an old Solberga at a local used equipment place. I'm going to have to see if it's a good deal at almost $2000 (I don't know what new pricing on these is).

I have to say, though, that the 18-900 is looking better and better. I haven't really seen very many negative comments about it at all. Makes me wonder if they finally got one right.

[Andrew Joiner]

I also really want a quill lock. I'm not taking about a couple of screws riding on the depth gauge. I want an honest to God lock so that the spindle doesn't chatter when I'm running my Saf-T planer.


A quill lock is mandatory on my next drill press also. So many times I wish I had a lock. Even in set-up to align a hole. I hang a weight on the hand feed lever to hold the bit on the work to set stops now.

[Sean Nagle]

As has been mentioned already the Ellis 9400 seems to come closest to satisfying most woodworking needs, yet at about $2500 is not priced beyond what a hobbyist would pay for a quality tablesaw or bandsaw.

http://www.ellissaw.com/Drill-Presses/43/drill-press-9400

[Matt Winterowd]

That Steel City is in the running. I like the split head design. I'm concerned at it's very low price.

You should be. I had one and I didn't find it to be any better than any of the current low end imports. The new Delta does seem to be a little better built, but I'm really leery about Delta in general these days.


Unfortunately, a lot of these better drill presses are designed around machine work, and usually require 3 phase, possibly to support the reversing motor. Other than that, the Mill/Drill seemed reasonable. Unfortunately, a lot of these better drill presses are designed around machine work, and usually require 3 phase, possibly to support the reversing motor. Other than that, the Mill/Drill seemed reasonable.

That's kind of a truism. Metal/machine workers won't tolerate the kind of junk we pay for in terms of build quality. Both of the specific drill's I pointed out above are 1 phase.

I've bought several "woodworking" drill presses, and they've all been disappointing to me. Currently the best of the lot is a 1997 Ryobi benchtop, believe it or not. However, I don't think any other class of machines gets so universally panned around there as drill presses, and from a philosophical and economic standpoint, manufacturers have no incentive to stop selling us junk as long as we keep buying it.

John, that's not aimed at you or your decision personally. I totally respect anyone's decision to buy what best fits into their own cost/benefit calculations. I haven't actually managed to pull the trigger on one yet myself. I'm just throwing out thoughts into the ether.

[Wes Grass]

"old Solberga at a local used equipment place. I'm going to have to see if it's a good deal at almost $2000 (I don't know what new pricing on these is)."

You don't want to know ... or maybe you do. I don't know either, but if I had to guess it'd be somewhere up around $7k depending on the size. Willis Machinery is an importer of these.

BTW, reversing the motor can be done through a VFD. I don't know if it would stop and reverse fast enough for tapping though. If you want it instant you'll probably have to run through a rotary phase converter and wire in a foot switch. We use a standard rotary forward/reverse switch like you'd find on a milling machine or big disc sander. Bolted to a plate that sits on the floor, high enough that you can tuck your foot underneath to kick it up into reverse. Don't know how many holes I've tapped over the years like that, probably in the thousands.

Additional benefit of this is safety ... IMO anyways. None of that 'locked on, no way to shut it down without letting go of something' setup with a pushbutton. Could be done easily with a single phase machine too, just no reverse. Personally, I think all drill presses should be setup this way.

[John Coloccia]

John, that's not aimed at you or your decision personally. I totally respect anyone's decision to buy what best fits into their own cost/benefit calculations. I haven't actually managed to pull the trigger on one yet myself. I'm just throwing out thoughts into the ether.

No offense taken, Matt. I bought that DP years ago before I had a clue as to what's happened to our tools. I blindly went into the BORG like everyone else and bought what I thought was the best I could. It's one of the last tools I've left to replace...I haven't yet because it was just barely good enough to get the job done, but it's gone south in the last year. You know how it is...something loosens up, allowing things to chatter more, which makes things loosen up faster, etc etc. Once it starts to go, it goes FAST. Shoot, the thing is actually starting to make rattling noises.

re: the Delta
As far as I can tell, it's best in class at the moment. I hear what you're saying about Delta and I sort of agree, but they managed to get the new Unisaw right...maybe they got this DP right too. The next step up is more industrial options. What I may do is pick up the Delta and keep my current one dedicated to SafT planer use. I'll just drill it and make my own quill lock. That will fix the looseness too. Maybe I'll get a solid 4 or 5 years out of the Delta, long enough to get me going to a point I can consider other options.

[John Toigo]

Maybe rebuild the one you have? They're not very complicated.

[Ole Anderson]

The Delta 18-900L and PM 2800 have no quill lock that I can see. The Steel City looks like it has one.]

How can a drill press possibly not have a quill lock? Even my 20 year old Craftsman has a quill lock. (hey, 20 years isn't that long ago)

And if production tapping is in your future, just get a used Tapmatic. I just sold mine for under $200. No need to reverse the motor.

[John Coloccia]

No production tapping here :) I'm just stuck lucking at those kinds of drill presses because of the junk they've been pumping out lately. It's the high end drill presses designed for machinists that are really well made, and many of those are designed for tapping too. I have next to no need for taping at all...at least not anything that I can't just do by hand perfectly well.

All drill presses...most anyhow....have a way to "lock" the quill at a certain depth, but usually it's integrated into the depth stop mechanism. It doesn't really lock anything...it just holds it. A real quill lock grabs the quill and immobilizes it. THAT is getting much harder to find. The depth stop mechanism really isn't all that bad PROVIDED the quill is tight. If it's loosey goosey, it just lets the quill vibrate, completely defeating the purpose of the quill lock IMHO. If I wanted that, I could just raise the table and get exactly the same thing.

I tell you, that Grizzly woodworking mill is looking better and better all the time. I just can't justify it at the moment. If things pick up later this year, I can see using it for all sorts of operations and there will probably be one in my shop.

[Carl Beckett]

I would like to hear from some of the users about working wood on a mill. I see used mills in my area for ~$800 (with digital readout) and even bridgeports for ~$1200, and while might not be state of the art metal working, would be useful for an occasional home project and woodworking. (would still need collets and tooling, but all can be had on the used sites).

I could even imagine a number of operations a lot like an overhead router that could be done on it.

Thoughts from users?

[Keith Outten]

If I could justify purchasing the Grizzly Woodworkers Mill and I had the floor space I would buy it in a minute.
I can't :(

I own a Grizzly bench mill/drill that serves me well, the machine is better than any drill press I have ever seen and offers features you just can't get on a drill press. I know that some people prefer larger machines and that's fine with me but there is a place for small bench mill/drills and IMO they are a step up from a drill press in almost every case when you consider the price and capability.

When I purchased my bench mill the power feed for the x axis on the table wasn't an option. Last year i added a power feed to my machine, it isn't smooth like a Bridgeport put you really can't expect it to be in a class with a commercial milling machine. The little Grizzly mill/drill is just over 500 pounds, runs on 110 volts and is easy to move when it is necessary. I paid $850.00 for the machine and built my own very heavy stand made from 6" angle iron. My custom welded stand weighs almost as much as the mill/drill, it adds a lot of mass so the machine is perfectly stable and vibration free.

I route keyholes on Corian sign blanks all the time with my mill/drill and I have often used it to to route various other projects in just about every type of material you can imagine. Most of the time it is a drill and it will handle any project that I have in my shop. I own three welding machines and a host of metal benders so woodworking isn't necessarily the primary material I use on any give day. Lately I use more Corian and steel than wood, I recently drilled hundreds of 1/2" holes with a step drill in heavy angle iron and flat bar building a pulverizer for my tractor. I couldn't imagine having to use a standard drill press to drill holes in steel all day long. I also couldn't imagine ever being without a mill/drill or a milling machine if I had the space in my workshop.
.

[John Coloccia]

If I could justify purchasing the Grizzly Woodworkers Mill and I had the floor space I would buy it in a minute.
I can't :(

I own a Grizzly bench mill/drill that serves me well, the machine is better than any drill press I have ever seen and offers features you just can't get on a drill press. I know that some people prefer larger machines and that's fine with me but there is a place for small bench mill/drills and IMO they are a step up from a drill press in almost every case when you consider the price and capability.

When I purchased my bench mill the power feed for the x axis on the table wasn't an option. Last year i added a power feed to my machine, it isn't smooth like a Bridgeport put you really can't expect it to be in a class with a commercial milling machine. The little Grizzly mill/drill is just over 500 pounds, runs on 110 volts and is easy to move when it is necessary. I paid $850.00 for the machine and built my own very heavy stand made from 6" angle iron. My custom welded stand weighs almost as much as the mill/drill, it adds a lot of mass so the machine is perfectly stable and vibration free.

I route keyholes on Corian sign blanks all the time with my mill/drill and I have often used it to to route various other projects in just about every type of material you can imagine. Most of the time it is a drill and it will handle any project that I have in my shop. I own three welding machines and a host of metal benders so woodworking isn't necessarily the primary material I use on any give day. Lately I use more Corian and steel than wood, I recently drilled hundreds of 1/2" holes with a step drill in heavy angle iron and flat bar building a pulverizer for my tractor. I couldn't imagine having to use a standard drill press to drill holes in steel all day long. I also couldn't imagine ever being without a mill/drill or a milling machine if I had the space in my workshop.
.

Which model do you have? They have several different ones now. You're a good salesman, Keith. I don't need a particularly huge machine. You have me thinking of all the operations I can perform with mills and tables. It would really change how I work, I think.

[glenn bradley]

I also thought it was as easy as just spending a little more money, but I'm just not finding what I'm looking for.

Odd isn't it? You and I are not the only ones willing to pay $1000+ for a good DP, they just aren't out there. You'd think the number of responses to this (and many other) threads should tell the tool makers that there is a market awaiting them. As an aside; the Saf-t-planer is going to be a bit of a problem for almost any drill press you might have in a home shop; DP's are not mills and are not designed for force in that direction. They work but are not going to shear material the way a machine designed to do that will :(

There just seems to be a gap between an expensive "just OK" drill press and a mill (with the capacities woodworkers want) within our financial (and floor-space) grasp. Grizzly has been working on one that is supposed to fill this gap but it is slow in coming (probably due to our wonderfully sluggish economy and not on a lack of desire on their part). I am riding out the storm with my "tweaked" $300 Delta and remain ready to pounce once the holy grail (by whoever makes it) is made available.

P.s. Maybe it is like the plunge base for the Bosch Colt; many folks want one but Bosch replied to my query explaining that they have no plans to make such a beast. . . my needs are not necessarily their needs, eh?

[glenn bradley]

[QUOTE=Ole Anderson;1680848]]

How can a drill press possibly not have a quill lock? Even my 20 year old Craftsman has a quill lock. (hey, 20 years isn't that long ago)QUOTE]

My 40 year old Delta has a quill lock :) None of the newer presses I've owned have had one :(

[Dave Lehnert]

You never can tell.

I purchased a floor standing drill press from a close-out type store for $99. They had a good return policy so I thought "why not" That drill press is one of the most accurate tool in my shop. I can drill a hole and it is dead on. It is a no name brand press from china.

[Andrew Joiner]

Yes, some of the Asian drill presses come new with quill locks. I was in Sears last year and saw 2 models with locks. They had a a tiny PLASTIC lever! Both had the normal (liberal) quill slop.

The Grizzly wood mill would be overkill for my shop needs. The Grizzly G1005Z or other Mill/Drills in the $1k range would be ideal.




I route keyholes on Corian sign blanks all the time with my mill/drill and I have often used it to to route various other projects in just about every type of material you can imagine.
.

Keith, Is the 3,000 rpm ok for routing wood? I know many slot mortisers are around 3,000 rpm.

John, I'm guessing even a small mill/drill would outperform any drill press with your Saf-T planer. You even have precise hand crank table travel of 15" to 20". Some of the small mill/drills come with a carbide-tipped fly cutter that may work on wood.

[John Coloccia]

Keith now has me lusting over that large Wood Mill. That would replace several tools in my shop and bring a whole new level of accuracy and speed to my work. I'm seriously considering that now. I miss not having a mill anymore. This would kill a lot of birds with one stone. I could dump my pin router, mortiser, router table, drill press, probably my second dedicated table saw (I use that for a very specific slotting step), and probably some other tools I'm not even thinking of. I don't think it replaces everything these tools do, but it would replace everything I use those tools to do.

Shoot, I think you guys are going to cost me a whole lot of money.

[Wes Grass]

Quill locks ... come to think of it, I don't think any of the 3 Swedish machines we have have one. They *are* drill presses after all ;-)

And, FWIW, a mill the size of a Bridgeport won't drill holes as easily as a real drill press. The drive ratio on the quill handle isn't as low, and they're typically not as rugged either. But for wood, or even aluminum, there won't be an issue. Sure is easier to get a *nice* hole though, with the work clamped in place and dialed in to where you want it.


Whoops, my mistake. Third one this week ...

These do in fact have quill locks. I just never noticed because there aren't any handles attached to them, just a nut for a wrench.

[Chris Parks]

I've recently come to the conclusion that the problem with drill presses in particular is that we woodworkers undervalue them compared to our other machines. We want an extremely precise machine for very little money. Most of us are only willing to spend less than half (sometimes much less) of what we'll pay for other machines, yet we want precision and function that is at least on par with our table saws, bandsaws, etc.. What got me thinking about this was the relatively poor quality of the DP's that we all buy (under $1000) and the broad range of production products that range from about $1500-10k. The old dp's that everyone always lusts after all fell well into that upper tier of cost when new, but for some reason woodworkers who may be willing to spend 3 grand on a bandsaw these days won't even consider spending $1500 on a drill press. Granted they don't have all the "woodworking" features, but you start to see 6" stroke, true variable speed, and real mass and rigidity which are by far the most important features. True, you could start to get into a mill/drill or small mill for that kind of money, but a good drill press still offers a lot of speed and simplicity for doing lots of different tasks, not to mention much cheaper tooling.

I guess my thesis boils down to this: I think a truly good quality drill press is probably worth $1500-2000.

And after buying they abuse it by side loading the quill with sanding attachments. Maybe it is best to buy a cheap one if that is the way it is to be used.

[Chris Parks]

I have a small gloat for this thread. Some years ago I noticed an old drill press in a workshop that was never used so I made an offer of $150 and took it home. It was a Swedish three phase geared head DP which one of my friends has repeatedly offered to buy for many dollars more than I paid for it. I am now going to add a VFD and that will definitely be the icing on the cake.

[Keith Outten]

My mill/drill is the model G1005 and the max RPM is 2,850. The large body 1.5 hp motor has plenty of power for this machine. It has a heavy duty chromed steel quill lock handle and of course you can lock out the downfeed handles and use the dial for precision work and for very large cutters/hole saws.

I have made dozens of custom jigs that bolt easily to the milling table using T-nuts, one is a raised plywood table I use for many woodworking tasks. I built my stand so I can swing the head of the mill over the side and clamp long parts when I need to drill them.

Even though I own a CNC Router I still use the mill/drill to make sliding jigs and fixtures in lots of cases because I can dial in the fit easier than having to keep adjusting a drawing and revising a tool path on the CMC machine so I often make prototypes on the mill/drill then measure the part and work up a CNC drawing.

Now you know why I said that I will never own a drill press again :)
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[Carl Beckett]

I was thinking something like this:

http://boston.craigslist.org/nos/tls/2320224776.html

This type of equipment is regularly available. I cant imagine any drill press being as accurate or as stable. And, if you are liking to use a rotary planer head I cant see any drill press having bearings that would hold up to it.

Just a thought........

[John Coloccia]

I know, that SafT planer really isn't ideal on a drill press. I don't sand on the DP anymore now that I have a proper spindle sander, but I do still use the SafT planer. It only sees infrequent use, but it's quite incredible what i can easily do on that thing which would be very difficult to do otherwise. I may end up pickup up a cheap, $100 DP and just dedicate it to the SafT planer. When I trash it, I'll just buy another one and chalk it up to the cost of doing business. I could certainly perform those operations on a shaper, but given that much of what I do is customizable, it would not be worth it at this point to have to make a template for every permutation.

I really think I will end up with that Grizzly Wood Mill at some point, and in the mean time I'll pick up that mill that Keith pointed out. I wish I had thought of a mill earlier. It fits with the sort of work I do so perfectly that it would be crazy not to move in that direction. Even for drill, it's a great solution. I have a hole right now that I have to lower by .005". That would be so trivial to do precisely with a mill.

[John Coloccia]

Hey, does anyone have any thoughts on Grizzly's mills? I'm eyeing the 1006. Keep in mind that I would mainly be using it for woodworking, not precision metal work, although I do miss having access to a mill and will undoubtedly do some machining once I have it. I like the large table travel and the high speed (up to 3000RPM). It seems like a reasonable choice.

[Paul McGaha]

John,

How far are you from one of the Grizzly stores?

Maybe go check them out up close.

PHM

[John Coloccia]

Unforunately, not very close to any of them. I'm generally familiar with these Chiwanese mills, and have used them before. I know they're generally a bit sloppy by metal working standards, and that's OK. Keith has convinced me, though. If I'm going to spend $1000+ on a DP, I may as well spend it on a mill instead.

[John Coloccia]

Well, for what it's worth, I pulled the trigger on the G1006. Here's a second wife gloat: "Why didn't you get the really big one that you want?". LOL. She's got a good head on her shoulders. We'll see how it works out but it seems promising.

[Bill Carbonti]

I am on a parallel track with you on choosing a mill over a DP for reasons of flexibility and precision. Not quite sure yet on the learning curve for how to use all the capabilities of a mill. There's not a Lonnie Bird book about how to use one of these machines! Very interested in how this Grizzly works out for you and please post your findings.

[Matt Winterowd]

You are a lucky man, John.

[Paul McGaha]

+1 what Matt said.

Not that I'm complaining, My wife's really good about letting me afford a hobby.

Still, I dont recall her ever saying I want you to buy something tomorrow or why didnt you get that big one you wanted.

Good for you John.

PHM

[John Coloccia]

+1 what Matt said.

Not that I'm complaining, My wife's really good about letting me afford a hobby.

Still, I dont recall her ever saying I want you to buy something tomorrow or why didnt you get that big one you wanted.

Good for you John.

PHM

To be fair, this is a little more than a hobby for me. She's got a good business sense and she knows that tools are cheap in the long run. Struggling with inadequate tools gets very expensive very quickly. I don't need a super duper table saw because I mostly use it to dimension wood down to manageable size, making jigs etc. I DO need to make some very accurate holes and slots though, and there are some milling applications I can seriously benefit from as well. This is probably exactly the opposite situation from most where a little fudging on a hole isn't the end of the world. For me, a sloppy and/or inaccurate hole is absolutely disastrous....like toss it out and start over kind of disastrous. I had that happen on a piece not too long ago, which is actually how I discovered how far gone my old DP really was. This is hard enough without that sort of grief!

[Carl Beckett]

Show your wife this one - sounds like she will require you to buy it. Then send me your Grizzly......

:)

http://boston.craigslist.org/gbs/tls/2325006052.html

Let us know how the Grizzly works out - sounds like a great soln for you!

[John Coloccia]

Well, that may just happen except for the part about sending the Grizzly to you. It's backordered until June 22. That leaves me in something of a bind...I'm not sure my DP will get me by until then. I just shot them an e-mail to see if the 1007 is in stock (same machine except it has a power feed). I'm not hot on the power feed. I'll probably end up trying to wait as long as I can but I don't know that I'll make it. We'll see how it goes :)

edit: For what it's worth, having products that are back ordered is a problem I would LOVE to have. LOL.