Plough plane cutters: Record 044C the same as Stanley 12-250?

[Joerg Bullmann]

Just recently I got myself a Record 044C plough plane in very good condition through ebay. I am only just new to woodworking, have tried the plane a little and I like it a lot. It came with all 10 cutters, 9 of which have never been in use. They are still greased and show no rust at all -- as if they had come out of the factory yesterday. The one cutter that is in the plane has not seen much use either. So I am very happy and all set...

I am wondering, though, where I could get replacement cutters. I am new to sharpening and want to be prepared for when I goof up. I have been pointed to Stanley. They offer a set of 10 replacement cutters for their 12-250 plough plane and those cutters on the picture just look like the ones I have. I was now wondering whether anyone here has tried those cutters on a Record 044C and can confirm they fit.

Alternatively I could measure a cutter I have (length, thickness and dimensions of the adjuster slot) and post that info here. Are there any Stanley 12-250 owners here who could check those measures against a cutter of their's?

I have already contacted Stanley and asked them straight out, but they couldn't answer my question.

Can anyone in this forum help?

Cheers,
Joerg

[David Weaver]

I wouldn't worry about it just yet. It's harder to completely screw up an iron than you think, especially one in a plow plane where geometry of the edge isn't critical.

By the time you really goof one up, you'll be able to make your own plow plane irons. They would be about the easiest irons to make because you could heat treat them with any home center torch and a can of vegetable oil.

[Robert Culver]

you can get them at tool nut from the UK

http://www.toolnut.co.uk/products/planes/plane_blades,_cutters,_irons


Davids got a good point however if you got the spare time to do it im a little cramed for my time so I had somebody make me one for my 043.....

[Gary Hodgin]

I have a 12-250 and the cutters are 3 3/8" long, 1/8" thick, and there is a 1/8" deep notch about 1/4" from the top of the cutters. Cutters vary in width. You'll be lucky if they'll fit your Record. They will not fit the Stanley 45.

[Jim Belair]

Never even heard of a Stanley 12-250 until tonight.

[David Weaver]

Neither had i. It's an ugly mother, isn't it!?

[Gary Hodgin]

As I recall Stanley started the 12-250 a few years after it stopped making the 45 (around 1960 I think). It has similar cutters (at least the profiles) but is not nearly as robust (i.e., lower quality). I don't think it's made any longer, but Stanley still sells the cutters. They are not interchangeable with the 45 though. BTW, it's also called the Stanley Universal plane.

[Rob Young]

I bought these replacement cutters and they fit my Record 044C, Stanley 45 (Monkey Wards version) and Stanley #48

http://www.stanleytoolparts.com/ploughcutters.html

Purchased 2 5/16 and 1 5/8 to replace the AWOL cutters on my #48. Just for giggles tried them in the other two planes (because I had used their 5/16 wide cutters in the #48) and they fit.

[Joerg Bullmann]

Thanks for taking the time to measure the cutters, Gary. Checked it and my cutters are longer (3.5 ") and the notch seems closer to the end. I guess I'll look elsewhere for replacements then.

Cheers,
Joerg

[Joerg Bullmann]

Och, I was talking out of my elbow. I was comparing the cutter measures only when I posted a little while ago. I now sat down with the plane in hand and checked: my thinking now is that both the overall cutter length difference and the distance of the notch to the end of the cutter should not matter much. I checked the adjuster nut that fits into the notch and it should still fit with cutters that have the notch up to 1/3 of an inch away from the end.

I guess I'll go and get myself a set of those cutters.

:-)

Cheers again,
Joerg

[Joerg Bullmann]

Hi Rob,

Your response made me re-think and look at the plane instead of simply comparing cutter dimensions!

Cheers,
Joerg

[George Salek]

Joerg

I've just tried the 12-250 cutters on my stanley 45 planes (I have 2 of them, one very old US made SW, and one UK made).
They fit both planes, and cut OK. You may have to hone them first. I've also used them on my Record 405 and 043.
Btw. I found the record cutters much better.

Hope it helps.
cheers
george

[Joerg Bullmann]

Hi George,

Thanks for taking the time to respond. Have ordered a set of Stanleys about a fortnight ago and hope to get them some time soon. The whole set goes for 30 $ and I therefore wouldn't expect top quality.

Cheers,
Joerg

[Rob Young]

Glad to know you are making forward progress on outfitting your plane with new irons.

One good thing about a plow plane iron is that is doesn't need to sort of obsessive detail sharpening that a smoothing plane blade does. You aren't (usually) cutting something that will show. Honestly, I've felt little or no difference between sharpening to 800 grit or moving all the way to 8000 grit when using a 1/4" blade to cut the groove for a draw or box bottom. Any possible difference might be on the first pass or two with a hint of tearout at the surface especially on the pieces you have to work against the grain. But a quick swipe with a smoothing plane for the surface and just a hint of bevel with a block plane or chisel after the groove is done and that mess is all cleaned up.

I do still however put a small microbevel on the irons as it makes the sharpening touch-ups go VERY quick.