What's your technique for getting the best cut on NE pieces?

[George Overpeck]

I have fooled with NE pieces a bit before but figured I should get serious about it this winter since a market expressed interest. I've been using some 6-8 inch green sitka alder and want to do it without a second cut, so the program is cut foot/profile, reverse and quickly hollow to about 3/16ths, remove tenon on lathe. CA bark between steps.

Since they are shallow pieces I'm thinking I can do my finish work with an orbital sander or (hopefully not) hand sanding, but of course I want to get as smooth as possible. This is what I've been trying out -

- when making my profile, cutting from the NE or headstock direction toward the foot, using the tip then bevel of a deep bowl gouge at 650ish rpm. This seems to be best for the bark edge , but is still leaving some ridges although very little tear-out on the wings of the bowl. I noticed that I can make a second pass working mid profile to rim with a fresh ground bullnose scraper that comes pretty close to removing the ridges but that's a little tougher on the bark and starts to tear out if I have to take off more than a whisper. I think waxing the tool rest and keeping it very close might help as well.

- cutting the inside seems about the same as other bowls except for the visibility, tip then bevel of a deep bowl gouge but slowing it down to 550ish. I suspect the technique might be right but I need to practice practice practice.

I was wondering if anyone uses any shear scraping on the outside wings or any other techniques specific to working with that empty space and the collision factor that sets my tools bouncing, likewise if anyone is using angled scraping or other gouge methods to optimize the inside cut on the wings.

Thanks in advance for any tips or thoughts.

[David E Keller]

Welcome, George! I tend to alway cut from bark to wood when doing NE pieces in an effort to prevent lifting the bark from the form. I also turn pieces in that size considerable faster which I find makes for an easier cut for me. I don't use a scraper much, but if you're getting good results, I'd keep doing it. I tend to favor a 3/8 bowl gouge freshly sharpened for my finishing cuts both inside and out.

I tend to wet sand my NE pieces if I'm using green wood... Sometimes by hand and sometimes with the lathe off but a sanding pad on my drill. Generally, I use a combination of the two.

I hope to see some photos of your finished pieces!

[Lee Koepke]

Add one more question to the discussion:

I found that even though my final cuts are pretty smooth (for me...) I end up with some blotching, especially near the bark area (cambium?). Its not rough, but the darkness doesnt sand out, and if it does, it comes back. I have only tried NE with cherry, so not sure it thats typical. It certainly hasnt been visible on the other NE bowls I have seen here.

[Michael James]

No help, but welcome from NM.
mj

[Curt Fuller]

I tend to agree with David's technique. It's difficult to get any kind of a smooth cut with any tool when you're in the hit and miss sections of a natural edge. Higher speed (within reason) seems to shorten the time your tool is in the air, not making contact with the wood. So, I think you get a little less tool movement that way. But ultimately a natural edge piece usually requires a little extra time with the 80 grit gouge.

[Kyle Iwamoto]

+1 or 2 on more speed..... BUT don't go faster than you feel safe. 550 or 650 is a little slow for ME. And of course a freshly sharpened gouge always helps.

[Jon McElwain]

Sitka alder? I assume Sitka, Alaska alder? I live in Juneau in the summer and since alder is the closest thing to a hardwood that grows naturally up there I have turned a lot of it. I have done a few natural edge pieces, but the bark separates from the wood easily, so I do not do too many NE bowls with it anymore. Alder has a lot of tannin - more than any other wood I have personally encountered. I have noticed that when turning wet, the alder will be a nice light tan color, but within a half hour or so, all the shavings and have turned a much darker reddish color. Also, the tannin is more abundant near the outside of the tree. This may account for the blotching. I am not aware of anything that can be done to counteract the blotching, but I have noticed that over time, it evens out and fades slightly.

As to the cutting of a natural edge, I have had the best luck turning my gouge on edge (the "U" of the gouge facing horizontal) and presenting the tip of the gouge to the wood. Align the bevel in the direction you want the cut to be made. Let the tip make a nice clean cut and the lower flute will hog out the material. Once the NE is cut, I cut from smaller diameter to larger diameter on the outside of a bowl (pulling cut) and from larger diameter to smaller diameter on the inside of a bowl (push cut). I use these cuts for quarter sawn or flat sawn bowls with a simple curve. For end grain cutting, reverse the cut direction. Think about laying the grain down with your cut, rather than coming up from underneath the grain and lifting it with your cut. Tough to describe without a picture.

+1 for a little more speed and a sharp tool.

BTW, you said "a market expressed interest," have you found a local gallery to sell your pieces?

Good Luck!

[Bernie Weishapl]

I pretty much use Davids method. I sand mostly by hand or with a drill and sanding pad. I do crank the speed up as to shorten the air time up near the rim. I generally take my final cut or two with a conventional ground gouge that has been freshly sharpened. Most times can start sanding with 120 or 150 grit.

[George Overpeck]

I believe it's Sitka Alder, I read that the two varieties here on the Kenai Peninsula are Mountain and Sitka and what I'm working with seems similar to but is larger than the 6' that Mountain Alder is supposed to reach. It's amazing how much tannin there is in it, my chucks leave immediate purple black rings and I threw a little iron acetate on one chunk and it went all the way black within seconds. I haven't had much separation happening even though the trees were harvested in summer and are doing a fast dry in the window of the woodshop. I'm using a lot of CA as soon as it's exposed though.

I worked a trade show a few weeks ago where a buyer told me that although she liked my work, her shops do better with rustic NE type pieces than with more conventional work - she's in cruise ship territory and she said everyone wants something that feels "Alaskan" and rough. OK, less sanding and buffing work for me so that's just fine. It also explains why the better my work has become, the less it's sold - my first bowls that went out to shops here in Homer sold quickly and then less and less as I went thinner, made HFs etc.

Thanks for the tips, I'll try turning the speed up.

I'm mostly working with all the birch up here which is really nice - abundant, spalts easily and a range of colors. The alder is just kind of an experiment

[mike ash]

I basically do the same method as David, however I put the roughed out green bowl instorage for number of months and then do final turning when it is dry. I usually have areas that require extensive sanding, and I do these with a drill sander and finally with a Goex air drill. I'm attaching a photo of an Ashwood bowl I just finished. Note the treatment of a split (crack) that was in the bowl. I usually try to accent natual flaws in my bowls. The other end is a feather I have burned into the wood and some carving to highlight.

Mike Ash'

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