Delta 50-760 1 1/2HP dust collector performance.

[Dewayne Reding]

I've owned one for a few years. Performance is noticeably down lately. It was never a cyclone but it worked better a couple years ago. Any suggestions on performance upgrades that would truly be worth the effort and cost. I am running a 20ft 4" flex hose and move it from tool to tool.

Wire it for 220V? It pops the breaker on 115V regularly on startup.

Clean the cloth bag? Wash it or just use the shopvac?

Paper filter?

Or even just an incremental upgrade is being considered. New shop likely being constructed next summer so the Cyclone will have to wait until after that. Have even thought of stacking another HF or equivalent dust collector with a Y connector but wasn't sure if they would work well together or just fight each other.

[Neil Brooks]

Paper (Cartridge) filter would probably be your biggest bang-for-the-buck.

Second: you're running a pretty long length of flex hose -- roughly the equivalent of THIRTY feet of straight pipe.

Could you move the DC closer to the machines ??

Extra info here:

http://www.deltaportercable.com/uploads/PCD/Documents/News/182DustCollectors.pdf

EDIT: the second DC idea will ONLY help you if they're pulling very close to the same suction. With your Delta and a HF ... that will NOT be the case. I think it would hurt more than it would help, in that case.

[Dewayne Reding]

I can't really move the DC around the shop much. It is trapped in a corner. I could however put a 10 foot hose on a few of the distant machines and only use the 20 footer when really needed. The Craftman zipcode hybrid TS and my 6" jointer are the real mess makers I can run on a 10 footer now. I think I am getting virtually zero "above the table" dust collection right now. Didn't used to be that way. I don't recall if I was on 20 foot hose though. I'll try it today.

[Jason White]

20 feet is way too long a run for 4" flex hose. Consider smooth-wall pipe, even if it's just schedule-20 PVC drain pipe.

As for the 120/240 volt question: You can do either, but it's best to have your DC on a dedicated circuit either way.

Jason


I've owned one for a few years. Performance is noticeably down lately. It was never a cyclone but it worked better a couple years ago. Any suggestions on performance upgrades that would truly be worth the effort and cost. I am running a 20ft 4" flex hose and move it from tool to tool.

Wire it for 220V? It pops the breaker on 115V regularly on startup.

Clean the cloth bag? Wash it or just use the shopvac?

Paper filter?

Or even just an incremental upgrade is being considered. New shop likely being constructed next summer so the Cyclone will have to wait until after that. Have even thought of stacking another HF or equivalent dust collector with a Y connector but wasn't sure if they would work well together or just fight each other.

[Neil Brooks]

I can't really move the DC around the shop much. It is trapped in a corner. I could however put a 10 foot hose on a few of the distant machines and only use the 20 footer when really needed. The Craftman zipcode hybrid TS and my 6" jointer are the real mess makers I can run on a 10 footer now. I think I am getting virtually zero "above the table" dust collection right now. Didn't used to be that way. I don't recall if I was on 20 foot hose though. I'll try it today.

Cutting that hose down by half should make a pretty big difference.

I would consider, though, something like the Wynn 35A (http://www.wynnenv.com/35A_series_cartridge_kit.htm) filter. That article I linked to shows ... in real terms ... what I witnessed with my own DC: much better filtration AND better air flow.

I just ordered 20' of TRUE "smooth-bore" 4" hose for my DC setup. This hose will FLEX, but does not stretch of compress.

It should flow exactly the same way that straight pipe (galvanized or PVC) does, but ... hold me over until I make the leap from one-machine-at-a-time to a plumbed DC system (on hold. We may move).

It was ... in short ... ridiculously expensive ... but ... for the moment ... my best option.

Bends (in hose OR pipe -- elbows or ells), flex hose, chip separators, clogged filters, etc., etc., etc. all add up to "static pressure losses."

Good to minimize them in any way you can.

So ... if you can make your ten foot run *straight,* that'll help, too.

[Matt Day]

I'm curious why it worked better before, as this is the root of his question. Yes 20' may be too long a run, but he presumabely had that on before and now it's not working as well.

I have had the same DC for a few years and haven't noticed this issue, but I'd like to know what to watch out for.

[Neil Brooks]

I'm curious why it worked better before, as this is the root of his question. Yes 20' may be too long a run, but he presumabely had that on before and now it's not working as well.

I have had the same DC for a few years and haven't noticed this issue, but I'd like to know what to watch out for.

Other than clogged filters/filter bags ... my first thought was ... it may not be the DC.

F'rinstance: if you change out your insert, on your TS, to a zero-clearance insert, you get a LOT more dust off the topside of the blade.

My guess was ... something else probably changed.....

[Prashun Patel]

Have you ever cleaned the filter? It does deserve a good pounding every once in a while. I took mine outside with a dustmask, turned it inside out and beat it like Michael Jackson.

When you say it's not working as well these days, which tools do you notice it most with? Could it be clogged blast gates?

[Dewayne Reding]

Other than clogged filters/filter bags ... my first thought was ... it may not be the DC.

F'rinstance: if you change out your insert, on your TS, to a zero-clearance insert, you get a LOT more dust off the topside of the blade.

My guess was ... something else probably changed.....


I am guessing it must have been mostly the hose. I cut it down to 10ft and it is a lot better now on everything except the jointer. It's a 6" Craftsman "Professional". I need to experiment with closing off some of the makeup air or something.

[Neil Brooks]

I am guessing it must have been mostly the hose. I cut it down to 10ft and it is a lot better now on everything except the jointer. It's a 6" Craftsman "Professional". I need to experiment with closing off some of the makeup air or something.

It's surely worth figuring out if dust collection CAN be improved, on the jointer, but ... more CFMs might solve the issue, too, and .... the cartridge filter replacement route WOULD give you more CFM *and* cleaner air in the shop, too -- maybe the most important goal OF dust collection.

It's that fine stuff -- the stuff that gets trapped MUCH better by a 1 micron filter than a 30 micron bag.

But ... yeah ... take a look at the path for your jointer. If you can seal up everything BUT the space around the cutterhead, you should have plenty of 'make-up air' to avoid straining your Delta DC.

This is often a place where duct tape is your friend :)

[Kirk Poore]

I have the same DC, and I use it with everything up to an 18" planer (Oliver 399) using two 10' hoses and a 40 gallon trash can separator in between them. I have no problems. I think you need to clean your bag. Take it outside and beat it over the trash can to loosen as much dust and chips as possible.

Popping the breaker sounds like a loose wire connection issue. That may be causing a voltage drop, too. Check your connection at the motor, and also check your cord to make sure it's undamaged. I run mine on a 20 amp/115 volt circuit now, though I think it was on a 15 amp circuit (by itself) when I had it in my basement.

Kirk

[Dewayne Reding]

I am wondering about the wiring myself. I have run it on several circuits (isolated) that seem to power up the rest of my equipment fine. It's probably time to get out the VOM. It pulls a lot on the startup cycle. After it is running, I can run my 1 3/4 HP TS up on the same circuit without a problem. I don't do that of course, because that is obviously too much for a the circuit. It is definitely the startup of the DC that is tripping the breaker. It is fine once it is running.

And thanks to everyone for all the ideas. I think a lot of little things are adding up to make it underperform. I will take the bag outside and give it a whoopin next.

[David Hostetler]

Shorten the hose, clean the filter bag, and install a separator to keep the filter bag from clogging.

[Curt Harms]

Shorten the hose, clean the filter bag, and install a separator to keep the filter bag from clogging.

That's my vote too, although if the bags are 30 micron that might be worse than no dust collection at all. I'm a big fan of Phil Thien's baffle with dust collectors. The baffle keeps a LOT of crap out of the filter, be it bag or cartridge.

[Dan T Jones]

Neil,
Where did you find the smooth bore hose? Can you post a link?
Dan

[Neil Brooks]

Neil,
Where did you find the smooth bore hose? Can you post a link?
Dan

Yep.

http://www.flexaust.com/products/all_products.php

What I bought is called the FlexTube-PU (http://www.flexaust.com/tractor-vacuum-hose).

It arrived yesterday. While the inside is not dead flat, like PVC would be, it IS flatter/smoother than any other hose I've seen. The hose has decent flexibility, but NO compressibility (it's not a Slinky), which is okay with me.

One thing I noticed, quickly: for a few of my tools (where the DC port is higher off the floor than others), there isn't enough give in the FlexTube PU for the hose to hang happily, while my quick-connect is on the DC port. It wants to pull the connector off the DC port.

Easily solved by putting a roller stand a few feet FROM the tool, and resting the FlexTube hose ON the stand.

My initial impression -- supported by absolutely nothing -- is that there IS a pretty noticeable increase in suction, across the 20' that I bought, compared to the 28' of 'collapsible' 4" DustRight hose that I was using.

It's also *bright* yellow, meaning ... harder to trip over, and ... it seems like you could roll a Bradley Fighting Vehicle over it, and it wouldn't get scuffed.

It ain't cheap, though. Something on the order of nine bucks a foot, for 4" :eek:

[Matt Day]

I should clean my bag too, as I never have before. I thought that the dust can help filter the air more, but I suppose too much of it will cause it to stop allowing air to pass through it at all.

[Mark Carlson]

If you go with a cartridge filter I would recommend pre-seperating with a Phil Thien baffle or something similar. I use a super dust deputy with a 50-760. My wynn filter stays very clean and I don't lose suction like I did when my bag filter got clogged. I would also shorten your runs and switch to 5in hose if possible.

~mark

[David Hostetler]

Agreed. But since he said it's a Delta 50-760, those come stock with 1 micron bags....

[mreza Salav]

I used to have that cyclone. On a 15amp circuit sometimes it would trip the breaker.
As for the performance, I had to take out the filter once in a while (like every 2 or 3 times I filled the lower bag) and clean it thoroughly:
take it inside out, shake well, and use a shop-vac to take the rest of the dust).
It would make a huge difference in performance.

[Todd Kinsfather]

Neil,
Where did you find the smooth bore hose? Can you post a link?
Dan

Neil bought an exellent hose.
A poor mans version can be had from HF in this kit: http://www.harborfreight.com/dust-collector-accessory-kit-93601.html
Compared to the typical DC flex hose, the inside surface is very smooth with very minor bumps from the wire. It is also heavier and stiffer so it will need a 90 degree fitting or 45 in some sharp curve places where a full flex hose you would just kink or curve into position. It is pretty durable to walk over but not as much as the Flex-Tube PU that Neil purchased.

I don't know if this is the same hose, it doesn't look like it, but HF can be misleading. http://www.harborfreight.com/4-inch-x-10-ft-transparent-dust-collector-hose-96478.html

[Dewayne Reding]

Agreed. But since he said it's a Delta 50-760, those come stock with 1 micron bags....

It does, which makes it even more likely to clog I would think. I will try some compressed air to get it really clean. Outside of course. I may also try some larger diameter hose, but I wonder if the increas in cfm might be offset by the loss of velocity. Surely that subject has been beat to death. I'll do some forum searching.