It's cold out there, anyone use spray insulation

[Gregory Myers]

My passion for woodworking has gotten the full part of me, but I have to admin the weather affects how I feel about jumping out there in my detached garage. I have found that in the middle of summer my sweat has dripped onto my wood die which just makes you kick yourself. Lately I find myself cuddling around the heater between cuts because it's so cold out there.

I'm in Alabama, so we do get the extremes, not like you all up in Maine, but it's enough to make you shiver. I've been thinking about putting up drywall and insulation, but I still have to think about those big garage doors. I don't want to remove them, because we do anticipate moving in the future, so I'm thinking about spraying the garage doors with spray insulation.

Has anyone sprayed a garage door? If so how effective was it?

Greg

[Logan William]

I have an old fiberglass garage door and recently put 2" thick, foil faced iso foam on and it seems to have made a big difference. It took several hours to cut the sheets to size and glue them up and make sure the door would still open, but I'm happy with the results so far. If you do spray the doors make sure you cover/block off the pivot points so that it doesn't become an evening with a knife to chop away insulation so you can open it!

[Ron Natalie]

I've got spray foam in my shop walls, but the big door (hangar) is insulated with rigid foam (2") covered with the same stuff I waterproofed the crawl space was just so it looks nice.

[George Bregar]

I have an insulated detached garage shop in northern WI so we actually do have extremes. Haven't done anything to the garage door and it's fine at least for me. Insulate the walls and ceilings first and see if you really have to worry about the garage doors.

[Art Mulder]

IMHO, nothing you do to an existing uninsulated door is going to look as nice as a new two-layer injected foam door.
And appearance has to count, if resale is your concern.

[Thomas Bank]

I'd say that gluing pieces of the foil faced rigid insulation to the insides of the doors would do you better than the spray foam. As has been mentioned, you don't want to gum up the operation of the door.

Temperature extremes? It's been in the upper thirties / low forties this past week so I've been out to the shop a lot more. Prior to that it had been in the teens and twenties for entirely too long - which was making me think twice about how much time I wanted to spend out there.

[Craig Michael]

Insulate walls and ceilings first, around windows, etc. Make sure you stop all air leaks too. I would not spray anything on an uninsulated door, the foam will look horrible. For the doors, you could replace them with insulated doors or buy some 4x8 sheets of rigid foam fur out around the garage doors as best you can with smaller pieces of rigid foam and make a removeable wall from the rigid panels. Where the tracks for the doors are you can fill that area with an old towel, etc. Will it work like your house insulation? No but it will work well and it's simple and easily removed. Make sure to use the tongue and groove rigid foam, better seal and it will stay together better.

[Gregory Myers]

I'm glad you guys answered the thread! I had no idea what options I had out there...sometimes I just jump in feet first without doing my research.

I think I have it now....I'll work the drywall and insulation on the walls first; not that it is hard but I've been resisting because of the nice storage I've had with all the exposed 2 x 4 s. It's a great way to hang up all the clamps. After that I'll check out if it made a difference, but more than likely will install some insulated doors from Lowes. The couple hundred bucks will be well worth the money.

Sounds easy, but it will be some serious work. Unfortunately, that also takes away from the wood working.

Thanks all!

Greg

[Bill ThompsonNM]

You can also google "garage door insulation kit". And you'll find there are a lot of kits made just to insulate garage doors which still keep the door looking nice. My dad installed one and it looked very professional.

[Marty Paulus]

Be careful with adding anything to roll up doors. You may overstress the counterbalance springs with the additional weight. If you have an electric opener on it you may risk damage to that as well.

[keith jensen]

I just googled and noticed something interesting on one of the results. They used solid foam panels that had dados cut in the back side. This allows the panel to bend. They bow it out towards themselves and then place it into the cavity. The bow obviously goes away and leaves a flat visual surface since the dados are towards the door. You must lose the insulating properties a bit with each dado though I guess. Company name is Atlas EPS. 85 bucks per 8-9' door so double that for a double door.

Maybe you could just use the solid foam and then seal the gaps between the foam (not the hinge points) with the spray foam. Seems like for asthetics, you could rivet a thin composite panel over the foam to make it look nicer too. I think they spray foam would really only be necessary if you had some draft areas. I can't imagine that having a small portion of the door uninsulated would be absurdly bad.

Try calling one of the spray foam companies in the phone book, they may have done this before too.

Let us know what you find....

[Craig Michael]

I'm glad you guys answered the thread! I had no idea what options I had out there...sometimes I just jump in feet first without doing my research.

I think I have it now....I'll work the drywall and insulation on the walls first; not that it is hard but I've been resisting because of the nice storage I've had with all the exposed 2 x 4 s. It's a great way to hang up all the clamps. After that I'll check out if it made a difference, but more than likely will install some insulated doors from Lowes. The couple hundred bucks will be well worth the money.

Sounds easy, but it will be some serious work. Unfortunately, that also takes away from the wood working.

Thanks all!

Greg

Talk to some local door installers and see what they could price them out for. The doors from lowes are not great, nor are the HD ones. The top brand used around here is a canandian door co Garaga, some use wayne dalton too but the Garaga are the best. I'm in the Northeast so Garaga dealers are all over, not sure how available they'll be down south. Check out their website though.

[David Hostetler]

Another vote for foil faced rigid insulation glued to the inside of the garage door panels. I have mine 2 layers thick, which takes up the entire cavity, and I have the foil facing both in and out so I get a radiant barrier effect as well... Mind you, cosmetics is NOT a concern I am taking into account... I will be replacing my garage doors if I go to sell this house. They are aluminum doors, and have taken a beating over the years...

My shop is insulated on the doors, ceiling, and common wall with the house. I have 2 uninsulated walls, and 2 large penetrations for the A/C that cause drafts. This time of year the penetrations (ducts) are stuffed with polyester batting and capped off which helps reduce the impact of the draft there... I do have some penetrations in the drywall on the uninsulated walls where pipes come through, I have filled those voids with spray foam, with some success. Make sure you stop the drafts with garage door gaskets as well... They can be drafty buggers...

[Ole Anderson]

The couple hundred bucks will be well worth the money.


I just priced two Clopay doors at the BORG. My big 8'x18' was $1741 DIY and my small 8'x7' rear door was $655, for the premium three layer R17.2 . I may hold off for a while...

[Eduard Nemirovsky]

+1 on this one -"Be careful with adding anything to roll up doors. You may overstress the counterbalance springs with the additional weight. If you have an electric opener on it you may risk damage to that as well."

[Steve Peterson]

I added 1.5" thick styrofoam panels to my 10' wide door. I bought 4' by 8' panels from the borg because the pre-cut kits were not the rigth size. It didn't seem like the foam had much weight, but it was enough to throw off the balance. I needed to have the springs adjusted.

It made a HUGE difference in the comfort level, both during the summer when I run a window AC unit and in the winter when I run a small baseboard heater. This assumes that the walls and ceiling are also fully insulated.

Steve

[Thomas L. Miller]

Greg,
I built my shop about 1.5 years ago. It's 2 story (my wife appropriated the upstairs for a quilting room, imagine that). I used spray foam on the walls. The second floor sits on a truss system. I had foam sprayed into the space between the floors and ran the HVAC ducts between the floors as well. This keeps the HVAC in a totally enclosed, insulated space and greatly increases the efficiency of the HVAC unit. I purchased an insulated garage door for the shop. The entire structure is ~1,000 sq. feet. It's heated/air conditioned by a 1.5 ton heat pump. The structure has only added about 4% to my yearly electricity bill over the past year. Spray foam insulation is also fantastic for sound dampening. My wife is not disturbed by the dust collector, planer, jointer or table saw. Needless to say, I'm a huge fan of the stuff. I live in east Texas. We have high temps and high humidity in the summer and it's about 20 degrees F. right now. The temp in the shop is a comfortable 70 degrees F right now. As an additional benefit, I've had NO rust on any of the machines due to the humidity control.
If you have any questions, I'll be happy to help if I can. I retired from Trane (I was a finance/risk management wonk, but had access to all the HVAC energy-application engineering I needed). I have been told numerous times by our engineers that to make the most from energy efficiency expenditures, insulation is the highest return.
Hope this helps,
Tom

[David Hostetler]

How expensive is it to / have spray foam installed? My drywall is junk anyway, so ripping that down won't break my heart...

[Neil Brooks]

My brother did his (3-car garage) with the rigid (EPS) foam. No noticeable effect on the weights/balance/operation of the door.

I did mine (2-car garage. No shop. Shop's in the basement, and -- don't hate me -- comfortable year-round without using heat or a/c) with Prodex foil-backed bubble stuff. BIG difference:

https://s3.amazonaws.com/ljimg/lct5zhi.jpg

https://s3.amazonaws.com/ljimg/lct60ei.jpg

Simple press-fit. Cut to the exact ID of each panel, and pressed them in place. Friction holds them in. Think I paid $70 for a roll that was ... easily ... 40-50% more than I needed. Took about an hour to install.

[Craig Michael]

How expensive is it to / have spray foam installed? My drywall is junk anyway, so ripping that down won't break my heart...

Installed on what, the stud bays? Figure at least twice what Fiberglass would cost installed (for open cell foam), and closed cell foam is twice that of open cell. It is great but it is not cheap. You'd be much better off using foam yourself and air sealing all area then do cellulose for the bays.

[Chris Parks]

I don't live in a cold climate but here is what I would do if you are going to move soon. I would build a wall just inside the doors and insulate that, a cheap and dirty wall out of framing timber etc. It would seal the doors from the workshop totally so would have sides and top back to the door frame. You could put opening doors in it for large item access and it would not cost a fortune and could be pulled down easily. It would not work if cars were going in and out but for a workshop it should.

[Michael N Taylor]

There are 2 kinds of foam, closed and open cell, the closed cell is moisture resistant and helps to structurally strenghten the walls or ceiling. The closed cell is not moisture resistant and it provides no structural strength. The closed cell R value runs alomst 50% more than the closed cell. I have used the closed cell in 6" walls and opu get an r value of 43 I think plus you do not need to add any vapor barrier to the walls.

[Thomas L. Miller]

David,
When I had my shop built about a year ago, it cost $900 to have insulation sprayed on all walls, between the floors and on on the underside of the roof joists and decking. The shop is ~ 1,000 sq. ft. total. It's a heck of a good deal, especially if you look at the life cycle cost of owning the building.

[Ryan Clapper]

I've insulated two garage doors with blue foam board. One I used 1.5" and the other 2". The 1.5 inch I cut slightly larger than the opening. It slid in behind the bottom lip of the panel then wiggled it up just a bit so the lips would hold it. The other I just cut 2" board to size and glued it directly to the door. One door was 16' x 7' and the other was 14' x 7'. The smaller had no opener and used thicker board. I had the garage door installer come out for $50 and tighten up the spring just a bit and it's fine. I had also added rigid supports across the door to prevent sag. The larger door I used thinner foam, 1.5". The opener would shudder once in a while. I called my installer, he installed rigid supports or struts across the door to hold the extra weight, adjusted the spring slightly and made adjustments to the opener. Both doors have been fine for 2 - 6 years now.

I would suggest talking to an installer. Not a company like overhead door as you will get the canned answer. Talk to a small installer with years of experience. Someone that is not worried about the "safe I'm not getting sued or I don't know what I'm doing answer".

I'll take a pic of the door in the house I still live in and post it for reference.

Also, I have seen many garage doors sprayed. Just ask the person doing the spraying if they have experience with spraying garage doors and what they know about sag, and how it effects the opener and springs. Talk to a garage door installer about the same. You might also ask if he could estimate the additional weight the foam would add for your size door. That would help the installer. Residential doors are really low gauge metal and generally need struts to keep them from sagging with the insulated weight.

I plan to insulate two doors this year, a 14x10 and a 16x10. I'm definitely going to look at spray vs foam board. Weight, insulating value etc. The nice thing about spray foam is you don't have the gaps around the blue foam board where the panels fold over. The spray is also going to add a little more rigidity as opposed to the blue foam board. If I go the spray route the struts will have to be installed first.