Going to mill some boards, need advice

[neil schlosser]

I found a band saw mill that I can use for the cost of gas, so I'm hoping to start cutting boards over Christmas break. My question is, if I'm cutting the logs into boards the day same day I cut the trees down, do I need to seal the board ends?

I'll be cutting 4/4 or 5/4 from cherry and red oak. I have Anchorseal for the project, but was recently told that I wouldn't need it if I'm taking them to the sawmill right away.

[Derek Gilmer]

Not sure on the anchor seal. BUt I will offer the advice of cut the boards thick enough to where when you plane/joint off the band saw marks you'll still have the 4/4 or 5/4 size you need.

[Terry Beadle]

You should apply sealer to the ends of the boards as soon as possible.

[Bernhard Lampert]

Ideally, Anchorseal should be applied as soon as the tree is cut down. Applying the sealer after milling will not help much and will take a lot more material.
Cheers,
Bernhard

[Darius Ferlas]

A cherry tree was milled for me last year in April. No sealing of any kind was applied to the trunk before milling which happened about 2 weeks after the tree was downed (March). I used oil paint to seal the 4/4 and 8/4 boards. Two of the boards developed checks, the rest seems just fine after a mild Spring and very hot Summer in a solar kiln.

I guess the climate and relative humidity didn't allow rapid drying. During warmer seasons I'd seal the trunk asap.

[John Toigo]

I would not mill it less than 6/4. Any cupping or warping and you'll lose the thickness when you finish it to size.

[Mark Bolton]

If the band mill is any good there is no way you would have to over-saw your boards by much. When we saw 4/4 our boards are just under a inch off the mill. 5/4 come off the mill a bit over 1 3/16". If the mill is horrible, sawing thick and thin, or twist then you would have to allow for that or better yet spend a few hours figuring out why the mill is sawing badly. After that sticker and weight your pile to help with cupping.

The bonus to a band mill is "suppose to be" how clean the boards come off and the thin kerf. It would make no sense to have to saw boards at 1 1/2" to get 3/4" finished. If that is the case you would be better off the roll the mill down in the woods and leave it there to rot.

As has been said, end sealer should go on as soon after the tree is cut and as its bucked up into saw logs. Moisture loss begins immediately.

Mark

[Jon Endres]

End sealer is best applied as soon as possible after a tree is cut into logs. It loses its' effectiveness as time goes by, and has no effect once the boards are dry. I seal the end of any log that I think has a chance to be milled. The Anchorseal evens out the rate of drying, and prevents end checks during the drying process. If you have the stuff already, no reason not to use it.

As for thickness suggestions - I'll echo Mark, above. Any mill that is in decent adjustment AND the sawyer knows what he's doing, should be able to get you 3/4" finished thickness out of 4/4 stock (sawn rough to 1-1/16" or 1-1/8", depending on the mill) and full 1" out of 5/4 rough. Sawing 6/4 is just a huge waste of wood. I had a Woodmizer mill for six years, and with some careful sawing, stickering and drying, was able to often get full 1" stock out of rough 4/4. If it's flat to begin with, you have a full 1/8" to play with.

[Mark Bolton]

with some careful sawing, stickering and drying, was able to often get full 1" stock out of rough 4/4. If it's flat to begin with, you have a full 1/8" to play with.

This is why we often saw 4/4 at 1" rather than 1 1/16" - 1 1/8". You have to take into account that the scales on most mills are still based on many factors. Industry standards pretty much dictate the scales. The scales of old are based around circle saws which cut a much rougher board and will also cut dull but the blade gets out of shape producing thick/thin and bad boards. This requires a lot more material to allow for you to end up with the anticipated yield. A circle saw will still cut even when dull but with a band speed, and quality, degrade very fast and if you keep pushing them the blade just snaps. Dull circle saws also require more plane-able material in that they produce far more surface checking than a band mill will especially in hardwoods.

Further, scales don't allow for the tree's and as you say, the sawyer. If you are sawing bad trees your going to have to work really hard (knowledge) to get decent wood. If you are sawing pretty trees the process is much easier.

I am not sure which is true but many say the small band mill operator is more discerning sawing only prime trees but I seem to see and hear the opposite with many small mills trying to process free/cheap trees which are often yard tree's or junk trees that are squirrel'y, bushy, and so on, because they are cheap/free. This is counterproductive in my opinion for a small band mill. With a small mill you have a massive amount of time, money, and extremely expensive joint cartilage, invested in every board that comes off a small mill. So you better make sure of two things. One, make sure what you put on the mill will yeild usable material, and two, make sure you have the knowledge and ability to produce usable material from what you put on the mill. There is no point of sawing a pile of boards that will simply become a bonfire or barn siding down the road.

There is a lot to knowing how to saw the tension out of a bad log and even how to saw it out of a good log so the end product remains stable and useful. The word "sawyer" speaks to this clearly as to someone who is able to transform a less than desirable log into useful or even desirable wood. I feel like I do o.k. at it when we saw but I am no sawyer.

Mark

[Howard Acheson]

>>>> if I'm cutting the logs into boards the day same day I cut the trees down, do I need to seal the board ends?

In fact, the proper time to coat the ends is as quickly as possible after felling. Coating after a few hours is not going to prevent checking.

So coat logs as soon as possible and before milling.

[Mark Bolton]

>>>> if I'm cutting the logs into boards the day same day I cut the trees down, do I need to seal the board ends?

In fact, the proper time to coat the ends is as quickly as possible after felling. Coating after a few hours is not going to prevent checking.

So coat logs as soon as possible and before milling.

Your post reminded me that I had meant to add in my other post that while it may be nit-picking, you have to remember as well that a lot of these posts state "prevent checking". Of course sealing the logs will help "reduce" checking but some boards/logs are going to end check no matter what. You are basically trying to minimize the small end checks that occur from rapid drying of the exposed end.

Mark

[Scott T Smith]

Neil, I take it by now you understand that end sealer goes on right away.... Many of the respondees are professional millers and know what they are talking about.

Make sure that you have some sharp bands, and look for signs of metal in the logs (band killers for sure). Use dry stickers on your wood, and be sure that the stickers are closely lined up underneath each other. More stickers = flatter boards; sticker on 24" centers or less (I use 16").

Put your clearest lumber on the bottom of your stacks; else the movement around the defects (knots, etc) may negatively affect any clear lumber stacked above them.

[neil schlosser]

I've got an area to dry the wood, and will have stickers in hand before I start cutting. We've done this before, I've just never done it in the winter. Still planning to cut it at 4/4 or 5/4, as my finished sizes need to be 3/4 and 4/4 after cleanup and planing.

Appreciate the input on the sealer. I'll go ahead and use it.

[Danny Hamsley]

Rough sawn hardwood for the commercial market for 4/4 is sawn at 1 & 1/8" thick. 5/4 is sawn 1.25" plus 1/8th".

[Scott T Smith]

Rough sawn hardwood for the commercial market for 4/4 is sawn at 1 & 1/8" thick. 5/4 is sawn 1.25" plus 1/8th".

Unless you are quartersawning the material. In that instance, add 1/8" for 4/4 and 3/16" for 5/4.

[Paul Bombardt]

Neil,
With due respect to others that have commented, I disagree on the need to seal the logs. I live in an area that has multiple mills, and two years ago I sold 88 veneer quality walnut, cherry and oak trees. I have yet to see professional loggers seal logs after bucking the trees up.

I have also hired band saw milling for my own use here on the farm multiple times sawing up thousands of board feet of cherry, walnut, ash and maple. In my experience it is more important how you sticker the wood during the drying process to prevent end checking than sealing the ends of logs or boards. I think the bottom line is if you only have one or two trees and the wood is precious, then do everything you can to keep as much of it usable. In my situation, cherry and walnut are abundant and I can afford to cut off 6-8 inches on each end.

[Danny Hamsley]

I have air dried thousands and thousands of feet of hardwood and find that end sealing is a huge reduction in defect and loss to checking/splitting.

[Scott T Smith]

I have air dried thousands and thousands of feet of hardwood and find that end sealing is a huge reduction in defect and loss to checking/splitting.

In addition to Danny's comment, I have kiln dried hundreds of thousands of board feet of oak, and have experienced the same thing. It is easy to differentiate between end sealed versus non-end sealed lumber in the kiln.

Although the argument can be made that it's no big deal to cut 6" off of each end of the board, if you have a 10' board that represents a 10% loss of material. That's not acceptable for me, as I want to maximize the fruits of my labor as well as provide my customers with the highest quality lumber.

I agree with Paul's comments though, I too have never seen loggers apply end sealer, and he is 100% right about the importance of stickering.

In summary, applying end sealer is not a "need", but it can be a "benefit" if you want to maximize yield.

[Mark Bolton]

I have never seen loggers applying end sealer but I have seen it applied many times in the yards. We often see tractor trailer loads of logs running on the highway with the ends sealed. Some yards even color code with the sealer. I will admit though it's far from the norm in commercial logging. I would imagine at that scale the loss is not offset by the cost o the sealer and labor to apply it.

On a small scale it's a definate advantage.

Mark