50 cent LN/LV block plane

[bradley strong]

I modified 2 garden variety Stanley block planes to work as good as a high end block plane. Even with sharp blades they used to chatter and gouge like crazy. The reason they chatter so badly is the complete design stupidity of the ramp/frog. They basically don't have one, and to make matters worse, the lever cap puts pressure behind the ramp bending the blade.

I was going to chuck them in the trash when I had an idea. I made a ramp from JB Weld. I scuffed the area with sand paper and cleaned it with alcohol. I put the JB Weld in place and let it cure. On the red one, I used self-adhesive sandpaper on the back of the blade to sand the ramp to shape. On the black one, I had the idea to use the blade as a form. I covered the blade with masking tape to prevent it from sticking. It worked great and required no sanding.

Both planes now take shavings less than 1 thousandth of an inch. The shavings in the picture are from poplar, soft maple, cherry, and curly, maple. Each piece had a smooth as glass finish with no tear out. JB Weld can be bought at any auto parts or hardware store.

[Bill Houghton]

Very clever.

Older Stanley planes, including some that are considered junk now, had considerably more bedding for the iron than the postwar planes. I'm waiting to get (back*) what I remember as a Stanley 120 block plane, considered a cheap tool suitable for discouraging cats from entering the shop, and the bedding is midway between the two planes you show.

This is not to be critical of your work - it's always good to use creativity to salvage a bad tool rather than throw it out, and you're a lot smarter for your work than someone who just went out and bought him/herself an LN plane. You now understand some of the elements of a how a tool works. Plus, you saved mucho money, and have tools that perform well for you.

I'm a lot lazier than you: I've had some block planes with the kind of pencil-thin bedding yours had, and have given them away.

*See, after 41 years together and long since having received the obvious Christmas presents, my sweetie and I decided that it makes way more sense for us each to get what we might like for Christmas, give it to the other one, and then get all surprised when we unwrap our presents. This was part of a great eBay score - multiple items, several of them worth what I paid for the whole thing, with some freebies thrown in.

[Zach England]

So you put glue on a plane and called it a Lie-Nielsen?

[bradley strong]

I figured it was worth a try. I already had the JB Weld. I was gonna toss them anyway. I couldn't convince myself to give or sell them to anyone else. I simply couldn't torture anyone that way.

I also spent a few minutes flattening the soles and sharpening the blades. I used one today on my current project in Peruvian Walnut, and it preformed perfectly.

It's hard to believe that a team of people who design and sell tools for a living could produce such a fundamentally flawed design. It couldn't have cost them 5 cents more to make it right.

Maybe they have it right to make money though. People buy them, realize they are junk and throw them away. If they were quality and worked well, they might actually sell less of them. Every beginning woodworker buys one and throws it away or lets it sit for unmpteen years like I did.

[bradley strong]

So you put glue on a plane and called it a Lie-Nielsen?

I never used the words Lie Nielson. I was waiting for a post like this. It's why I rarely participate in forums.

For a few cents you take a junk plane and make it perform like a high end plane. I own Lie Nieson planes, and these planes now perform just as well.

I just thought this might help a few folks who are tight on money get their planes working properly.

I can delete the whole thing if it offends you.

[george wilson]

J.B. Weld does dry hard as blazes,and somehow stands 600º+ of heat. It really is quite useful,if not attractive.

[Jim Belair]

I like it. Basically the same idea for improving the blade bed as presented in the FWW article of a few years back Soup Up Your Spokeshave by Brian Boggs.

Great help to those on a limited tool budget. Might keep a few folks from getting discouraged.

Jim B

[Zach England]

No offense taken or intended...just a little bit of levity.

[Andrew Gibson]

I have 4 or 5 old block planes, they are like rabbits... only some how they can reproduce asexually, you only need 1 and it will turn into more.

Maybe I should give this a try then pass on a useful tool when a chance presents itself.

[Chris Vandiver]

Awhile back I did exactly the same thing with an old infill shoulder plane. Worked quite well.

[Joel Goodman]

I would call it a "JB Infill" -- or is "Welded Infill" better? Please let us know how it holds up over time. Thanks for the tip.

[Zach England]

Is JB Weld similar to Bondo?

[David Weaver]

Seems like a rational fix to me. They are junk without fixing the bedding problem.

As far as the design goes, they're not designing them for people who are going to do fine woodworking. At that end of the range, they're designing them to be produced as cheaply as possible. No clue who the target market is, bird house makers?

The actual performance part of a plane is fairly simple. Bed it at the right places and make a mechanism to keep it tight.

[bradley strong]

Is JB Weld similar to Bondo?
JB Weld is an epoxy based product with metal fillers. It is used to repair engine blocks and even exhaust manifolds. Bondo is a polyester resin with easy to sand fillers. It may be adequate to fill a plane with, but I would spend a few bucks on JB Weld. You can get it at any hardware store or auto parts store.

[Paul Saffold]

It is a 2 part epoxy like product. I suspect it might have a filler too.

It is real handy to have on hand. I used it when I tuned up a 151 spokeshave per the article by Brian Boggs in FWW. Also for internal thread repair - just don't forget to put some lube on the bolt/screw.

[john brenton]

Sometimes your levity sounds like fightin' words. Seriously. We use emoticons for a reason. We can't see each other's faces and it's easy to misinterpret things. :)


No offense taken or intended...just a little bit of levity.

[Derek Cohen]

Brad, it's a good fix.

I have an article on my website where I used epoxy in a similar way, but there the emphasis was on raising the plane blade so as to close up the mouth (Stanley #140 skew block plane with fixed mouth).

http://www.inthewoodshop.com/ToolRestorations/Tuning%20a%20Stanley%20140%20Skew%20Block%20Plane. html

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Jim Koepke]

Bradley,

That is a great fix for a recurring problem. Great minds think alike. The use of epoxy to improve the bedding of a block plane is a good tool for the quiver of every fettler.

As far as the manufacturing of a better bed on a plane is concerned, the cost was not so much in the material. There may have been a small amount of material lost due to problems caused during the cooling of the casting with the extra material. The real cost was in the machining process. The smaller bed area allowed for less labor and a wider margin for mechanical tolerance.

At the time many of these "junk" planes were made, the average buyer was likely buying a plane to tackle one problem and then set it on a shelf in case it was ever needed again. Many members of the general public will base their buying decisions on price. When this becomes a driving force or removing every cent from the cost of production, quality is sure to suffer.

I have used JB Weld to repair threads on bench planes. Though I tend to build the surface up a bit and then restore the threads with a tap.

Calling it a 50¢ LN/LV is fine with me. Especially when compared to someone saying if you spend $100 for a blade, then your old Stanley/Bailey can be a $20 LN/LV. Your math is better, and so is the reality.

Thanks for sharing.

jtk

[george wilson]

We use J.B. Weld to fill in tiny gaps in master models for jewelry casting. The tiniest gap or teeny little hole where solder didn't fill in is a trap for the rubber mold material. This mold is vulcanized at fairly high temp. High enough we are afraid to use lead solder. It works fine.

I think it must have some ceramic content,as well as being loaded with metal dust.

[James Taglienti]

I have a couple Bailey type planes that I used JB weld and bondo on. There is a slight gap where the frog and body meet, so I just smeared some bondo in there, put the plane back together, and let it dry that way. Then I trimmed off the gunk after wards. I think it helped some. Probably as much as glass bedding a rifle?

The best 5 minute improvement I've made on a plane is flattening both sides of the cutter.

[bradley strong]

I used both of the block planes today to plane the end grain on some ash. They both worked great. I was never able to plane end grain with them before. They would just chatter and bounce. Today they made a sweet, swooshing sound and peeled off a nice, thin shaving. The surface left behind was like glass.

This is such an incredible difference in performance. From door stop to premium performance for a little JB Weld and 10 minutes of labor. I hope others will try this and report their results.

[raul segura]

I have a Stanley 45 great price, but other than that I have all cheapo planes. I love a good simple fix. Ill have to look at my planes !!
JB 5 minute and the slower glue is fantastic. Ive used it for making very small molds for lead,threading, filling in wood, metal etc.etc. I like to shave and slice unwanted parts before it hardens completely It reminders me much of body filler with more integrity. If you haven't tried it get some place it in a baggy, as it some times leaches out of tube and when you don't think you have a way of repairing something it will come to the rescue.
And now I will go into my very cold garage and take a look at my soon to be upgrade, " 50¢ LN/LV". X 4.
Thanks.

[Joel Goodman]

I have a question about the JB weld used by the OP -- at my local hardware they had a JB weld product that was labelled "quick" or something like that -- I believe the set up (drying ) time was 4 or 5 minutes. Am I right that I need the JB weld with a longer set up time? Or is the faster product OK? Or is all JB weld 5 minute? Sign me confused!!!

[Bruce Haugen]

Nice solution to an old problem! I think I'll give that a try on an old 60.5.

[bradley strong]

I have a question about the JB weld used by the OP -- at my local hardware they had a JB weld product that was labelled "quick" or something like that -- I believe the set up (drying ) time was 4 or 5 minutes. Am I right that I need the JB weld with a longer set up time? Or is the faster product OK? Or is all JB weld 5 minute? Sign me confused!!!

I used the "quick" stuff for the ones in the picture. It was about 60 degrees F in my shop at the time. I still let them cure over night for the sake of it. I'm sure the low temp slowed the set time.

I also stood them on end in case the JB Weld would slump. Only apply very light pressure to the lever cap. If you bow the blade, you'll bow the new bed.

[bradley strong]

I have a question about the JB weld used by the OP -- at my local hardware they had a JB weld product that was labelled "quick" or something like that -- I believe the set up (drying ) time was 4 or 5 minutes. Am I right that I need the JB weld with a longer set up time? Or is the faster product OK? Or is all JB weld 5 minute? Sign me confused!!!

I used the "quick" stuff for the ones in the picture. It was about 60 degrees F in my shop at the time. I still let them cure over night for the sake of it. I'm sure the low temp slowed the set time.

I also stood them on end in case the JB Weld would slump. Only apply very light pressure to the lever cap. If you bow the blade, you'll bow the new bed.

[Roy Wall]

Nice Fix.

I've always used JB Weld for more common 'connection' repairs.........this is a great tip to try out on the millions of Stanley 220s floating around.

[Joel Goodman]

Thanks for the clarification on the JB weld type -- good tip about standing on the toe end to keep the JB weld where it should be.

[george wilson]

May not apply to JB Weld,but in epoxys,I find that the 5 minute stuff doesn't dry as hard as the longer curing time epoxys. given the choice,I'd go for the longer cure time JB.