Methods of work?

[steven c newman]

Which do you do first? Cut the tenons to size, and then make the mortise to fit, or the other way around? :confused: Am I doing things backwards by doing tenons first?

[Lee Schierer]

It is easier to cut tenons to fit the mortices than the other way around. I cut the mortices first and then cut the tenons to fit the cleaned up mortice.

[Neil Brooks]

I cut mortises first, but ... probably solely out of habit.

If you can't nail the fit to a few thou, on the first go-around (like ... probably ... most of us) ... it's probably a matter of which you prefer to fiddle with.

I'm more accustomed to fiddling with the tenons.

[John Coloccia]

If I'm doing them by hand, I just cut them both to my layout lines and everything fits usually pretty much without test fitting. By machine, it's way easier to adjust a tenon to fit a mortise than the other way around. The only thing is taking material away from the correct side of the tenon so you end up with a flush edge. Take it from the wrong side and you'll end up with a step you need to sand away. I think the real tricks to nailing these on the first try is:

1) always cut and mark from the same face so any little variation in thickness doesn't telegraph to the tenon
2) even if I'm machine cutting, I always scribe the layout lines anyhow so if something gets off a touch somewhere, I know where to remove the wood.

That's just my opinion, though, and what works for me.

[Neil Brooks]

That's just my opinion, though, and what works for me.

And ... per usual ... pretty excellent advice.

[steven c newman]

That I got into. I cut the tenons first and let them help lay out the mortises. In some cases, where the tenon is only cut on one side, making an off-set, it helps me locate where the mortises will be. Just a habit. Tenons are done on the table saw ( no jig, just nibble away), and the mortise is then chopped out by hand.

[John Coloccia]

I don't have one myself because I don't normally do this kind of work, but what's really cool to have is one of the wheel marking gauges, like the Tite-Marks, with the two adjustable mortise wheels. You can set the width of the tenon you want, and then even if you want an offset, you can easily just move the gauge to the offset you want and the mortise width will be exactly the same. Usually my mortises all end up flush so I mark one side of the mortise/tenon on all my pieces, and then mark the other side on all my pieces. I have a project coming up that will require offsets, though, so I'll probably pick one up for that. It's just one of those little things that takes my measurin' and figurin' out of the equation. 5 minutes in the shop with me will convince you that taking me out of the equation is always a good idea!

[Forrest Bonner]

No offense, but if you use slip tenons you do not have to worry about fitting a tenon to a mortise. Cut all you mortises using a router. Size your tenon board to a tight or loose fit as you desire. If all your mortises are cut with the same bit you can make your slip tenons on a long piece and cut them to whatever length you need. May sound like 'mass production' but I get really good fitting joints with very little hassle and I never worry if my tenon will fit. Chamfer the edges of the tenon board before cutting to length and you get a lot of glue surface area with the ability to adjust the joint fit at assembly (into the rounded ends of the mortise).
Forrest

[Mike Henderson]

No offense, but if you use slip tenons you do not have to worry about fitting a tenon to a mortise. Cut all you mortises using a router. Size your tenon board to a tight or loose fit as you desire. If all your mortises are cut with the same bit you can make your slip tenons on a long piece and cut them to whatever length you need. May sound like 'mass production' but I get really good fitting joints with very little hassle and I never worry if my tenon will fit. Chamfer the edges of the tenon board before cutting to length and you get a lot of glue surface area with the ability to adjust the joint fit at assembly (into the rounded ends of the mortise).
Forrest
What's a "slip" tenon? Is that the same as a loose tenon?

Mike

[Dave MacArthur]

Yep, loose tenon, slip tenon, same. Domino is the same thing too. And dowels. And for that matter biscuits, though not strong enough for joinery usually.

If it was just all about the structural aspects of the joint, then IMO dowels a la DowelMax or Domino would be the way to go. Or roll your own with a router. However, there are so many styles and designs where the joinery is part of the beauty... Arts and Crafts, Mission, wedged tenons on massive tables or beds or work-benches for that medieval/Viking look (is it just me, or is that Viking style the epitome of cool?), some Japanese styled stuff.

The only reason I haven't bought a Domino is that I keep having this sneaking suspicion that if I'm taking the time to not pocket screw, I probably should show the joint. That way, even if my design is crap, I can point and say, "YEAH, but look at that nice joint!"

Interesting thread as it made me realize I've done it both orders, so reading folks answers is helpful for me also.

[Ron Bontz]

I am going to go out on a limb here and guess back in the day...when you had to cut mortise and tenons with a hammer and chisel it took long enough to chisel one mortise let alone two. Then you still had to chisel the tenon. And then adjust the tenon to fit snug on both mortise joints. Then add the holes and pegs to put in them.
Modern technology. A wonderful thing. All the options it brings us.:)

[steven c newman]

The few times I've used a router, it was for a sliding dovetail type of mortise. I had some angled aprons for a couple of tables, and needed them to join the legs easier. I cut the "slot" on two sides of each leg, then made the Mating parts on the aprons, all on a router table. Aprons had a 5 degree angle on each end. Seemed to work out ok. Now I just chop them out with a good chisel, saves set-up time for me. Oh, a picture of that leg/apron? Don't mind the "Mutt", she's harmless.:eek:

[Troy Turner]

Steve - I now have a dedicated mortiser so I cut them, then make the tenons fit...somehow :)

When I was doing them all by hand, I still cut the mortises, then like you, used the TS and a sander to snug it up.

If your method works for you, then it's the right way :)

[Frank Drew]

I am going to go out on a limb here and guess back in the day...when you had to cut mortise and tenons with a hammer and chisel it took long enough to chisel one mortise let alone two. Then you still had to chisel the tenon.

In the days of exclusively hand tools, the tenon was usually cut with a handsaw -- two rip cuts for the cheeks and two crosscuts for the shoulders, then cleaned up with a hand plane or two.

Loose tenons are fine much of the time, but machine cutting mortises in the ends of long rails can be a challenge depending on your machinery (slot mortisers rule here); I'd never chop out end grain mortises by hand if I could help it.