I followed your advice!

[Mike Cruz]

Recently, I asked everyone about their opinions on lathes. I got a lot of good advice. I passed on what many told me might not be suitable for me. I searched and, low and behold, I found a posibility at an auction that was going to take place today (Saturday). I did some research on what I THOUGHT it might be (auctioneer couldn't tell me a whole lot except that it was a Powermatic and it was green. When I asked about its condition, he said there is some rust, but that is because it has been sitting outside for the last couple of weeks...:eek: Yep, it was sitting in the middle of a corn and hay field along with all the other stuff: Dozers, dump trucks, pickups, heavy equipment, wwing machines and other stuff. Yeah, left outside, no wonder it had rust...

Anyway, I really kept my expections to a minimum, knowing that it was outside and who knows what it was like before.

Dan Hintz was kind enough to meet me at my house this morning at 7am so we could make the almost 2 hour trip to the auction. The lathe was one of the last things that was going to be auctioned off, so we ran an errand I had had lunch, then went back to the corn field. There were some pretty nice pieces there besides the lathe. I'll start another thread on those...;) There was only one other guy bidding against me. Had he not shown, I probably would have had a steal! But instead, I paid a hefty sum. I mean, I had to. How often will a PM 45 come around. I dug deep in my pockets when my nod at $300 was not topped. :D She's 3 ph (so I'll be looking for a VFD for her), 1 HP, included 12" and 4" tool rests, 6" faceplate, and a reverse thread aluminum faceplate for the outboard, two wrenches, and a mouse nest on top of the motor.

Dan and I gave it a pretty good once, twice, and third time over in the field. A couple of onlookers mentioned that all these machines came from the county's Board of Education auction a month prior. They had sold there, but for some reason, were all back up for auction. Best I can figure, someone bought them, and that someone's wife said "Oh no you didn't!". A couple of people mentioned that all these things ran perfectly at the other auction. When we got it back to my shop, Dan and I took it apart (a bit) and everything seems good. Unfortunately, not only couldn't I test it out in the field, no 3 phase there...go figure, but I can't test it in my shop either...no 3 phase there either.

Thank you to all for your advice and steering me in what I hope to be the right direction. Thank you to others that have offered help with phase conversion and tips. And thank you Dan, a million times over, for going with me. He offered a lot of support, an extra set of eyes, and alternative perspectives that I hadn't thought of. Hey, the extra set of hand moving that monster around didn't hurt either. ;)

I have some sanding, wire brushing, priming, painting, and part ordering to do. But, I think she'll turn out to be pretty darn close to what I want.

[Michael James]

Looks like the find of a lifetime and not much "fixenup", hopefully. For $300 you should get a lifetime's use out of that badbay! Congratz!

[Don Alexander]

you are going to be SOOOOOOOOO glad you got this instead of that other one :D:D:D:D

[Kevin Lucas]

Definite Gloat! and a sweet find, Congrats )

[charlie knighton]

nice gloat, enjoy

[Curt Fuller]

Heck, it's worth that just for scrap iron. Should be a good lathe.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Mike,

That looks like a excellent buy. I'm sure with a little TLC it will serve you well.

[Steve Schlumpf]

Wow! Congrats on your new lathe! Should be a lot of fun getting her all cleaned up and ready to turn!

Looking forward to seeing photos of you first curlies off her!

Have fun!

[Mike Cruz]

Thanks guys. I made a mistake, though. I just looked and it is a PM 90 not a PM 45. Not sure what the difference really is, though...

[Curt Fuller]

Thanks guys. I made a mistake, though. I just looked and it is a PM 90 not a PM 45. Not sure what the difference really is, though...

I thought the pics looked like a 90 but I'm not that familiar to tell for sure. But the 90 is a heavier, more stout version. I'm not sure where I read this, probably OWWM.com but I think the 45 was a school version, the 90 is the lathe that was used in many commercial wood shops.

[Greg Ketell]

I just looked that up today. The early 45s were belt-change for speed change. The later ones were variable speed. The 90s were all variable speed. The 45 was 3/4HP, the 90 was 1HP.

You got a great deal on that! The ones I was looking at were 45s and one was missing the banjo (which makes them pretty much worthless) and the seller wanted $600 for the "cheap" one. Congrats on your find!!

GK



Thanks guys. I made a mistake, though. I just looked and it is a PM 90 not a PM 45. Not sure what the difference really is, though...

[John Keeton]

Mike, not only did you get a good buy, but you have nearly endless potential with this one. We demand to see pics of the full restore you are going to do on this!!:D

And, when you get that VFD on her, she will purrrrrrrr!!!

[Rob Mathis]

Wow nice score Mike!

[Bernie Weishapl]

Congrats on a great find Mike. With a VFD that thing will purr like a caddy.

[Thomas Bennett]

Congratulations Mike! I followed your previous posts concerning an upgrade of your Delta. This is the direction I was hoping you (and anyone wanting a bigger lathe) would go. Those PM 90 are great machines. Curt mentioned OWWM.com . Folks over there can steer you in the right direction for the VFD, etc.. I wouldn't paint it , yet, just clean it up and get it working properly. That is a fine machine. Now start looking for matching vintage PM machines, jointer, TS, Drill Press, disc/belt sander......

[Mike Cruz]

Thanks everyone. I thought you'd like the choice. ;)

Thomas, I have a local fellow Creeker that has already been extremely helpful with info about VFD's and has offered whatever help I need. I sure love this place. Don't know what I'd do without you...

I have been to OWWM.com already. Did a lot of research there before going to look at this lathe. Oh, and I have a 20 year old DJ-20...does that count as vintage yet?

I don't know if you could tell from the pics, but there is body rust with peeling paint that needs to be addressed. Also, there is rust on the ways and other parts. I kinda think it all needs attention asap, but agree that I should get it up and running with a VFD first to make sure that all the moving parts are working correctly. Then I'll tackle the paint.

As for a manual, I'm going to contact Powermatic Monday to see if they have a manual to send me, and also to find out as much of the history as I can about this particular machine through its serial number. If they don't have the manual, I've already been sent a link via PM for a manual. The serial number starts with 81, so I think it was built in 1981.

Other than the VFD, the only real mod I want to make to this machine to make it EXACTLY what I want is maybe a 2" riser on the head and tailstocks, if it is possible. Well, of course it is possible, but I mean, if there isn't any real reason not to...like danger!

[Roger Chandler]

Restoring that one will be a labor of love, but you have a great machine there, and you will be able to do much with it in upcoming weeks & years for that matter.

Great find Mike!

[Baxter Smith]

Great choice for the money. Hopefully the repairs will only be cosmetic. Good luck with it!

[Dan Hintz]

The body as a whole could stand a good sand-blasting or flap-wheeling to get rid of the loose paint/rust, but it's essentially superficial... some well-controlled rattle can paint will improve it's looks to like-new status without minimal trouble. Other than very light surface rust, the bed was in like-new condition... I couldn't see a single ding or gouge in it. Those students were pretty kind to the machine.

I suggested a Hitachi VFD for something in the $300 range, but I also tend to have expensive taste... and I'm easily enamored with blinking lights. It was a fine purchase, no doubt about it. If that other guy had not shown up and bid, this could have been had for $50... most of those machines started at a reasonable bid ($300 for this one), but always dropped like a rock at first, and this machine was no exception. Funny how the opening bid request was $300, dropped to $50 before someone nodded, then stopped at the initial request amount.

[Mike Spanbauer]

I owned a PM90, acquired by Auction before moving to my current lathe. They are fine machines. I rebuilt my entire unit - so I could likely give you some insights if you're looking for details.

My personal recommendation is to get a VFD from factorymation.com (the FM50 is perfect for your 1hp motor) and get the potentiometer too - total is about $150. Another $30 for a nice electrical box from HD and a bit of wire and you're up and running.

The lathe was the poster child for QUALITY reeves drives and is arguably one of the most stout lathes ever built in the 12" class. (you can do the compares and look into this more, but the guys over at OWWM have dug DEEP and the spindle is unmatched in a 12" lathe). This was why commercial shops chose this lathe over any other for 3 x 8hr shifts x 7 days a week and they ran for years and years and years. The headstock bearings are monsters, but easy to replace if you need to. Lynn @ accurate can help you there.

Congrats - certainly a gloatworthy price especially in that condition. A 45 for that price is okay, a 90 at that price is a steal!

$.50 /lb @ the 600lb dry weight :)

Mike

[Dan Hintz]

600lb dry weight :)
Well, that explains why we needed the tractor :p

[Rob Cunningham]

Congrats Mike, it looks like you got a good deal. The ways should clean up with some WD-40 and Scotch-Brite.

[Mike Cruz]

Thanks all, yet again for your nice comments.

Mike, that info sounds like good. I'll look into it. Also, I'm considering a riser blocks to give it 16" over the bed. I called PM today, and they actually had a company in Atlanta that made them for PM...that was basically the PM 91. Anyone have any info on how to score a set of these? I'm sure I could pay a bundle to have someone manufacture them for me. But, I sure wouldn't mind a factory set... Of course, I ought to ask if there is anyone fairly nearby that could make them...anyone, anyone, Beuler, Beuler...?

[Dan Hintz]

Mike,

If you can't get the actual risers, see if they'll give you the drawings... might make a good project for the Stinger :)

[Greg Ketell]

Since you are planning to get risers to increase the capacity and you are planning on getting a VFD it might be a good idea to get a VFD that can handle a bigger motor too. Then if/when you decide to upgrade the 1HP to a 1.5 or 2 you don't have to replace your VFD again.

Just a thought (that you probably already thought)

[Tony De Masi]

Nice catch there Mike. I'm glad you didn't have to wait too long to find something more stout than your Delta. Not sure you could have taken too long a wait:D

[Mike Cruz]

Ahhhh, Tony, you know me too well....

Greg, yeah, I'm going through that process right now. I've got to find a VFD phase converter that can handle up to a 2hp motor but won't break the bank. Honestly, I don't know if I'll ever do the lift, but would love to. But, yeah, if I'm planning on the lift, I should plan for the motor upgrade, too. I had thought about it already, but thanks for thinking I hadn't. Common sense doesn't occur as commonly as it should...

Dan, when I called the guy about the risers, he seemed, well, annoyed that he still gets these straggler calls for these risers, but not enough of them to make it worth his time to make them. I doubt another call from me would please him too much. Good idea, though... When I asked him if he had any pics of the risers, he said they all got discarded when they stopped making the risers.

Now, if I could just find someone willing to sell theirs... :rolleyes:

[Dan Hintz]

The FM50 from FactoryMation suggested by Mike looked like it was good for up to 3HP, and it was a mere $99. I think that fits your desired budget.

[Mike Cruz]

Which one did you look at? The fm50 I was looking at was is a 2 hp for $145...

[Dan Hintz]

Yeah, the pricing listed on their website is somewhat misleading... sorry about that. Still, those are decent prices for what you get.

[Mike Cruz]

No biggie. Jus thought there might have been another option. At $145, I don't think I could ask for lower...

BTW, an odd thing happened. Ususally, Grizzly stuff is a great option when you need "something". Since so many of these machines are made in the same factories, etc., you can often get Grizzly stuff and use them on other machines. BUT I called Grizzly yesterday to see what their VFD phase converter from their lathes would cost...over $600! So, on their $1295 lathe, about 1/2 of the price is in the VFD... I found that interesting.