Delta DJ-20 V belt..uhh...does that say $53?

[Peter Quinn]

I'm getting ready to put a byrd head on my DJ-20, and I figure now is a good time to change the drive belt just for good measure. So I'm trying to find the trade number or size of that belt on line, and in looking it up I find Delta wants $53 +shipping for that item. McMaster Carr seems able to provide a high quality goodyear belt for $6.52 in that particular size.


Just who the BLEEP BLEEPING BLEEP BLEEP BLAP do they think thy are kidding? OK, I get that Delta's price may be a bit higher as they are not in the "belt sales" business, but thats quite a mark up, no? If I marked up hardware to a customer 800% I could be arrested.

So, from the people that brought you the $3 quart of gear oil for $48 (but that's another story for another rant), its the "special Delta V belt" (whose trade number they seem to want to hide) for $53! I wonder if anybody has ever bought one of those?

[Pete Bradley]

The local Honda dealer's selling spark plugs for $56. Spend $6 plus shipping on the belt.

Pete

[Peter Quinn]

The local Honda dealer's selling spark plugs for $56. Spend $6 plus shipping on the belt.

Pete

I used to work at a motorcycle parts counter, this sort of thing doesn't surprise me, but is does still irritate me! We used to stock "ferring bolts" that cost $3 each from Yamaha, but had a box from Master Carr under the counter for $.05 each, same bolts, same grade. Go figure?

Yup, I ordered the master carr version, went for the cogged belt upgrade, grand total of $11! Even link belts are cheaper than delta belts.

[Ben Franz]

I have a DR field mower with a dual blade mowing deck that uses a long V-belt. Of course, the maintenance manuals caution us to replace the belt with a genuine DR belt that is specifically designed for the mower. They want over $60 + shipping. The EXACT belt, identical right down to the numbers is about $15 at the local supply house. I think maybe DR has tmoved the corporate offices to Nigeria.

[Glenn Vaughn]

My wife drives an Escalade. She had her purse on the console and started of one day. The purse slid off and broke the ashtray bracket on the back seat end of the console. It is part of the "end cap" of the console. Price to replace was $585.00 4 years ago - we passed.

I needed to replace a starter on a 1956 Jaguar XK-140 - Britih Motors wanted $180.00 for it - Turned out there was a Ford starter that was identical and cost less than $30.00 (this was in 1965).

I worked for a wrecking yard in the early 1960's. The owner would buy several brand new Cadillacs each year and part them out. He figured he tripled his money by selling the parts. It was painful dismantling those cars when they had less than 20 miles on them.

[Peter Quinn]

My wife drives an Escalase. She had her purse on the console and started of one day. The purse slid off and broke the ashtray bracket on the back seat end of the console. It is part of the "end cap" of the console. Price to replace was $585.00 4 years ago - we passed.

I needed to replace a starter on a 1956 Jaguar XK-140 - Britih Motors wanted $180.00 for it - Turned out there was a Ford starter that was identical and cost less than $30.00 (this was in 1965).

I worked for a wrecking yard in the early 1960's. The owner would buy several brand new Cadillacs each year and part them out. He figured he tripled his money by selling the parts. It was painful dismantling those cars when they had less than 20 miles on them.

That is the most interesting idea I have ever heard! Sell them new for parts! Perhaps I could buy brand new Grizzly jointers and sell them for parts to delta owners? Could make a killing until people figure out they can just buy grizzly tools themselves and cut out both delta and the middle man. Oh wait, people seem to have figured that out in droves already!:cool:

[glenn bradley]

Any proper sized belt will do. I put a link-belt on my G0490X (clone of the DJ-20 to a large degree). Much quieter if that matters but the price will sneak back up on you.

[Mike Cruz]

Welcome to the wonderful world of Delta... Parts are WAY overpriced. But it sounds like I'm preachin' to the choir.

[Gene Howe]

I have a DR field mower with a dual blade mowing deck that uses a long V-belt. Of course, the maintenance manuals caution us to replace the belt with a genuine DR belt that is specifically designed for the mower. They want over $60 + shipping. The EXACT belt, identical right down to the numbers is about $15 at the local supply house. I think maybe DR has tmoved the corporate offices to Nigeria.

Thanks, Ben. I just bought a DR 44" tow behind. That info will be useful, down the road.
Nice Mower, BTW.

[Anthony Whitesell]

I was recently quoted some repair prices from a Nissan dealer for my car. Now keep in mind that the sign in the office says $79 per hour labor rate.

Crankshaft sensor replacement $200
Rear brakes rotors and pads $404 total
Front brakes rotors and pads $397 total

Now I replaced the crankshaft sensor, took 1 hour and cost $38 (and that included figuring out where the flipping thing was and how to get to it)
Rear brakes: 1 1/2 hours, $90
Front brakes: 1 1/2 hours also, $100

And I get the middle of the line stuff, not the cheapest but not the most expensive.


Now, If you do the math subtracting the parts cost from their price and divide by the time
Crankshaft sensor replacement (200-38)/1= $162/hour
Rear brakes rotors and pads (404-90)/1.5=$209/hr
Front brakes rotors and pads $397 total=$198/hr

And this is a weekend warrior doing the job in his driveway. Not a professional that works on the same type of vehicle in a garage at a comfortable height with all the tools at the ready. Factoring that in, it should take them less time to do the job than I increasing their profit. This is why my wife doesn't mind the extra clean-up in the bathroom sink after I get finished working of the cars. (clean the sink or pay $200/hour not to)

But now if someone would like to pay me $200/hr to work on their car...

[Philip Johnson]

Well next time your on a commercial flight sitting on the cheap plastic toilet seat look in the mirror and smile because your sitting on a 2000 dollar seat. Thats just for the seat.

Phil

[John Pratt]

Wow, the negative stuff about Delta is flowing. I gotta tell ya, I think I am one of the lucky ones. I have several Delta tools new and old and I have had nothing but great service from them. I had a couple tools that weren't performing exactly as I thought they should and the Dewalt/Delta/PC service center in OKC fixed them right away at no charge. The only tool I have that didn't last as long as I think it should have is my PC 18 ga nailer. It tends to easily jam. But my DJ20, New Unisaw, and 10 other Delta shop floor tools work great. Maybe I am just lucky.

[Mike Cruz]

John, I had acquired a Delta 6" jointer. It was about 5 years old (IIRC) but had never been put together. The only thing(s) missing were all the bolts, nuts, etc to put it together...the bags had gotten lost in the years that the original owner had it set aside. I called Delta to get the bags of parts. Not only did they not have "bags of parts", but they couldn't get them for me unless I knew the exact parts numbers and quanitities of said parts for EVERY screw, bolt, nut, etc. Once I figured out what I needed, I called them back. A couple "parts" into it, as I realized I was being charged $3-5 per bolt, I decided to go to the local ACE...where I got EVERYTHING I needed for about $25.

When I needed new bearings for my DJ-20 (when I was replacing the cutterhead with a Byrd) I got quoted something around $40-50 for EACH bearing. Ended up getting them at Grizzly for a couple bucks each. Are they the same quality? Not sure. No guaranty that the ones from Delta are any better. They MIGHT be, but no guaranty. And from their history of overpricing replacement parts, I second guessed whether or not it was worth it. That was enough to make my business stray from them.

When I got an old Delta Lathe, I wanted some parts for that, too. The tool rests and things were so out there, that again, I went elsewhere to find what I needed.

For me, my answer to the OP came from my experiences. Your milage may vary...;)

[John Pratt]

John, I had acquired a Delta 6" jointer. It was about 5 years old (IIRC) but had never been put together. The only thing(s) missing were all the bolts, nuts, etc to put it together...the bags had gotten lost in the years that the original owner had it set aside. I called Delta to get the bags of parts. Not only did they not have "bags of parts", but they couldn't get them for me unless I knew the exact parts numbers and quanitities of said parts for EVERY screw, bolt, nut, etc. Once I figured out what I needed, I called them back. A couple "parts" into it, as I realized I was being charged $3-5 per bolt, I decided to go to the local ACE...where I got EVERYTHING I needed for about $25.

When I needed new bearings for my DJ-20 (when I was replacing the cutterhead with a Byrd) I got quoted something around $40-50 for EACH bearing. Ended up getting them at Grizzly for a couple bucks each. Are they the same quality? Not sure. No guaranty that the ones from Delta are any better. They MIGHT be, but no guaranty. And from their history of overpricing replacement parts, I second guessed whether or not it was worth it. That was enough to make my business stray from them.

When I got an old Delta Lathe, I wanted some parts for that, too. The tool rests and things were so out there, that again, I went elsewhere to find what I needed.

For me, my answer to the OP came from my experiences. Your milage may vary...;)


Well said, experiences vary.

Could some of it have to do with the repair/service centers called. I know there are several in my area but I have always had really good luck with the one I go to. Maybe it is like your local woodcraft. Each one gives a different experience related to the individual owner.

[Mike Cruz]

Um, I've been calling Delta directly...:o:rolleyes:

[Peter Quinn]

Wow, the negative stuff about Delta is flowing. I gotta tell ya, I think I am one of the lucky ones. I have several Delta tools new and old and I have had nothing but great service from them. I had a couple tools that weren't performing exactly as I thought they should and the Dewalt/Delta/PC service center in OKC fixed them right away at no charge. The only tool I have that didn't last as long as I think it should have is my PC 18 ga nailer. It tends to easily jam. But my DJ20, New Unisaw, and 10 other Delta shop floor tools work great. Maybe I am just lucky.

I'm no big fan of Delta CS. My shaper was built to last a life time, was built in the early 90's, and is no longer supported, so I can no longer get the overpriced nuts and bolts I may need anyway. My local service net outlet is friendly but useless in this regard, and the people at the number I called were neither useful nor friendly. But experiences may vary.

However, what I am talking about here is parts. All machines need parts eventually. I need a drive belt for my DJ-20, those crooks want $53 for the stupid thing? That is less than a $10 item from ANY reputable source for top quality goods from gates or goodyear. Do you really think delta makes its own special v belts? And when I needed gear box oil for my DC-380, I called delta, the machine takes a quart but they sell "delta special gear box oil" in pints that can only be ordered, not purchased locally, and with shipping it was quoted at $48 for two pints! Luckily the powermatic 15" planer manual, which uses the same Taiwanese gear box, is decent enough to simply suggest "Use any quality 85W hypoid gear oil", which costs just over $3 per quart at my local NAPA auto parts store.

So between the Delta "special belts" (they do not put a trade size on them, only a delta part number, though they are made to industry standard sizes), and the "Delta Special gear oil" (they would NOT tell me the suggested weight to use, only to use theirs), and the suggestion by a delta rep that I scrap my shaper and buy a current model, I feel I am being sthupped by the good folks at Delta, or Black and Decker, or Stanley, or whoever the heck is actually in charge over there now. I like my delta machines, but I wont be getting any more, mostly because my shop is equipped as I like it for now, but also because I don't like the way they do business.

Anybody wants to get planer gear oil for $48, just send me a check, and i'll go buy it for you at NAPA, and we can split the change!

[Mike Cruz]

Glenn, this is for you. I would PM it to you, but I don't think you can PM pics...

I know it has nothing to do with your signature (your's being a MP reference), but it is a Loon nontheless... :D

[Brian Penning]

Glenn, this is for you. I would PM it to you, but I don't think you can PM pics...

I know it has nothing to do with your signature (your's being a MP reference), but it is a Loon nontheless... :D


Nah..he needs this...;)

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/archive/9/99/20080602171503%21Loonie_reverse_view.png

[Peter Quinn]

Well, I like to dislike those folks over at Delta as much as the next guy, maybe a bit more than the next guy actually, but I need to set the record straight on one account. It seems that on service net they now list the drive belt sizes for the machines, and on the DC-380 planer page they specify 85W120 gear oil! That was not the case two or three years ago, but when I started looking this evening just to make sure I wasn't stirring up old trash, it seems they have changed for the better on this account. They are still asking $48+ shipping for a quart of oil and a $53 for a $6 belt, but at least they are posting the necessary info so you can quickly and confidently source these types of frequent replacement items from a cheaper source. Thanks for that Delta.

[Bruce Wrenn]

Look at Delta for bearings for either a Uni, or contractor's saw. They both use 6203-2RS bearings, made in China. Delta wants about $16 each, but I only pay about $2 each in quantities of ten. Same applies to bearings on PM equipment. Look for bearings for a Jaguar XKE center section from dealer. Corvete uses same bearings, but at a heck of a lot cheaper price. Even cheaper at bearing supply houses. A friend once owned a Woodmiser. He was constanly ordering replacement bearings from Woodmiser. By chance he stopped at bearing supply house with old bearing one day, and told counter guy he wanted an exact replacement. Counter man looked at him and asked "Why?" Those bearings will fail in that application in a matter of days. It seams that OEM bearings weren't sealed. Look on most 14" band saws, and the guide bearings are only shielded, instead of sealed.

[Larry Edgerton]

Any proper sized belt will do. I put a link-belt on my G0490X (clone of the DJ-20 to a large degree). Much quieter if that matters but the price will sneak back up on you.

This is not exactly true. Any belt will make the machine work, but I have found that automotive belts have a hump in them that you will notice as a vibration on a machine. I use link belts as well when possible.

I am just ordering a set of belts for my SCMI slide saw this morning, hate to see what they will cost me. There is no options, I need Optibelt SK 3V250's, and I will just have to pay the price.......

[Darrell Bade]

This thread reminds me of the time I had to change a windsheild washer pump in my Chevy and it was like $10 at the Chevy dealer. Had to change one in my moms Cadilac a few months later and the Caddy dealer wanted more like $20. Since I had just changed one I knew it was the same part so the Caddy got the Chevy pump. More of a markup for the same item because it was for a Caddy.

[Larry Fox]

In addition to my Unisaw I also acquired a Rockwell RT-30. Problem is that it didn't have a motor. Delta quoted me $1,400 USD for the 3-hp motor. Needless to say I passed. They are outrageous.

As to your original post, I replaced the belt on my DJ-20 with a link belt and it worked great.

[Larry Edgerton]

Peter

Try this place.......www.emotorstore.com/ (http://www.emotorstore.com/)

I was pleasantly surprised that the belts for my MiniMax slider were only $10.67 apeice. I expected to get greased as they are an odd size/manufacturer.

Larry

[Mike Gabby]

I had a Nutone dealership before I retired.

One day a customer came to the counter to buy a replacement blender attachment for his Nutone food center.

When I quoted the price, he started griping about it. Noticing the patch over his shirt pocket that named a concrete delivery company, I casually replied, "Yeah, I know what you mean, I recently poured a small pad for my new patio and they had the nerve to charge me $95.00 a yard for the concrete, can you believe that?" He shut up, paid the price, and went on his way.

What goes around comes around.

[Peter Quinn]

I had a Nutone dealership before I retired.

One day a customer came to the counter to buy a replacement blender attachment for his Nutone food center.

When I quoted the price, he started griping about it. Noticing the patch over his shirt pocket that named a concrete delivery company, I casually replied, "Yeah, I know what you mean, I recently poured a small pad for my new patio and they had the nerve to charge me $95.00 a yard for the concrete, can you believe that?" He shut up, paid the price, and went on his way.

What goes around comes around.

That sounds great Mike, I like that. The usual price around here for custom cabinetry is around $240/LF and up depending on options. So if I ever get a chance to make cabinets for a delta rep, I'll remember to charge them the complimentary 800% markup, or about $2000 per LF! There's idiots complaining about a fair price for the goods, I get that all the time, and then there's corporations trying to bend the consumer over the barrel with harsh tactics. Delta would charge you $760/yrd for that same slab! Luckily there are lots of places to buy concrete, but only one place to buy "Delta special gear oil"! I wonder if that gear oil would make a good form release?

[Chip Lindley]

As the OP has just learned, it is ridiculous to source Delta for things like bearings, belts, and bolts. Save the querys for parts specific to one of their machines.

But, since older machines are no longer supported, Heaven help anyone who needs a metal casting or machined part. It's not just Delta; Powermatic has taken the same non-approach.

That is where CL, ebay, and OWWM come in handy to find spare parts or even old beater machines that can be cannibalized.

Just perhaps the older machines were so well-made that the only way to get them out of circulation was to make repairs impossible. The newer Chinese junk will cause a turn-over with new sales on a more regular basis. Hmmm...

[Kevin Womer]

Make a you wonder if they don't overprice replacement parts on purpose in hopes that people will actually just realize it would be cheaper to buy a new tool? I know a lot of people who think that way.

[Curt Harms]

Well next time your on a commercial flight sitting on the cheap plastic toilet seat look in the mirror and smile because your sitting on a 2000 dollar seat. Thats just for the seat.

Phil

But try to buy a non-approved part (from the same supplier) and the FAA will be on you like flies on stink.