Combination drill & countersink tools - good?

[ian maybury]

Hi guys, I've been eyeing up this set http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=10605&Max=999 but am cautious as a result of previous bad experience with combination drill/countersinks that even from new cut badly - I've always used a separate carbide toolmakers countersink and drill.

Are these likely to work well? Will the countersink cut cleanly without leaving 'whiskers', are the drills replaceable, can they be sharpened, do they keep an edge etc????

Thanks

[David Nelson1]

Looks ok to me, and for 39 bucks ya can't get hurt too bad. All the reviews are positive as well.

[pat warner]

In my view, all of these countersink/counterbore combos, albeit cheap, are compromises.
Often no brad points, always clogging, frequently burn stock, & with depth and diameter problems. Good clean cuts required? Then get separate tools.
Expensive 4 fluted CB (http://patwarner.com/images/drilling1.jpg) shown is near perfect, never clogs and has interchangeable pilots for most holes < its diameter; there are cheaper alternatives. Should you get? Only if fasteners and excellence in boring are paramount and ordinary for you.

[Myk Rian]

I use similar drills and CSs. Work ok for me, although I'm not a professional that spends top dollar. So what if they clog a little. They clean out easily.

The hinge pilot drills are similar to mine, and I have a set of Peachtree counter sink drills.

[Charles Wiggins]

Ian,

I have that set and have used it infrequently over the last three years or so, mostly on home improvement projects rather than fine woodworking, but over the haul the set has been a good performer. I have not used it on a lot of hardwood, but for what I have done it performed well. My latest endeavors involving them were hanging OSB in my shop and making some repairs to my parents' deck. In both cases being able to go straight from the pilot hole to the driver without un-chucking and re-chucking was a HUGE time saver.

The self-centering bits are fantastic when you are mounting hinges or other such hardware.

I know you can replace the bits. I have replaced the bit in the #6 self-centering setup. They are just held in place with Allen head set screws. Even the countersinks can be adjusted with set screws. I am not sure about where to buy the tapered drill bits but I haven't had to worry with that as yet, and I don't know what would be involved in sharpening them. I would think you could sharpen the countersinks with a slip stone, but I haven't had to do that either.

And, I don't recall paying that much for the set. i will say that it is MUCH BETTER QUALITY than the Makita set it replaced.

All that said, I don't know that I would rely on this set for high quality woodworking on an ongoing basis. If I wanted consistent tapers that I didn't have to clean up I would use a separate, high-quality countersink just because it would be easier to sharpen or replace when the time came.

However, if you are looking for decent quality and a lot of versatility this set is a great way to go.

My 2 cents,

Charles

[Jim Heffner]

Ian, I don't have that set from Rockler...but for what you get for the money,
I would think that they should be ok. Charles said something about the drill
bits #6 and others in the set, when I need to replace mine, I just buy them from Lowe's. KobaltTools has any of those sizes you need in small packages for a few bucks,they should be exactly what you need.

[ian maybury]

Ta guys. I really struggle with so-so quality tools. Based on the cautious tone of your replies I did a bit more digging. It sounds like the likes of this stuff by Amana might be the sort of place to head for for good quality stuff - in countersinking tools anyway: http://www.amanatool.com/boring-countersink.html

ian

[Dave Gaul]

I almost got that insty drive set from Rockler, but I wasn't interested in tapered bits. I got the set from Snappy, and I am very happy with it. For countersinks that have to be perfect though, I use stand-alone counter sinks on the drill press...

[David Nelson1]

I almost got that insty drive set from Rockler, but I wasn't interested in tapered bits. I got the set from Snappy, and I am very happy with it. For countersinks that have to be perfect though, I use stand-alone counter sinks on the drill press...

+1 on that

[Lee Schierer]

Most of these one piece countersink and drill setups don't accomplish the correct hole sizing for wood screws. Unless the drill provides a stepped hole it really isn't letting the screw do its job, which is to pull the pieces together. In the piece that will have the head of the screw there should be a clearance hole all the way through the piece so that the screw head can pull the piece tight to the piece underneath. Other wise the threads of the screw will push out wood between the pieces actually separating the joint slightly.

[John Coloccia]

In my view, all of these countersink/counterbore combos, albeit cheap, are compromises.
Often no brad points, always clogging, frequently burn stock, & with depth and diameter problems. Good clean cuts required? Then get separate tools.
Expensive 4 fluted CB (http://patwarner.com/images/drilling1.jpg) shown is near perfect, never clogs and has interchangeable pilots for most holes < its diameter; there are cheaper alternatives. Should you get? Only if fasteners and excellence in boring are paramount and ordinary for you.

For what it's worth, that's a counter-bore, not a counter sink. The counter-bore will leave a larger, flat bottom hole coaxial with the smaller hole. The countersink leaves a conical hole for a conical screw head.

[pat warner]

CB = counterbore

[Gene Waara]

+2 for the Snappy. Bought them at a ww show about a year ago and they cut clean. After "snapping" a few bits of in some hardwood I replaced them with titanium bits. No further problems as yet.

[Mike Cruz]

I actually love the Dewalt tapered bits with countersink.

[John Coloccia]

CB = counterbore

Sorry, Pat. I didn't mean YOU didn't know what it was. I meant it for the other 90% that look at me funny when I say I'm looking for a counterbore :)

[Neil Brooks]

+3 on the Snappy set.

I'm a big believer ... that there is a small place in this world ... for cheap tools.

I've gotten good mileage out of them, and they've met my fairly high standard (that is: I haven't sworn at them yet).

Now ... WHO got me looking at the Amana bits ???? :p

[Brandon Weiss]

I almost got that insty drive set from Rockler, but I wasn't interested in tapered bits. I got the set from Snappy, and I am very happy with it. For countersinks that have to be perfect though, I use stand-alone counter sinks on the drill press...

+1 again on that. Remember that tapered drill bits are for screws whose shank above the threads is the same diameter as the thread major diameter. For most screws used nowadays, straight bits are the way to go, in my opinion. If it has to be a perfect countersink, use the dedicated c/s as many have mentioned. 90% of the time when I use a drill/countersink combination it is the Kobalt combos from Lowes. They are cheap and do a more than decent job until the dull. At which point the replacement is cheap. I bought the Rockler set you are looking at. It's a great set. Used one of the bits to make a deck with. The end of the drill bit is still in the deck.... My fault though, not the set's fault. The self-centering bits are an excellent thing to have around.

One other thing to consider. Of all the countersink/drill sets I've purchased I mainly use the #8. Make sure that if you buy the variety set you'll actually use all the bits. Otherwise jut buy the bits you actually need. Might save you some bucks.

Last note: I've heard the jackrabbit is an excellent system. Haven't pulled the trigger yet, but one of these days I will.