General 50-220C Table Saw

[Dave Sharbaugh]

I've been looking at the General 50-220C table saw as a more "garage-and-wallet-friendly" version of a cabint saw. Does anyone have any experience with this saw?

Just found the group today and became a member.

Thanks!

Dave

[Tyler Howell]

Welcome Dave. Glad to have you in the creek. We have some General fans here so hold on a minute, somebodies got an answer.

[Dave Sharbaugh]

Thanks, Tyler, it's good to be "in the creek." Guess I'm looking for that proverbial paddle!

The Jet and DeWalt hybrids didn't seem quite right. I stumbled onto the General saw which seems to fit my needs and budget.

Dave

[Dan Stuewe]

Welcome aboard!

Maybe this is what is sparking your question, but if you haven't yet seen it, the February issue of Workbench mag (got mine yesterday) did a review of "hybrids" which, I think, includes the General that you are asking about (I don't remember the exact model number). Anyway, their bottom line was that they really liked the new Craftsman (top of the line one, I think) and the General (with the Bies. fence option, +$100). Anyway, if you haven't seen it yet it is pretty good as far as magazine reviews go. It is giving me something to think about too.

Good luck, and keep us posted.

[John Miliunas]

Dave, afraid I'm not familiar with the particular General you're looking at but, I am a bit familiar with SMC and would like to jump in with another "Welcome aboard!".:D To echo what TJ said, we have a number of General fans out here and I'm sure someone will jump in and offer his/her opinion and/or guidance. In the meantime, search around the Creek a bit and I'm sure you'll come up with a LOT of discussion regarding the selection of table saws...and miter saws, band saws, routers, planes, jointers, planers, chisels, glue, wood, drill press and on and on and on...!:D Come often, stay long and, as always, any "gloats" or projects *require* pictures!:) :cool:

[Dave Sharbaugh]

Welcome aboard!

Maybe this is what is sparking your question, but if you haven't yet seen it, the February issue of Workbench mag (got mine yesterday) did a review of "hybrids" which, I think, includes the General that you are asking about (I don't remember the exact model number). Anyway, their bottom line was that they really liked the new Craftsman (top of the line one, I think) and the General (with the Bies. fence option, +$100). Anyway, if you haven't seen it yet it is pretty good as far as magazine reviews go. It is giving me something to think about too.

Good luck, and keep us posted.
Thanks for the reply Dan. I live in Irvine and like to hear from the neighbors!

I've seen pictures of the Crafstman, and it looks nice, but they have a way to go to rebuild that name. Will look for that issue of Workbench. General was less than $900 with the Biesemeyer.

Dave

[Jim Barrett]

Hey Dave welcome to SMC...I am a General fan, (have a 350 cabinet saw on the way with other General equip as well), but am not familiar with the model you are looking at. General table saws typically get pretty high marks in the magazines and forums. The one thing I found is the General (Canada) equipment does not get too much press in the mags, where the General Intl (Asian) tools get more press. As stated by Dan there is a review of this saw in the latest Workbench magazine, take a look. Let us know what you decide :)

Jim

[Dave Sharbaugh]

Meant to include this in the original post: What about 50" vs. 30" rails? Space is at a premium (garage shop), but with a mobile base I ought to be able to stash it against the wall. How much of a compromise is it to split large panels before coming to the saw with them?

Dave

[Bart Leetch]

Dave

You can use a circular saw to rip or cross cut plywood close to size & then usa a shop built panel sled to square it up on the table-saw.

[Bob Johnson2]

I was planning on taking a ride next week (after the holiday) to compare the 220 to the 260, neither of which I've seen as yet. If you want I can drop you a note then and let you know how they look, not that I'll have any experience on them.

[Frank Pellow]

Welcome to Saw Mill Creek Dave!

This appears to be a new model, so there might not be any folks here who have one. You can be the Guinea Pig :D

Here is a link to the (sparse) entry for the saw on the General web site: http://www.general.ca/product/inter/50220an.html

[Dave Sharbaugh]

I was planning on taking a ride next week (after the holiday) to compare the 220 to the 260, neither of which I've seen as yet. If you want I can drop you a note then and let you know how they look, not that I'll have any experience on them.
Sure! Let me know what you think.

Dave

[Dave Sharbaugh]

Welcome to Saw Mill Creek Dave!

This appears to be a new model, so there might not be any folks here who have one. You can be the Guinea Pig :D

Here is a link to the (sparse) entry for the sdaw on the General web site: http://www.general.ca/product/inter/50220an.html
Frank,

Yes, it is a new model. They've been at some of the shows, but I am waiting for a delivery late this month or early next month to see one here in So. Californina. Although I must admit, a trip to Canada sounds great. Would love to see Toronto.

Dave

[scott spencer]

Hi Dave and welcome! I don't bleed green, but I have alot of respect for General's machines and many of GI's. My experience with GI has been great with their contractor saw. I haven't seen a 50-220 in person....it appears to be alot like their earlier hybrid the 50-200 (Jet had a nearly identical one a few years back). The 50-200 was a little steep for me, but I got a good look at it a couple of years ago....nicely made. I'm not sure what the differences are between the 200 and the 220. I'm pretty sure it's got the oversized contractor style trunnions mounted from the table, and I know it comes in three versions...one with an aluminum dual locking fence (50-220 M1) , one with the General made Biese (50-220C M1), and then one with a 50" Biese (50-220C LM1). I'm both surprised and disappointed that they'd even put that lesser fence on one of their saws....diluting the family lineage and all! (LOL) The one in the review had that funky fence...

I agree with you about the DW and Jet....my complaints with them were the fences at the price point, but the 50-220C M1 offers what IMO is a better alternative. I do like the looks of the new Sears 22124, but it is hard to overlook that tarnished image. Good luck with your decision.

[Dave Sharbaugh]

Hi Dave and welcome! I don't bleed green, but I have alot of respect for General's machines and many of GI's. My experience with GI has been great with their contractor saw. I haven't seen a 50-220 in person....it appears to be alot like their earlier hybrid the 50-200 (Jet had a nearly identical one a few years back). The 50-200 was a little steep for me, but I got a good look at it a couple of years ago....nicely made. I'm not sure what the differences are between the 200 and the 220. I'm pretty sure it's got the oversized contractor style trunnions mounted from the table, and I know it comes in three versions...one with an aluminum dual locking fence (50-220 M1) , one with the General made Biese (50-220C M1), and then one with a 50" Biese (50-220C LM1). I'm both surprised and disappointed that they'd even put that lesser fence on one of their saws....diluting the family lineage and all! (LOL) The one in the review had that funky fence...

I agree with you about the DW and Jet....my complaints with them were the fences at the price point, but the 50-220C M1 offers what IMO is a better alternative. I do like the looks of the new Sears 22124, but it is hard to overlook that tarnished image. Good luck with your decision.
As Frank Pellow said, I'll be the Guinea pig on this one. I put my money down, but while I'm waiting, I'm trying to decide if the 50" Bies. makes sense for a garage shop.

Dave

[Joe Mioux]

HI Dave: Welcome to SMC



As Frank Pellow said, I'll be the Guinea pig on this one. I put my money down, but while I'm waiting, I'm trying to decide if the 50" Bies. makes sense for a garage shop.

Dave
I have 50" rails on my saw and I am really glad I went this route. I have the saw on mobile base in the garage and it is not a problem to manuever the saw around. You may not need to saw 45", or 46" or longer pieces of wood very often, but you will (if you go with 50" rails) set the fence at 33" or 34" or 36" (you get the idea) a lot and that is where the 50" rails are valuable.

Joe

[Dave Sharbaugh]

HI Dave: Welcome to SMC



I have 50" rails on my saw and I am really glad I went this route. I have the saw on mobile base in the garage and it is not a problem to manuever the saw around. You may not need to saw 45", or 46" or longer pieces of wood very often, but you will (if you go with 50" rails) set the fence at 33" or 34" or 36" (you get the idea) a lot and that is where the 50" rails are valuable.

Joe
Joe,

That's what I needed to hear. Thanks for the input! Of course, garages may be bigger in Illinois...

Dave

[Dan Stuewe]

Dave,

In Irvine, are you even allowed to do woodworking in your garage? Can you leave your garage door open for more than 15 minutes? ;)

As for the longer rails...I think it is really personal. For me, right now, I don't see myself making a bunch of large objects (entertainment center, kitchen cabinets, etc.) so the shorter rails will probably be what I get (some day).

[Dave Sharbaugh]

Dave,

In Irvine, are you even allowed to do woodworking in your garage? Can you leave your garage door open for more than 15 minutes? ;)

As for the longer rails...I think it is really personal. For me, right now, I don't see myself making a bunch of large objects (entertainment center, kitchen cabinets, etc.) so the shorter rails will probably be what I get (some day).
Ouch, Dan, you cut to the quick! I I file the proper form, I can do woodworking M-W-F between 10a.m. and noon ;)

I'm ordering the longer rails. Here's why: they can be cut down later if they prove to be longer than needed, and they are about a hundred bucks cheaper if you get them with the saw.

Gotta go close my garage door...

Dave

PS We send our son to the Waldorf School there in Costa Mesa.

[scott spencer]

I'm ordering the longer rails. Here's why: they can be cut down later if they prove to be longer than needed...

Good move on the long rails Dave....before you go to the more drastic step of cutting them down, you might try shifting them to the left so they don't hang quite as far to the right.

Enjoy!

[John Miliunas]

Dave, glad to see you've made your purchasing decision! Of all the things I've heard of General, it's a good company with good products. Congrats!:)

As to the rails; I'll echo what Joe M. said. No, not too often I run the fence out to the max (though I *have* done exactly that a time or two!), but it's the stuff which 31"+ is needed for, that you'd be missing it!:( That, plus if you cut them down, it'd be bloody hard to add them back in! You're going to be wheeling whatever you buy back and forth from the wall into an open area, so the major space concern is when the unit is "at rest". Why not do like a lot of other guys around here have done and utilize some/all of that 20" extra space under the table for storage? If you use the right side for a router table, you would literally have enough room for a full-fledged router cabinet and could also store all your related router schtuff in it!:) :cool:

[Dave Sharbaugh]

Exactly my thinking, John. Where this is headed, it'll slip right over my compressor (I think). In any case, the router table's a good idea, and I've got no shortage of things to "hide" under that space!

Dave


Dave, glad to see you've made your purchasing decision! Of all the things I've heard of General, it's a good company with good products. Congrats!:)

As to the rails; I'll echo what Joe M. said. No, not too often I run the fence out to the max (though I *have* done exactly that a time or two!), but it's the stuff which 31"+ is needed for, that you'd be missing it!:( That, plus if you cut them down, it'd be bloody hard to add them back in! You're going to be wheeling whatever you buy back and forth from the wall into an open area, so the major space concern is when the unit is "at rest". Why not do like a lot of other guys around here have done and utilize some/all of that 20" extra space under the table for storage? If you use the right side for a router table, you would literally have enough room for a full-fledged router cabinet and could also store all your related router schtuff in it!:) :cool:

[Dick Tysen]

Dave
I have the general 50-200 it has a 2hp motor and 50 in rails.I can not compare to any other machine this is the only one I have used.It was easy to put together and very accurate.I have cut 8/4 white oak with no problems.I have the 50 in rails and in two years I have not need the length yet.The fence is fine but the rail support bracket for the legs are awful.I have a moble base and it is great if you need to move it because of lack of space.I have enjoyed this machine and I wish you luck with yours.
Dick Tysen

[Norman Hitt]

If you can possibly fit it in your garage/shop, get the 50" fence, as it just makes so many things much simpler. I've seen many who said they wished they had gotten the longer fence, but only one that cut his down, (due to space after he moved).

Good Luck, and welcome to The Creek.

[Dave Sharbaugh]

Well, after a LOT of soul-searching, budget analysis, forgiveness from my wife, and consultation with my Canadian friends, I bit the bullet and went for the 650-T50. Just had to have that flag on the front...

Should arrive tomorrow. Next job is where to put it. Garage is going to undergo a major transformation over the next few months.

When it came down to it, I've never regretted spending too much on a tool but I have regretted spending too little.

Dave

[scott spencer]

I swear after reading your post, I'm greener than that saw! Congrats on buying yourself MY dreamsaw!

Enjoy and be safe!

[Mark Singer]

Dave,

Welcome! We are practicaly neighbors! I love the Beismier fence...I have it on my Powermatic 66 and it is really accurate and predictable.

[skip gleichman]

I do have the General 50-220, with the 50" rails. I love it and have been very happy with the quality of the materials and the performance. I have ripped a lot of 8/4 maple, walnut and cherry so far and the is not even a hesitation. The saw is also quiet with a very cool industrial sound to it.

The dust collection works good and the fence is great. It is rock-solid, easy to adjust (once) and is accurate. This saw has not only made me more confident, it is always calling my name to "cut something".

I made a router table with the extended fence rails and installed a Jessum FX lift which has yet to be used very much. I did flush-trim the ends of a 72"x24" bartop with it though using a flush-trim bit and a strait-edge... that was cool.

Recommended.

[Dave Sharbaugh]

Mark,

I think we're also neighbors in profession.

I believe you are an architect? I'm an industrial designer. I know all industrial designers are frustrated architects (well, at least this one is), are all architects frustrated industrial designers?

At least folks understand what architects do. I am usually reduced to describing what I do by relating it to architecture: "I do to products what architects do to buildings."

My prior "big-saw" experience was with a Powermatic in the model shop of a design firm. Had to love that saw. Had I not had that experience, I would have had an easier time resisting the upgrade on my purchase.

Saw arrived last evening from Eagle Tools. Am waiting for my 9 year old son to arrive home to put the rails on and wire her up.

Dave

[Bart Leetch]

"Saw arrived last evening from Eagle Tools. Am waiting for my 9 year old son to arrive home to put the rails on and wire her up."

Your 9 year old son must be very smart & strong.

Ya I know I just couldn't resist. :D

[Frank Pellow]

Well, after a LOT of soul-searching, budget analysis, forgiveness from my wife, and consultation with my Canadian friends, I bit the bullet and went for the 650-T50. Just had to have that flag on the front...

Should arrive tomorrow. Next job is where to put it. Garage is going to undergo a major transformation over the next few months.

When it came down to it, I've never regretted spending too much on a tool but I have regretted spending too little.

Dave
Good decision!

[Dave Sharbaugh]

"Saw arrived last evening from Eagle Tools. Am waiting for my 9 year old son to arrive home to put the rails on and wire her up."

Your 9 year old son must be very smart & strong.

Ya I know I just couldn't resist. :D
And I'm glad you didn't, I deserved that one!

Dave

[Dave Sharbaugh]

Frank,

Knew you'd enjoy this view of new saw.

Dave

PS Thanks for "picking nits."

[Dave Sharbaugh]

For those that find the pictures of the Canadian flag weren't "satisying," here are a couple more telling shots.

Dave

[Allen Bookout]

I just signed up on this forum as I am also interested in finding out about the GI 50-220 and have not found out a whole lot from users. Just for your information I have found one user that has posted his own experience with this machine including pictures at the woodworking.com forum. Here is what he had to say:

Hey Guys & Gals:I finally did it, I broke down and purchased the General 50-220 left tilting tablesaw from Tools Plus.
Purchase Price:$850
Delivery: I picked it up myself in my truck. Weight approx 300+ in 3 boxes(Body and table, Fence, Accessories)

Why I decided and the competition: It was a very close race between this saw and the Grizzly Left tilt Cabinet for around the same price.
Why I decided for this saw was local support, the size of the table and fence. (I can rip up to 43" No Problem!) Lastly 110 motor that can be upgraded to 220. Plus 2hp gives me plenty of power.

Design: Cabinet style hybrid saw. Trunions are on the table. Great enclosed cabinet that has fantastic dust collection!

First Impressions: WOW! Table is immense and with the two wings installed it can handle anything! Great splitter/blade cover that doesn't protrude off the back but was a fuss to set up. Its more of a riving knife than a splitter. Table and set up was beautiful. Almost dead on out of the box! Table top quality is first rate and the heft of the cabinet is top notch.

What was not impressive: No dado insert, no blade what so ever, the fence (their bies copy) all of the holes did not line up. Had to drill 2 holes. The shut off switch was very flimsy. Their instructions manual have a lot to be desired.

Time to set up: 4 hours to get it fully tuned and cutting

Impressions once running: Once again WOW. PLENTY of power and love the accuracy of the fence once set up. I am currently running the motor on 110 and will evetually pay to get 220 in my garage.

If you want me to post pictures, please let me know and I will!

Thanks
Patrick


On a later post he did show the pictures.


Hope that this helps! I am planning on driving a good distance to purchase the saw the last of next week if they still have it in stock. If you have any positive or negative information would you please let me know as that could influence my decision. If I do purchase it and get it set up I will let you know what I think if anyone is interested. Thanks! Allen

P.S. I must say that the people over here sure seem to be very
nice and friendly. Makes for a comfortable place to be.

[skip gleichman]

I have posted before on this saw but can say that having used the saw for 6 months now, I am even more impressed. It has plenty of power, is rock solid, sounds cool and is very accurate. I am very happy and am a much better woodworker because of the quality of this all important tool. I don't think you can match this saw for $850.00

[Allen Bookout]

Thank you so much for the swift reply! It gives me a much greater feeling of confidence about the saw. I will surely make the purchase now that I have heard from a woodworker that has actually used the saw for a while.

THANKS AGAIN!!!!! Allen

[Mike Holbrook]

I have the 50-185 with the 50" rails. I believe the 50-220 came out right after I bought my saw. I might well have gone for the 220. I love my 185 though.

A word of warning. If you got the Canadian Biesmier fence, like I did, you may find that the instructions are not correct on installing it. I had a very hard time and finally talked to the man at the International office. You want get any answers at the Canadian office concerning the International saws.

Apparently the instructions with some of the International saws are for the Taiwan fence although they say and appear to be for the fence you get with the saw.

Many people connect the fence rails to the wrong holes in the table top, as per the instructions, or end up drilling new holes. In my case the two overly large holes on the ends of the table were the correct ones to use although they look wrong. The rails work great with just those two screws holding them on. The large holes give the adjustability necessary to tune the fence.

If you have trouble give Trevor (I think thats the right name) at the International office a call, he will get you squared away quick.

[Allen Bookout]

Thanks Mike! This type of information can save a great deal of frustration. It is good to hear that you really like your 185. Gives me more confidence. I hope that next Thursday I can get my hands on a 220. A few days after that I will be able to file my first impressions if all goes well. Allen

[Mike Holbrook]

I mean- I was pulling out graying hair for a day and a half. The bolts seemed to fit in the holes that the instructions indicated. I must have taken everything apart and adjusted everything just right half a dozen times, but when I tightened everything up the fence would be off again, shheeees! Since the bolt holes did not actually match tightening up the bolts made the rails off level.

When I finally got the International General guy, I still did not get it at first. He kept asking me what holes I had my rail screws in. I thought he was crazy. "No I already have the rails attached. I have checked them a half dozen times they are level, I just can't get the fence level." Wrong! The fence want level if the rails are not level and although they may be level before you tighten those bolts up they want be afterwards. Once both rails are level with each other everything falls into place. The oversize bolt holes make it possible to level both rails to each other.

I think many people have made this same mistake in other posts I have read: "I just took the foot off the fence and let it rest on the table." "I drilled new holes in the table." "I put washers on the foot pieces to raise it up." General says they have new instructions in the works, but I have heard they have been saying that for a couple years now...

General makes a great saw. I think the product is exemplary. I will refrain from commenting on their fence instructions as I believe harsh language is discouraged on this forum :)

[Robert Gray]

This is my first post here. I'm just starting to get into woodworking as hobby (about a year and a half now). I bought a craftsman bench top saw before doing any real research on what I was doing. Now of course I feel I need to upgrade. I read the same article in workbench magazine that got this whole thread started, and was intereseted in the Craftsman. Am I a glutton for punishment or is it a good choice? The article did say the General was less expensive, but with the fence and blade we are in the same price range. I dont think the salesman will let me hack up some wood in his store and I dont know how else to try out what I'm getting. You guys have done a great job selling the General and even taught me some things. If there is any guidance other than what has already been said it would be greatly appreciated.

[Allen Bookout]

I talked to General International today about the 50-220 and ask about the motor hp. The tech guy said that the motor was really a 1.5 hp but due to the design of the belt system it generated 2.0 hp at the blade. Sounds a little crazy to me but who knows. I will say that he was very nice and happy to spend time answering my questions which is a big plus in my mind. Anyway, as you can tell, I am very worried about the power of the saw as at my age it will be my last saw and I would rather spend a few more dollars and be sure that I do not run into some application where I say "boy I sure could use a little more horse power".

The rep said the if I could spend the extra money for the 3 hp unit that it would be my last saw for sure as there would be no doubt that I would be happy with it. What a clever salesman! Well that was just what I wanted to hear so I called the nearest dealer and he just had an order delivered from General and that he had to have a total of several thousand dollars on a new order or they would not ship to him but that he would check on it and see what the deal is as he has another customer that just called and wanted the same saw. I ask if he had another brand that was equal in quality at the same price and they have a sale next weekend on a 3 hp Jet that put the price at almost exactly the same.

SO MY QUESTION IS: Is the Jet just as good as the General International? I really do not like green except on plants anyway. My big concern now is the fence.
The two models are: General International 50-260 and the Jet 708663MBK.

A NOTE TO ROBERT - I am sorry that I got off on my own thing and neglected your post. Before 1985 every tool that I bought was a Craftsman and they were great. Even my Father had mostly Craftsman tools. After that time the quality of the products and service as well deteriorated so badly that I have not made a Sears purchase since 1986. Could be it has changed but I doubt it. May be that is why I am so careful about checking out a product before I buy it. I would say take the recommendations in the forums seriously. The guys here actually use the products for periods of time and have a better test bed by far than the retailers or even the test evaluations done by magazines etc. as the latter only test for a short duration. Good Luck!!! Allen

[Kent Parker]

Those of you interested in a General saw see my post at

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=17300

I have the 50-260 and now that General has sent me a replacement fence I am as happy as can be. For many years I had been considering a Jet or a Unisaw but I am SO happy that I found the Green One:D The General International's distinction from other Taiwan saws is the Canadian made "Biesmeyer" fence. Truely a joy to use. Yowzaaaa!!!