New Mahindra truck.

[Dave Lehnert]

Was reading in USA Today that Mahindra is going to start selling a diesel truck in the USA (looks to be the size of an Colorado) that will carry a load of 2,765 lbs. Will get 30 MPG. Two door model will retail at $20,000 and a 4 door at $22,000.
Looks interesting. May bring on a new breed of truck from all manufactures.
http://www.pickuptrucks.com/html/stories/mahindra/jperez.html

http://www.pickuptrucks.com/trucks/IMAGES/2009/mahindra/mahindra1.jpg

[Ben Martin]

A small diesel pick up truck! Somebody finally has listened...

Interesting the article you posted said that they would start importing them in early 2009, have they?

[Jamie Buxton]

That truck has been the subject of rumors for several years. Mahindra is clearly not getting it here as quickly as they initially hoped. They've also become embroiled in a big lawsuit with the US company that was supposed to be the distributor.

Mahindra has released only a few numbers about that truck. They've called it a compact truck, so it apparently is supposed to compete with trucks like the Ford Ranger and the Toyota Tacoma. Mahindra says the truck gets 30 mpg on the highway, which is nice, but the Ranger gets 27 mpg on the highway, so that's not a big improvement. And Mahindra says they want to sell the truck in the $20K-plus region. Rangers start at $12K, and Toyatas are a little more. So perhaps the reason that Mahindra is taking so long to get the truck here is that they're realizing they're not going to be competitive.

[Joel Goodman]

and what about parts!!!

[Dave Lehnert]

That truck has been the subject of rumors for several years. Mahindra is clearly not getting it here as quickly as they initially hoped. They've also become embroiled in a big lawsuit with the US company that was supposed to be the distributor.

Mahindra has released only a few numbers about that truck. They've called it a compact truck, so it apparently is supposed to compete with trucks like the Ford Ranger and the Toyota Tacoma. Mahindra says the truck gets 30 mpg on the highway, which is nice, but the Ranger gets 27 mpg on the highway, so that's not a big improvement. And Mahindra says they want to sell the truck in the $20K-plus region. Rangers start at $12K, and Toyatas are a little more. So perhaps the reason that Mahindra is taking so long to get the truck here is that they're realizing they're not going to be competitive.

A Ranger gets 27MPG? I have friends that say they cant get 17 going down hill in the wind.
I have a F150 rated at 17 to 22 MPG. Best I ever got was was 15 highway.
I will believe 30 mpg when I see it.

[Jamie Buxton]

A Ranger gets 27MPG?...

That's the EPA highway rating (for the 4 cylinder Ranger with the manual transmission). Presumably the EPA highway rating is what Mahindra is talking about too.

[Chuck Wintle]

and what about parts!!!
coming from india it is probably junk!

[David Weaver]

A Ranger gets 27MPG? I have friends that say they cant get 17 going down hill in the wind.
I have a F150 rated at 17 to 22 MPG. Best I ever got was was 15 highway.
I will believe 30 mpg when I see it.

I had a ranger with a v6 and it got about 20 no matter what you did.

Before the latest and greatest emissions regs, diesels were about 30% better on mileage spec for the same capability.

I would imagine the mahindra diesel is probably more capable than the 4 cylinder versions of domestic small pickups.

I'm looking forward to seeing it if they get it over here. I believe mahindra built more tractors than anyone else last year, including john deere. They've been around for a while.

We've been begging for a small pickup with a diesel in it for years, and none of the domestics can come close to making one that meets emissions standards for $20K, so I wouldn't compare a 20k mahindra diesel truck with a 14k stripped down short bed regular cab 4 cylinder pickup. They could probably make that cheaper, too.

(just looked up size, and the payload on the pickup in question is a little over 2700 pounds. It's quite a bit bigger than the base spec ranger).

[Ed Griner]

My experience with hardware made in India has been very bad. It seems like they don't know what they don't know. Ed

[Jason Roehl]

What I want to see is a mid-size diesel in a full-size truck/van. I need cargo space, and I want fuel efficiency without the need to pull a mansion-sized 5th wheel. The only diesels available in vehicles in the U.S. don't fit that bill--they're either much smaller (VW Tdi) or much larger (Powerstroke, Cummins and Duramax--all at about 6 or more liters and pushing 700 ft-lbs of torque). I want something that's on the order of 3-4 liters displacement, gets about 200-250HP and about 350-400 ft-lbs of torque and around 20 MPG in full-size (1/2-ton) trucks and vans. That shouldn't be difficult to do with a diesel.

I think that if automakers could produce such an animal within a reasonable cost, they would hit a home run, especially with contractors who don't deal with heavy equipment.

[David Weaver]

Reasonable cost is the kicker. International truck has had a 4 1/2 liter diesel for a while. there were rumors at one point that it was supposed to show up in 1/2 ton full size trucks, but they never materialized, probably due to cost, which itself is due to the emissions, etc.

A low power cummins 6 liter when it was about 200 horsepower was a very nice engine for efficiency, but it wouldn't come close to the forced regs now for engines.

[Horton Brasses]

A diesel engine will generally run about $2-2.5K more than an equivalent displacement gasoline engine. It will also get 25-30% better fuel economy. Of course, in this country diesel has a price premium so the actual operating costs are typically lower but not that much lower.

Mahindra is an extremely well regarded manufacturer worldwide. They have been trying to bring this truck over to use for several years now. The delay is because of US emissions and safety standards. I am sure protectionist political maneuvers have as much or more to with this than anything else-but I can't back that up with fact.

The diesel engines to power 1/2 ton pickups with decent mileage exist and have for years. Because diesel is more than gas here we don't get the diesel offerings available elsewhere. Again, the net operating cost difference, plus the higher sticker price, limit the demand-or at least the car companies think they do.

Virtually every auto manufacturer in the world has a complete range of diesel truck and car motors ranging from 1.5 to 4 liters or so. The only unique American diesel motors are the monsters they stick in full size pick ups. You can now get some 6 cylinder diesel engines in SUV's here-they will give you 25mpg on the highway and close to 500 pounds of torque-but they will all set you back close to $50K at the absolute minimum.

[Bart Leetch]

coming from india it is probably junk!

I remember coming from Japan it's probably junk.

I also remember coming from Taiwan its probably junk & what about China.

Come on get off the kick.

[Matt Meiser]

Mahindra has been importing compact tractors for quite some time. I haven't don a ton of research on them, but in passing have seen comments on them. Junk was not one of those.

I know at least one of the domestics basically stopped work on diesels because of the emissions regs that came in ~2007. They sell them in Europe but the standards were tighter here. The urea injection idea was initially rejected by the EPA because it requires the driver to actually fill the urea tank occasionally. This all comes from an acquaintance who is a powertrain engineer there I asked why they weren't doing it a couple years ago.

[Chuck Wintle]

I remember coming from Japan it's probably junk.

I also remember coming from Taiwan its probably junk & what about China.

Come on get off the kick.

Bart,

It was not meant as inflammatory but more as fact. India does not have the same grasp of quality control as other countries do. Just a fact and that is not to say they never will.

[Jim Becker]

Mahindra has been importing compact tractors for quite some time. I haven't don a ton of research on them, but in passing have seen comments on them. Junk was not one of those.

That's what I was going to mention, too...

[Dave Lehnert]

Mahindra would not be the brand on top of my list. But may create enough interest for others to look at the idea.

I think what Mahindra has is a track record with the tractor. But have to admit , I don't know what that record is. I have never heard bad about them.

[Myk Rian]

I always have, and always will buy domestic. Sending the profits out of our country is killing us.
With that said, I'll stick with my 4 liter 1997 Ranger. This thing will pull like there's no tomorrow.

[Charlie Jones]

I have a 2005 ranger 4 liter, dependable and will haul whatever I ask it to. That said, my company had a Mahindra tractor dealership for a while, until the economy tanked. The tractors are good with a few exceptions. They don't like honoring warrenties so well..

[David Weaver]

I think what Mahindra has is a track record with the tractor. But have to admit , I don't know what that record is. I have never heard bad about them.

Neither have I. Someone mentioned to me that they were making tractors that had a lot of copied old-tech parts (similar to the way a lot of import tools are near copies of domestic tools) , but I haven't looked at one closely (nor driven one) to figure out if that's true and what they're a copy of.

I think McCormick is/was doing the same thing, using designs a generation behind and offering them at lower cost.

When John Deere and Case go to china for their small tractors, what is there really to complain about from an indian company if they can supply parts and service similar to the big domestic manufacturers?

Same goes for cars. What car really is "domestic" 100% now?

[Bart Leetch]

I've been trying to domesticate my cars & trucks for years now but I still seem to have to keep metric wrenches around.

[Charlie Jones]

They are not all Indian. Some of the smaller models are made by Mitsubishi. The largest model is made in South Korea with an Indian engine. The tires and front end loaders are US.