Old Cabinet Construction

[Scott Hildenbrand]

Someone remind me what the phrase was for the old style of built-in cabinet construction that used an open framing where attached to walls as apposed to sheet material all around.

I'm contemplating using this method to build a few cabinets and want to look further into the method before I dig too deep.

Really, I don't see a down side to it, beyond the more "in place" method of construction as apposed to building boxes in a shop and assembling on site.

Your thoughts?

[Don Alexander]

1 big advantage to this method is that it takes less material overall but its a bit trickier to mount drawers than in a more modern style cabinet

nothing at all wrong with the old method

[Bob Wingard]

I don't know if it's the REAL name for it, but I've always heard it referred to as "Built in place" vs. "Modular".

Built in place, to me has a cleaner look, as you don't have the doubled up stiles where they are bolted together. It can also save a fair amount of materials doing it that way.

[Steve Griffin]

I built my very first kitchen that way. Basically I built a base with a ply top, screwed a ledger on the wall, and then attached rectangular "ribs" to the ledger and base. These "ribs" were basically 1.5 x 2" frames which were positioned where a cabinet partition would normally go. They had notches for the back ledger, and a connecting stringer along the top and bottom of the front. There was no separate face frame--the front edge of the "ribs" and the stringers was finished.

Drawer slides were attached to the framework, but where doors went I attached a 1/4" skin to the frame.

It's extremely unlikely you will save any time with this method, or more than a couple dollars of materials. But it is more fun.

-Steve

[Steve Griffin]

I don't know if it's the REAL name for it, but I've always heard it referred to as "Built in place" vs. "Modular".

Built in place, to me has a cleaner look, as you don't have the doubled up stiles where they are bolted together. It can also save a fair amount of materials doing it that way.

In 15 years of cabinet making, I have never done doubled up stiles. Each run of cabinets gets it's own, nicely done face frame. Sometimes that means a horribly heavy and nasty to deliver cabinet, or a faceframe attached on the jobsite, but bolted together faceframes of stock sized cabinets is the single biggest indicator of non-custom junk to me.

Surprisingly, many custom shops do it!

-Steve

[Paul Greathouse]

Scott

Down here we call that type of construction "Stick Built". Years ago I built my first 3 sets of cabinets that way. For me, the disadvantage of that method is keeping things square and attaching drawer slides as someone else mentioned. Also, asthetically, I prefer not to see the runners that get attached to the wall for the shelves to sit on. I think a wood or plywood back looks alot nicer when the doors are open.

I much prefer building boxes in the shop and then installing, but that may not be the best way for everyone. As Steve said, doubled stiles are not necessary, you just have to install your faceframes after the boxes are mounted.

[Josiah Bartlett]

I like to use a hybrid approach where I build the cabinet box(es) to fill the space, and then build and install the face frame(s) once the cabinets carcases are installed, but I'm not a pro and don't have to do that for anybody but myself. Its a bit more difficult if you have to fabricate it and then take it to the job site. I like to have a full back on cabinets for a more finished look and to keep the things that I tend to stuff in there from jamming up the drawers or falling behind the case.

[Dave Zellers]

I built my very first kitchen that way.

Yep- me too. But I wouldn't do it again. For me a huge advantage to building closed, sealed cabinet carcasses in the shop, is believe it or not, bugs.

Or rather, no bugs.

Bugs like kitchens.

I don't like bugs in my kitchen.

If you do go this route, take the time to caulk all the tiny gaps inside the cabinet.

[Peter Quinn]

In 15 years of cabinet making, I have never done doubled up stiles. Each run of cabinets gets it's own, nicely done face frame. Sometimes that means a horribly heavy and nasty to deliver cabinet, or a faceframe attached on the jobsite, but bolted together faceframes of stock sized cabinets is the single biggest indicator of non-custom junk to me.

Surprisingly, many custom shops do it!

-Steve

We make them as you describe, the biggest thing that will go through the door, with joints assembled in the field as necessary. So they look as if they were built in place.I"ve done 22' runs that look like one long face frame. I have a stick built kitchen in my house from the 1950's that I gave a quick face lift, and the biggest problem with that style is the lack of interior partitions allows things to slide around from box to box. It's tough to stay organized with one big open hole behind a run of doors!

[Richard Dragin]

I call it a pantry...

http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j147/DraginRichard/Pantry/Untitled.jpg

http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j147/DraginRichard/Pantry/pantry5-1.jpg

http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j147/DraginRichard/Pantry/pantry4.jpg

http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j147/DraginRichard/Pantry/pantry2.jpg

http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j147/DraginRichard/Pantry/pantry.jpg

http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j147/DraginRichard/Pantry/IMG_0534.jpg

http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j147/DraginRichard/Pantry/IMG_0537.jpg

In keeping with the details of the rest of the house I wanted to also go "old school" with the build so I used my RAS to shape the door profiles.

http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j147/DraginRichard/Pantry/pantry10jpg.jpg

[Steve Griffin]

Nice looking built in.

But I have to say, all that fitting and caulking to the back wall to save a $20 back made of 1/4" MDF is something I won't be doing anytime soon.

Still, I love the final result!

-Steve

[Tony Bilello]

If the old ways were better, we would still be building them that way.

[Richard Dragin]

Don't confuse the economics of mass production with quality. It makes more business sense to pre-fab cases in a shop than to spend the time building in a customers home.

A built in uses much less material and for a hobbyist, it would take more time to build the boxes than do a built in.

[Scott Hildenbrand]

Ok.. I think I've digested this thread enough.. Thanks all for your opinions.. Much appreciated, as always. :)