First Cored Bowls

[Baxter Smith]

After picking up a used 3520A and oneway coring system on craigslist a couple of weeks ago I finally got around to turning something with it today. David Keller thought I would like the lathe and asked for my impression of the coring system. He was right about the lathe. The larger swing, greater mass, slower speed, increased torque, greater spindle height, along with an overall smoothness were tough not to like! :D As to the coring system, I have never used or seen one being used except on my computer.

I received the oneway cutter sharpening jig a couple days ago so the night before last I sharpened all four cutters in preparation for yesterday. Read the instructions that went with the cutter and watched the video clip on the oneway website. The quality of the clip was not the greatest but better than nothing. The shape of the cutters oneway now uses is different than the old style and I had the old style. There was an explanation of how to regrind the old cutter into the new shape so I did all four.

This summer in Maine I volunteered :) to cut down a red maple that was growing too close to my sisters porch. Brought back a couple of pieces I had split. Thought they would make good candidates for trying out the corer.

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Yesterday morning I put this blank on the new to me bandsaw. Going from 1 to 2 hp did make a difference!

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Roughed the outside then reversed to layout the core.

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When starting to core the smallest bowl, the knife seemed to want to skate across the surface toward the middle. I eventually traced it to the fact that the coring jig was moving away from the headstock so retightened harder…. and then harder… then went and got a succession of bigger wrenches. Could have gotten out my ¾ drive breaker bar but think I could have wrung off the head with the ½ as it was.


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Nothing seemed to make too much difference. It just wouldn’t stay put.

The oneway video showed using a piece of ply to set the distance from the headstock and I just left it there. As soon as it started to move, you could see the gap between the ply and the headstock. I took the parts off and tried to scuff the underside of the ways and clamp block with sandpaper to get a better grip. I began to think that maybe the cutter wasn’t sharp enough so I went through the directions and watched the video clip again. I had sharpened the first (left edge) correctly but had then sharpened the right side, rather than flipping it upside down and sharpening the left bottom. I had just removed ¾ of the life of the cutter. Argh!:mad: All 4 of them!!

Resharpened as correctly as was possible then tried again. The system still wanted to slip so brought up the tailstock without the live center and clamped that down in back of the coring block as a brace. The gap between the base of the corer and the headstock still gradually increased. Tightened the tailstock even harder. Still slipped. I couldn’t believe it. Then I finally noticed something. Duh. For those of you that haven’t caught on caught on yet, lets just say it was the first time I had ever turned on a lathe with a sliding headstock.


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First core done, just glad it wasn’t smaller!

[Baxter Smith]

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Got three bowls from the first blank. The largest is a little over 13. I put them back between centers, turned a tenon, smoothed them out just for fun and will now let them dry until next year.

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The other piece of maple was not as thick.
Used a faceplate on this one. Was a new experience to put a 16 inch chunk of wood on a lathe.

The oneway video had mentioned once turning the cores to get more so I decided I would try to once turn this piece. It soon occurred to me that I didn’t have any way of holding them when done. I turned them all to about 1 inch except for the outer one which already had a tenon. Added a tenon to each and returned to a little under a ½”. Had an obvious problem with the second core.

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I tried to use the same knife for two different sized cores. I guess you don’t do that, or at least not the way I did. The largest bowl in this one is 15.

Can’t say it was thrilling to do but I did end up with 6 bowls rather than just 2. Hopefully I won’t make the same mistakes again!:o


From what I have read, the oneway has about the shortest learning curve but it is not idiot proof! Next time it should be less challenging! Won’t use it many more times before having to order new cutters. Maybe I should just order new cutters and avoid more aggravation.:)

My tool rests worked ok but I still need to take about ½ inch more off the posts length. Speaking of posts, the curved bowl rest that I picked up with the lathe must have been made for a 14 inch lathe as its post was too short to be clamped in the banjo and be at the right height. Will need a piece welded on. Back to metal work this afternoon.

[Josh Bowman]

Baxter, You had me on the edge of my seat! I'm glad I'm not the only one to goof up. Here's my favorite.....and I can't seem to remember:( when I repeat it again. I will be turning something and start the finishing off process after sanding. I try to turn the foot off and all the gouge will do is rattle around. Then after shapening my gouge, I come to find out the lathe is in reverse from one of the sanding processes! There's a DAH for you.
Glad you got it to work. How do you like it?

[Richard Madden]

Baxter,
Thanks for the photos and the descriptive process you went through (even the problems) to get all those bowls. Sorry to hear about the problems, but it sounds like you've got things worked out. Coring systems are so neat, wish I had one. Like you said, now you have 6 bowls instead of 2. Good luck with the new (to you) lathe and coring sys.

[Jack Mincey]

The vortex slope just got a little more slippery for you. The bowls look great and as far as not locking the headstock down, it happens to everyone with that style of lathe eventually. You have already got it out of your way. You can make more than one with each knife set if you move the base to you to get the thickness at the rim needed as well as slide it in the direction of the head stock to get the thickness at the bottom you need. I mark where the base is with pencil before I move it to let me know how far I've moved it. Remember when moving the base to figure in for the kerf of the cutter.
Happy Coring,
Jack

[Thomas Bennett]

New to you lathe, coring system....even bandsaw! You're set up now! I found the presentation enlightening. I use the McN system and want to try the OneWay. Everyone that has one seems to like it.

[John Keeton]

A'bowling we shall go....a'bowling we shall go.....

Great pic and text journey there, Baxter!! Congrats on your trial run, and I see a bunch of bowls in your future!

[David E Keller]

Glad to hear the new tools are getting some mileage, and thanks for the report on the coring system... Despite the misadventures, it looks like you got a good group of bowls cored out there. Nice work!

[Rich Aldrich]

Congrats on the newsed toys!

Very good write-up. Now I know how I will mess up when I get a coring system, even though your explaination should keep me out of trouble.

Now you just need to try the DNA method so you dont have to wait until next year for your bowls to dry!

[Ken Hill]

Aint that slick:D

[Baxter Smith]

Glad you got it to work. How do you like it?
Thanks Josh, once I know what it can and cannot do as far as the setup I think it will be very straightforward and easy to use.


Coring systems are so neat, wish I had one. Like you said, now you have 6 bowls instead of 2.
Thanks Richard. I thought it would be nice to have a coring system but my old lathe would have been borderline at best in using one. Never would have paid full price for this one but it was too good a deal to pass up. Have enough for gifts for both my sister and each of her kids!:)


You can make more than one with each knife set if you move the base to you to get the thickness at the rim needed as well as slide it in the direction of the head stock to get the thickness at the bottom you need. I mark where the base is with pencil before I move it to let me know how far I've moved it. Remember when moving the base to figure in for the kerf of the cutter.
Happy Coring,
Jack
Thanks for the guidance Jack. I set up the base initially to leave about a half inch thickness in the last/biggest bowl. I didn't want to mess up that one. I don't remember if there would have been enough depth left on the middle two to squeak by or not. I should have realized that the cutter was going to end up at the same depth if I only moved the base out to the side and not in. Things are usually a lot more obvious to me after I have screwed them up!:)

New to you lathe, coring system....even bandsaw! You're set up now! I found the presentation enlightening. I use the McN system and want to try the OneWay. Everyone that has one seems to like it.

Thanks Thomas. I probably would have gotten the Mcnaughton if this one hadn't been such a good deal. Pretty pricey! I think most of the skill involved in its use is simply setting it up correctly.



Great pic and text journey there, Baxter!! Congrats on your trial run, and I see a bunch of bowls in your future!

Thanks John. I still want to try and do a nested set correctly but what really appeals to me is to take a nice blank, remove a decent size piece of wood for a HF, and still be left with a good sized bowl. Its been either one or the other and a pile of shavings.


Glad to hear the new tools are getting some mileage, and thanks for the report on the coring system... Despite the misadventures, it looks like you got a good group of bowls cored out there. Nice work!

Thanks David. Not much of a report. Having had a day to think about it, I am kind of looking forward to trying it again to see if I could do it without a hitch.


Congrats on the newsed toys!

Very good write-up. Now I know how I will mess up when I get a coring system, even though your explaination should keep me out of trouble.

Now you just need to try the DNA method so you dont have to wait until next year for your bowls to dry!

I have thought about the DNA RIch but it seems like I always have so much wood in the pile that I almost feel pressured to get something roughed out before it goes bad from checking. Pretty sad considerng I heat with a woodstove!!:)

[James Roberts]

Baxter, thanks for sharing your journey, even the "duhhh" moments. We can't learn to succeed if we don't learn first to fail. Nice looking bowl cores to boot.

[Karl Card]

I am glad to see someone uses one of those core deals. I have been looking and wanting but wanted someone else to try it out first...

any problems at all? and why oneway over the other brand? the magazine i have has oneway and also a woodsaver brand.

[Leo Van Der Loo]

I think you did pretty good for a first run, and the outcome is quite nice Baxter, I think you have a very good setup now with the new larger bandsaw and lathe, you'll be able to use the larger pieces if and when you do get them, also a nice picture show and write-up, always good to see how others are doing these things ;-))

[Joshua Dinerstein]

Can’t say it was thrilling to do but I did end up with 6 bowls rather than just 2. Hopefully I won’t make the same mistakes again!:o

So why was it not thrilling? Coring just not as much fun as regular turning or was it just that one of them didn't go as you expected? I have a corting rig I bought last Christmas that is still in the box and I just haven't had time to play with it yet. I want to but time sure does slip away these days.

My setup is the Bowl Saver from Wood Cut so quite a different beast from what you have. Just wondering about it all before I get it out of the box I guess.

Joshua

[Tim Rinehart]

I've cored a couple of times with my OneWay system, and the last time, I experimented with trying to get some flexibility from the cuts, as to the shape I ended up with.
If you use the system strictly the way OneWay videos tell you, it leads you to keeping the base in the same spot throughout the individual section being cored. I've found that I can take advantage of of the kerf slop to change the direction of my cut and to change from say a small radius entry to a larger radius finish, for doing something like a shallow bowl (read "deep dish"). If not obvious...I'm changing the knives for a single core's cut.

One other thing worth getting if you don't have it...is a 2MT extension, about $15 from CS and currently no shipping for a couple more days. This will allow you to bring your tailstock up and help support while coring...a nice safety feature.

Lastly...and again, I haven't tried yet, but consider taking a gouge to smooth up the inside face before taking the next cut. If you did this, and then mounted the core removed into a jam or JumboJaws, you could leave only the outside to finish, providing you don't mind a little movement from drying. I thought about this after seeing a set of paper thin nested bowls by Mike Mahoney, which I suspect he did with a McN system, but you could do much of same with the OneWay.

Have fun.

[Baxter Smith]

.... We can't learn to succeed if we don't learn first to fail.....
Thanks James, I like the challenge of trying something I know little about so .....:)

I am glad to see someone uses one of those core deals. I have been looking and wanting but wanted someone else to try it out first...

any problems at all? and why oneway over the other brand? the magazine i have has oneway and also a woodsaver brand.

James, I didn't really pick the oneway. It just came with a lathe I was interested in at a very reasonable price. Even though it has good reviews and is more or less foolproof, it seems to be the most expensive by a good bit. I am pretty sure I wouldn't have paid full price for it regardless of how good it was. There are others that are said to be more versatile for less money, but may take longer to learn to use without error.


I think you did pretty good for a first run, and the outcome is quite nice Baxter, I think you have a very good setup now with the new larger bandsaw and lathe, you'll be able to use the larger pieces if and when you do get them, also a nice picture show and write-up, always good to see how others are doing these things ;-))
Thanks Leo. Overall I was pleased with how things came out.

So why was it not thrilling? Coring just not as much fun as regular turning or was it just that one of them didn't go as you expected? I have a corting rig I bought last Christmas that is still in the box and I just haven't had time to play with it yet. I want to but time sure does slip away these days.

My setup is the Bowl Saver from Wood Cut so quite a different beast from what you have. Just wondering about it all before I get it out of the box I guess.

Joshua
Joshua, the "not thrilling" statement probably resulted from the fact that the difficulties I had were still fresh in my mind!:) Once you learn what you can and cannot do as far as setup, it should be pretty much mechanical. This is perhaps an over statement to those who know more, but it seems like its just "pull on the handle" when you are doing the actual coring. If you follow the directions correctly concerning setup and use, there is not much that can(should) go wrong.
When setting up, (accoring to the Oneway directions) you adjust the largest cutter being used so that it cuts to within whatever base thickness of the largest bowl you want. The piece of plywood on the ways keeps it at the proper distance.
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When starting to core with the smallest(number 1 knife) you keep that distance but just slide the base in for a smaller diameter bowl.
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You then slide the base out further for knife number two, then repeat for knife number three.
If you read Tim's explanation you will see there are other variations you can use to be more creative.

I've cored a couple of times with my OneWay system, and the last time, I experimented with trying to get some flexibility from the cuts, as to the shape I ended up with.
If you use the system strictly the way OneWay videos tell you, it leads you to keeping the base in the same spot throughout the individual section being cored. I've found that I can take advantage of of the kerf slop to change the direction of my cut and to change from say a small radius entry to a larger radius finish, for doing something like a shallow bowl (read "deep dish"). If not obvious...I'm changing the knives for a single core's cut.

One other thing worth getting if you don't have it...is a 2MT extension, about $15 from CS and currently no shipping for a couple more days. This will allow you to bring your tailstock up and help support while coring...a nice safety feature.

Lastly...and again, I haven't tried yet, but consider taking a gouge to smooth up the inside face before taking the next cut. If you did this, and then mounted the core removed into a jam or JumboJaws, you could leave only the outside to finish, providing you don't mind a little movement from drying. I thought about this after seeing a set of paper thin nested bowls by Mike Mahoney, which I suspect he did with a McN system, but you could do much of same with the OneWay.

Have fun.
Thanks for the insights about changing knives Tim! I appreciate it!
I don't have an extension and was wondering how I was going to use that free shipping coupon I got from CS a few days ago! That one lasts till the end of the month. Here is a picture of a difficulty I had that I didn't even mention before.:)
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It didn't come off but it was wobbling. May have been the result of a dull cutter and or too short a tenon. Had to remount and turn a longer one before I even got my first small core out!
Good idea as well on finishing the inside before removing the core. Without thinking too much about it, would it be more difficult to get a consistent wall and base thickness if you were then just finishing the outside?
Thanks again for taking the time to share your experiences!:)

[Tim Rinehart]

Hmmm, you have a good point. As I said...I hadn't tried yet, but that does raise a point.
Thinking about it...I suppose if the blank with a finished interior were mounted on a jumbo jaw, one would be able to insert a set of calipers between the jaws to get a read on the wall thickness.

I suspect the biggest challenge may be the very outermost portion of the outside of the cores, where a jumbo jaw button would reside.

If done by jam chucking, I think removing much material from outside could get scary with wood movement and just unsupported flexing. Hmmm...good point you brought up, at least one of us has starting thinking it thru.

[Reed Gray]

Coring from the inside out (smallest first) or outside in (largest first) depends on what you want to do. I turn to final thickness and then let them dry and warp before sanding and finishing. Makes more sense to take the largest core first, finish turn, then remount the core and turn it. Mike Mahoney, if you get his new DVD with the McNaughton, takes the smaller one first, and works his way down for utility bowls. He turns, drys, and then finish turns. His way, you take them all from one setting and the bowl never comes off the lathe till you are done.

After using the Oneway, I figured that if I was to use it in production, I would have a special sharpener. You sharpen the top surface of the cutter, not the face. If you sharpened the bevel, you would grind away the point/chip breaker. For sharpening, I would want an flat 220 or so grit abrasive wheel (MDF, or plywood with psa metal sand paper on it) to sharpen with. Never did like the hold it up to the grinder method, even with the jig they sell. I did get a tip from Oneway that didn't have the point ground on it. I ground a taper (front to back) to it, and just used a bevel on the front edge. It works very well that way. It does tend to be more aggressive in cutting, which is why it isn't sold that way. If you put a lot of cutting pressure on it, you could bog down your lathe. The idea with the tip is it breaks the wood fiber first, and then, the sides will cut it away.

You can get some variation of curves with the Oneway as you can move the plate out or in, to change the path you are taking. If you go as far as the slot in the plate allows, you can run into some binding problems, as in the blade and support finger make an arc, and by moving the center/pivot point of the blades, you change the curve of the arc.

The Wood cut is a nice little system. Big blade is a 5 inch radius. It does tend to chatter a bit, more so on harder woods. You do need to hook the tailstock up to the plate it sits on. For me who never used a tailstock, this was a draw back. For a 12 inch, 1 hp lathe, it works pretty well.

The main reason the McNaughton can take more different types of cuts is that it comes with blades with shallower arcs, so you can get down into deeper pieces, or skim off plate sections.

I do prefer the McNaughton. Once you learn to use it, it is a lot faster than the other systems.

robo hippy

[Allen Neighbors]

Great post, Baxter! And the bowls look good, too! I thought sure the lathe was in reverse, when I read about the trouble you were having. :D Never been around the MM, so I'd never seen the sliding headstock.
Thanks for posting!! Good one!

[Steve Schlumpf]

Baxter - thanks for photos of the coring process! Some struggles but your results sure look good!

I have waffled a number of times about getting a coring system but never really wanted one until just yesterday. I am turning a commissioned bowl for a lady out of a Box Elder that was cut down in her yard and the top of the blank was all this beautiful burl! Turned most of it away and just about made me sick to do it - but I kept telling myself - its not my wood, its not my wood!

Looking forward to your further observations after you get to use the coring system a little more!

[Baxter Smith]

... I thought sure the lathe was in reverse, when I read about the trouble you were having. :D ...

I will probably try that trick next time! Guess it was tight enough for roughing out the bottom but not enough for the pressure of the coring.



.....I am turning a commissioned bowl for a lady out of a Box Elder that was cut down in her yard and the top of the blank was all this beautiful burl! Turned most of it away and just about made me sick to do it ....
Steve, that is the primary reason a coring system interested me. I don't turn expensive wood(come to think of it, even wood I have had to pay for) but I have turned some "pretty" free wood into nothing but shavings.



Coring from the inside out (smallest first) or outside in (largest first) depends on what you want to do. I turn to final thickness and then let them dry and warp before sanding and finishing. Makes more sense to take the largest core first, finish turn, then remount the core and turn it. Mike Mahoney, if you get his new DVD with the McNaughton, takes the smaller one first, and works his way down for utility bowls. He turns, drys, and then finish turns. His way, you take them all from one setting and the bowl never comes off the lathe till you are done.

After using the Oneway, I figured that if I was to use it in production, I would have a special sharpener. You sharpen the top surface of the cutter, not the face. If you sharpened the bevel, you would grind away the point/chip breaker. For sharpening, I would want an flat 220 or so grit abrasive wheel (MDF, or plywood with psa metal sand paper on it) to sharpen with. Never did like the hold it up to the grinder method, even with the jig they sell. I did get a tip from Oneway that didn't have the point ground on it. I ground a taper (front to back) to it, and just used a bevel on the front edge. It works very well that way. It does tend to be more aggressive in cutting, which is why it isn't sold that way. If you put a lot of cutting pressure on it, you could bog down your lathe. The idea with the tip is it breaks the wood fiber first, and then, the sides will cut it away.

You can get some variation of curves with the Oneway as you can move the plate out or in, to change the path you are taking. If you go as far as the slot in the plate allows, you can run into some binding problems, as in the blade and support finger make an arc, and by moving the center/pivot point of the blades, you change the curve of the arc.



robo hippy
Thanks for taking the time to share your experiences and impressions. I have read and reread them several times. Your description of the cutter sounds somewhat like the way the cutters are supposed to be sharpened now. I tried the outside in approach yesterday. I had a piece of maple that would have made a small (9 inch) but very deep bowl, so instead of making just one, I used the number one knife and made 4 shallower bowls by simply sliding the base of the cutter away from the headstock.
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The bottom two or two on the left I turned thin, the top two are thicker and I will return later. I had turned a semi hollow form from the other side of the piece just before doing this one,
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so may use the far right one as a lid.
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Can't say I care for it as is but fitted, or with a contrasting ring, it may be okay. I will have a while to forget about it before I have to rethink.:)

Thanks again for everyones input. It is very helpful.

[Bruce Pratt]

Now that you're making bowls without tenons, I see a vacuum chuck in your future....
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Bruce Pratt