Purchasing Hand Drills/Braces

[Jared McMahon]

I'm debating what to do about my boring needs. A drill press would certainly be handy but I like the neander ethic, as well as the quiet, free floor space, etc. etc. so I'm digging into information about braces and eggbeaters. Almost all the advice I find is "They don't make 'em like they used to." With all the tool makers currently producing fine hand tools, is there really nobody making top-quality boring tools? I have nothing against rehab'ing old tools but it's clearly always a trade-off in money versus the time spent finding one, cleaning it, and fighting with any components that might be worn out.

Jared

PS: this gets said now and then but it bears repeating, this forum really is a treasure-trove of information and experience.

[Dan Andrews]

Glad you asked! I collect and use hand drills (egg beater type). I use braces of various sizes, a breast drill and a hand crank post drill (drill press). The most versital of all these types of drills is the brace. Bits are available to perform many different funcitons with a brace. Hand drills are great for making small holes. Over 1/4" is pushing it even for a larger drill with a 3/8" capacity chuck. There realy is no substitute for a drill press or post drill sometimes when the hole you are drilling has to be exactly at a given angle. With practice you can get prety good, but I think it is something some of us will never become perfect at.

As to drill quality. I don't have any new manually propelled drills. The hand drills from the 1920's were generally excellent, also nice to look at with cocobolo or rosewood handles. Surprisingly enough most of the older drills I have purchased on ebay have been good user drills if the seller said they were good. A quick wash with kerosene and a lube job are all most old drills need to be ready for use. Braces of brand name I have bought or been given, have also generally been in good user condition. These drills are rugged and with withstand a lot of use and still work 100%. Braces are fairly common at garage sales. I have paid $3.00 for a couple of excellent users.

Some examples of very good brand names in drills are: Millers Falls, North Brothers. Stanley (older), PS&W (Peck Stowe and Willcox) and one of my favorite hand drills is Goodell Pratt.

I recommend giving the used old drill market a try. Don't pay top dollar, that is for collectors. Excellent use drills with rust spots and chipped paint are where the deals are. If you go ebay, ask the seller any questions before you bid.

[Andrae Covington]

Glad you asked! I collect and use hand drills (egg beater type). I use braces of various sizes, a breast drill and a hand crank post drill (drill press). The most versital of all these types of drills is the brace. Bits are available to perform many different funcitons with a brace. Hand drills are great for making small holes. Over 1/4" is pushing it even for a larger drill with a 3/8" capacity chuck. There realy is no substitute for a drill press or post drill sometimes when the hole you are drilling has to be exactly at a given angle. With practice you can get prety good, but I think it is something some of us will never become perfect at.

As to drill quality. I don't have any new manually propelled drills. The hand drills from the 1920's were generally excellent, also nice to look at with cocobolo or rosewood handles. Surprisingly enough most of the older drills I have purchased on ebay have been good user drills if the seller said they were good. A quick wash with kerosene and a lube job are all most old drills need to be ready for use. Braces of brand name I have bought or been given, have also generally been in good user condition. These drills are rugged and with withstand a lot of use and still work 100%. Braces are fairly common at garage sales. I have paid $3.00 for a couple of excellent users.

Some examples of very good brand names in drills are: Millers Falls, North Brothers. Stanley (older), PS&W (Peck Stowe and Willcox) and one of my favorite hand drills is Goodell Pratt.

I recommend giving the used old drill market a try. Don't pay top dollar, that is for collectors. Excellent use drills with rust spots and chipped paint are where the deals are. If you go ebay, ask the seller any questions before you bid.

Agree with what Dan says. See attached photo for the brace drills I have, all vintage. You don't need as many as I have (and some people have far more :eek::D), but it is nice to have different sizes for different tasks. A 10-inch sweep is by far the most common and is most likely what you would get on ebay if they don't say. (Can't tell you how many sellers measure the length of the drill but not the offset or sweep. Who cares how long it is?)

From left to right in the photo:
unmarked but probably Millers Falls #34, 6-inch sweep
HSB & Co # 1008 (a Chicago hardware company), 8-inch sweep
McIntosh Heather # 4410 (another hardware store), 10-inch sweep
Wards Master (Stanley #813), 10-inch weep
Millers Falls #731 Holdall, 12-inch sweep
Millers Falls #730 Holdall, 14-inch sweep

The Stanley #813 (branded for Montgomery Wards) is the newest of the group (~1949), in the best condition, and has the most heavy-duty chuck. It's a great brace drill and the one I use the most. I paid too much for it on Craigslist but still happy I have it. All the others are quite serviceable except the 14-inch Millers Falls has seen better days. I overpaid for the 6-inch from an online antique tool dealer, the others I got on ebay for $10 or less (plus shipping). I have used them all as-is without any "fettling".

[Casey Gooding]

These guys are right. No one is currently making quality boring tools that I know of. I believe Bridge City Toolworks made some for a while, but I'm sure they were pricey.
I really like the old Millers Falls drills. The #2 is an especially good model. Look for one with Rosewood handles. They are usually missing the small side handle.
You'll want to use brad point bits with it. Standard bits (witch were actually developed for metal working) tend to skip around.
As for braces. There are lots of nice ones out there. Any of those listed above will work nicely.
The Yankee/Bell/Stanley 2101 brace is considered the Cadillac of braces. They are smooth in operation and reliable. Watch out for the lube on the Bell braces. They apparently used some sort of green slime to lube them and it has usually hardened and will need to be cleaned out.
If you want one, be patient. They can get pricey on the Bay, but do show up at affordable prices regularly.

[Eric Brown]

Yes you can still buy new quality auger bits.
TFWW carries the Russell-Jennings and
Traditional woodworker also carries them plus
the Irwins.

Now the downside is that most of them cost more than $20.00
each. TWW sells a set of 6 or 7 for over $270.00.
Fine if you can afford it.

Your best bet for value might be E-Bay where you can get
Russell-Jennings in a wood boxed 13 piece set for the $60-$80 range.

If you don't trust your own judgement then some of the dealers will be
more than happy to sell you a good set.

If you need an opinion on a set, PM me and I'll try to help.

Eric

[George Sanders]

I find a lot of braces and bits at yard sales and auctions. I recently got a Stanley Bell system at auction for five bucks. Bits are sold very cheaply at auctions. They often sell a handful for a couple of dollars around where I live.

[Richard Niemiec]

Look for a Stanley or Millers Falls brace, make sure the ratcheting works, the chuck post is not worn out and the chuck operates smoothly. As long as the wood handles are in one piece, don't get too picky about whether the finish is gone or not, simply cosmetics.

Brace bits can be had for not much money, just inspect the screw ends and the flutes for length, then buy yourself a auger bit file to sharpen them up. Yes, you do need a specialized file or you'll screw them up, and only file the inside of the flutes or you'll ruin the diameter of the bit.

Yeah, we all know why we like the older Irwins and Jennings bits, but don't overlook the Craftsman bits from the 50's, likely made by Irwin or another good manufacturer as back then Sears took "Craftsman" branding seriously and spec'd them properly.

[lowell holmes]

http://www.traditionalwoodworker.com/Quality-Bit-Brace-3-Forged-Jaws-Made-in-France/productinfo/838-4000/

This looks like a good brace to me. I like the three jaws. It looks a lot like my Stanley except my Stanley is a two jaw brace.

I've purchased tools from these guys and I've been satisified. The tools purchased from them are good tools I use.

[Gary Herrmann]

A lot of good advise has been given. eBay is a good source, but there are also dealers like Walt at Brass City Records who tend to have a good selection.

I don't have a post drill, but I'm keeping my eyes open. A boring machine would also be helpful for large mortises, but I will admit to being a toolpig when it comes to drills.

Personally, I like the multi speed North Bros drills. They're very well made and give you some additional flexibility. The NB 1530 is my favorite egg beater.

You can drive a bit bigger than 1/4" with one of the large breast drills, but it's work. Multi speed is useful there too - North Bros 1555 or a Miller Falls 97.

Imagine what a company would charge for something as complex as a 5 speed drill these days.

[Steve Branam]

On another thread I mentioned getting a Spofford brace. These are great, very lightweight and easy to use when you don't need the ratchet of the larger braces. They require a square end bit, so you can't chuck up modern round bits the way you can with many regular braces. I have several of each (one for the main bit, one for the countersink bit, one for the driver bit...).

I also have Miller's Falls #2 and #77a eggbeaters. The #2 is the main worker, the #77a is smaller, so the pair is good when I need shank and thread pilot holes of slightly different sizes for screws.

Then drive the screws with a Yankee driver and finish setting with a brace and driver bit. Just beware of driving with a brace, that's an enormous amount of torque on a screw, it will continue right through the wood until something splits.

I experienced a magical transformation in these eggbeaters simply by adding a drop of oil to each of their oil points. They went from stiff, balky tools that I really didn't want to use to the equivalent of a Makita cordless; now I love using them! I found the secret to boring with them using modern twist bits is light pressure and high rotation rate; let the weight of the drill provide the force, and let the bit do it's work. With an oiled free-spinning drill, this is effortless.

I did have to expoxy the woden handle of the #77a in place so it wouldn't rotate while cranking. It just pressed onto a metal rod with some friction flanges; these had chewed out the inside of the hole over the years.

[John Powers]

You would never buy a new brace. Too many around. If your in new jersey sometime stop by band I'll give you one from the phone co for $10.00. In the wild jaws and chucks tend to be vulnerable to rust. Bits are another story. If the little screw tip is screwed up your buggered and that's hard to see on ebay. This stuff does come up on CL.

[Joel Goodman]

If you're not an Ebay shopper Sandy Moss and Patrick Leach have braces and can advise you. The prices are a little more but you can discuss your wishes and for a few $ more get something really clean. Get more than one and with different sweeps -- braces are addictive and it's handy to keep various bits chucked up during a project. Big bit --use a larger sweep. Also some chucks can hold any bit -- obviously these can be useful. And braces are fantastic for loosening a stuck screw. Mine hold the hex shank screwdriver bits fine and with shoulder pressure and the leverage you can get out stubborn screws without buggering them up.

[Andrae Covington]

...Mine hold the hex shank screwdriver bits fine...

As an alternative, Lee Valley sells a magnetic 1/4" hex brace driver that holds those little short hex-shaft bits you see a lot of these days. Handy for when you need square-drive, star-drive, etc. They also sell a similar driver for sockets. Items C and D on the page for Hand Braces and Accessories (http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/page.aspx?p=32300&cat=1,180,42337&ap=1). Also on that page are some new brace drills. I don't know about the quality but as we've all been saying, the antiques can be picked up for much cheaper.

[Dan Andrews]

Andrae, I agree that your 6" brace is probably a MF #34. The name should be on the chuck in small letters. I have two of them and keep one chucked up with a very old countersink that has one cutting edge. It is the best countersink I have ever used. The Holdalls are a particularly good choice for the larger sizes I think. Stanley # 923 is equivalent to the Holdall and also a good choice. The Holdall and the 923 are not particularly collector drills and can be had on ebay very reasonably.

[Jonathan McCullough]

Hey Dan, while we've got you identifying braces, what about this one? I saw it at a flea market and thought, ahh, enclosed ratchet = North Bros., but this one is all Stanley. The chuck says "Stanley Rule and Level X New Britain Conn. USA"

On the back of the chuck it says, "PATENTED OCT 14-08 APR 26-04 FEB 27-05 JUNE 5-06"

Kind of an odd one.

[Dan Andrews]

Hey Dan, while we've got you identifying braces, what about this one? I saw it at a flea market and thought, ahh, enclosed ratchet = North Bros., but this one is all Stanley. The chuck says "Stanley Rule and Level X New Britain Conn. USA"

On the back of the chuck it says, "PATENTED OCT 14-08 APR 26-04 FEB 27-05 JUNE 5-06"

Kind of an odd one.

That is a good question Johathan. I am not very knowledgeable about specific braces that I don't own. I don't believe I have ever seen that model of Stanley. That is a good find and I suspect worth some bucks to a Stanley collector. Did you actually pay just $6. as shown on the crank handle? The most resent patent date is 32 years before Stanley bought out North Bros. You have no doubt noticed that the "Yankee" trade name went from North Bros. to Stanley at that time. I have Yankee push drills made by North Bros. and Stanley that are nearly identical.

These early tool companies coppied eachother relentlessly and patents be damned. Their excecutives and design engineers jumped back and forth between companies quite frequently. :)

[Dan Andrews]

A lot of good advise has been given. eBay is a good source, but there are also dealers like Walt at Brass City Records who tend to have a good selection.

I don't have a post drill, but I'm keeping my eyes open. A boring machine would also be helpful for large mortises, but I will admit to being a toolpig when it comes to drills.

Personally, I like the multi speed North Bros drills. They're very well made and give you some additional flexibility. The NB 1530 is my favorite egg beater.

You can drive a bit bigger than 1/4" with one of the large breast drills, but it's work. Multi speed is useful there too - North Bros 1555 or a Miller Falls 97.



Imagine what a company would charge for something as complex as a 5 speed drill these days.

Forgive me for nit-picking Gary, I just want to clarify a couple things for those uninitiated to the wild and wonderful world of hand drills:rolleyes:.

I agree that a breast drill will drill holes larger than 1/4" without a problem, and that is a good point. I was refering to Hand Drills in the stricktest sense of the term. You make a good point about the two speed Millers Falls 98 (not 97). I have the MF 1980 which is essentially the same but with a ratchet. These are interesting drills. In size an shape they realy span the gap between Breast drills and Hand drills.

You mention the cost of producing a 5 speed drill today. I don't know of any 5 speed drill ever produced. Are you refering to the 5 position selector on the North Bros 1555? If so that selector only effects the relationship between the direction of drive gear and the direction of chuck rotation, and the ratchet mechnism. My 1550 is a single speed with this feature. Is the 1555 a two speed?

It is funny you mention the cost of producing a drill such as the 1555 today. I have wondered the same thing, especially if they reproduced the quality and other features of this great drill. I suspect we are talking in Hundreds of dollars if made in the USA. ($3.95 if made in China, but a two day life span). ;)

[Gary Herrmann]

Good clarifications, Dan.

Both the NB 1555 and the MF 97 would be 2 speed drills with 5 positions to select from on the selector.

[James Owen]

Another source for nice-quality, reasonably-priced egg beaters, braces, bits, (and other antique tools) is Jon Zimmers in Portland Oregon.

He was one of the first antique tool dealers on the net.

I've bought a number of tools, including braces and brace bits, from him, and have always been more than satisfied with both the price and the quality.

(No affiliation with the business, just a very satisfied repeat customer.)

[Jonathan McCullough]

Did you actually pay just $6. as shown on the crank handle?

Noooo. I never pay retail, and it's much rougher than it looks in the photograph. The nickel plating is so bad I couldn't see the "No. 921-8" on it. Sorry. I've never seen a 921; doesn't seem like it should be all that unusual, but I've honestly never seen one. Not a collector though, so, not always sure what to look for.