Oneida Mini Gorilla Cyclone Dust Collection

[Jeff Biss]

I am getting ready to purchase a new dust collector. I think that I am leaning towards a cyclone dust collector namely the Oneida Mini Gorilla. I have a fairly small basement shop (approximately 12X15X7ft (drop ceiling) and the portablity would be nice. I intend to use it primarily to collect lathe dust, but would also be using it to occasionally hook up to small table saw, 14 in bandsaw, 12 portable planer as I use them. I have been overwhelmed by all of the information regarding cyclones, cannister and bag systems. I am wondering if the Mini-Gorilla is going to be powerful enough for my application? Are cyclones that much better? Are cyclones that much safer in terms of human health and dust collection? Considering the expense, would I be better of buying the Powermatic 1300 that is on sale now? Or is the grizzly portable cyclone worth looking at? I guess that I really want to make sure that the Mini-G is going to perform well enough given the cost. Please feel free to offer your input.

[Adam Slutsky]

Jeff:

I have a similar sized shopt 13x18x7 and (after much deliberation) went with a 2hp super dust gorilla from Ondeida. Before that I had been using a shop vac with an Oneida Dust Deputy. I bought the larger system from them since I was really impressed with the little dust deputy. I'm glad I have it since my shop is also in the basement and I really need to contain the dust from getting into the rest of the house. However, it is probably overkill and I could have done with a portable dust collector like the one you are considering. It is convenient to have all the machines hooked up to the dust collector but the piping is also a lot of work (and cost) to install. Don't forget to purchase an air filter in addition to the dust collector to get the fine dust that inevitably escapes.

[Mike Archambeau]

Are cyclones better? You bet they are! By taking out the dust before the air hits the filter, the collector just keeps on doing its job. I went with the V3000 with Hepa filter. Now working dust free and lovin every minute of it. Oneida builds a great product. Just be sure to get one big enough to handle the job. With a small shop you can put the collector close to all your machines, so even if you move the hose from machine to machine and you switch tasks, it is no problem. You can set a V3000 stationary, but centrally located, and reach all your machines with a flex hose, one at a time. That way you dont have to move the collector, just the hose.

[Thom Sturgill]

I don't own either system, but from their sites -

The Oneida does not include the stand and is has 5" hose. It is made in America with a Baldor motor.

The grizzly G0703 includes a frame that has rollers and can handle 6" pipe but has a 5" reducer (only needed if used at 110v and results in breaker tripping at startup). It also includes a waste drum and larger filter allowing for more airflow - (770cfm vs 600cfm if you believe their measurements). It also includes a remote control and is quieter (65db vs 76db). Made in Taiwan.

Both can be wired for 220v. but come wired for 110v.

I know which one I'll go for.

[Jeff Hamilton Jr.]

I don't own either system, but from their sites -

The Oneida ... is made in America with a Baldor motor.

The grizzly G0703 includes a frame that has rollers and can handle 6" pipe but has a 5" reducer ... It also includes a waste drum and larger filter allowing for more airflow - (770cfm vs 600cfm if you believe their measurements). It also includes a remote control and is quieter (65db vs 76db). Made in Taiwan.

Both can be wired for 220v. but come wired for 110v.

I know which one I'll go for.

Ok, you've piqued my curiosity . . . by your description it's a no-brainer unless you're wedded to "American-made." Which are you "going for?"

[Thom Sturgill]

American made is a strong argument, but not strong enough I'm afraid. The Griz unit seems to have too many plusses in my mind.

This is a new unit and I had not seen it before. I would also want to compare it to the JDS units, but it looks to have the most 'complete' cyclone shape, with a cylindrical impeller space. The Oneida is completely conical which means a conical impeller cutting down on its surface area and thus its effective size, while the JDS unit seems to have a truncated cone (or even a straight body depending on model.) That would seem to affect the separation.

[Jeff Biss]

Thanks for the replies and advice. I went with the mini-gorilla and am very happy so far.

[Larry Whitlow]

Jeff, I am looking to take the plunge. My main concern and use would be handling fine dust while sanding on the lathe. If you don't mind my asking, how does the mini gorilla do with fine dust? Does the cyclone keep a fair amount of it out of the filter? Also, can you tell me about the sound level? I read the spec's but don't know what 75 or 76DB means. Kind of dumb of me to ask, but to put it in perspective, could you carry on a normal conversation when it is running? Would you say it is louder than a washing machine?

Thanks

[Jeff Biss]

It is too early for me to tell you about the fine dust. But my preliminary work would indicate that fine dust should not be a problem at all based on what I am seeing in the collection drum. I would be happy to post a reply when I have used it enough to tell. Regarding the sound, it is quiet enough to carry on a conversation or listen to the radio. I replaced my 1HP portable single stage dust collector with the Mini-Gorilla. The Mini Gorilla is a bit louder than that, but it is a low noise totally unlike the high-pitch that a shop-vac makes. I have been very happy so far. Definately compare to the V Series to if you don't need the portablility that the Mini-G offers.

[Larry Whitlow]

Jeff, thanks for the feedback. Much appreciated.

Larry

[Jim Becker]

Be sure when you are comparing dust collection options you are looking at actual fan curves, not marketing materials.

[Alan Schaffter]

Be sure when you are comparing dust collection options you are looking at actual fan curves, not marketing materials.

What fan curves?

[Van Huskey]

There is a huge frustration in trying to find fan curves.

[Alan Schaffter]

There is a huge frustration in trying to find fan curves.

That is so true, and can you believe the ones you see? Are they all derived the same way? There appears to be no standard.

[Rod Sheridan]

Alan, the only experience I have is with 2 different Oneida cyclones, and they measured within 3% of calculated value once installed.

Regards, Rod.

[Alan Schaffter]

Alan, the only experience I have is with 2 different Oneida cyclones, and they measured within 3% of calculated value once installed.

Regards, Rod.

But where are the fan curves for Grizzly, JDS, Harbor Freight, etc. etc.?

[Rod Sheridan]

But where are the fan curves for Grizzly, JDS, Harbor Freight, etc. etc.?

Ah, now I see your point Alan, I thought you were indicating that the published curves weren't accurate.

As you're well aware, there's no point buying a fan without a fan curve, or a dust collector without a curve for the entire assembly, including filters.

Maybe some products have poor performance curves and don't want to publish them?

Of course anyone who buys a dust collector without a fan curve has no method of calculating whether that unit would work for their application, and is effect buying "a pig in a poke".

regards, Rod.

[Alan Schaffter]

Ah, now I see your point Alan, I thought you were indicating that the published curves weren't accurate.

As you're well aware, there's no point buying a fan without a fan curve, or a dust collector without a curve for the entire assembly, including filters.

I wouldn't go nearly that far. I would certainly look at the hp and diameter of the impeller, type of filter, inlet restricters, etc. Regardless of various claims, most material handling blowers with backward inclined impellers, like used on 99% of all dust collectors, of the same hp and diameter impeller will have nearly identical fan curves. But, two, nearly identically configured 3 hp units, one with a 12" diameter fan and one with a 14" fan will have different fan curves. Similarly, two blowers with 12" impellers, one with a 2 hp motor and the other with a 3 hp motor, will have fan curves that are more alike than I think most people realize.


Of course anyone who buys a dust collector without a fan curve has no method of calculating whether that unit would work for their application, and is in effect buying "a pig in a poke".

regards, Rod.

Again, my previous comment still holds. Even if you had fan curves, you must be sure that they were derived the same way, e.g. both using the same SP resistance on the intake and outlet. I don't think there is an industry standard. You MUST have intake resistance on the blower or you will pop the breaker. I believe some manufacturers do their testing with 10' of pipe on the inlet, but the diameter is likely different for different systems. Also, judging by numerous threads here and other forums, few folks are actually using a fan curve and ductwork SP tables, to compute CFM and SP in their system and comparing that to the numbers recommended for various woodworking machines. If they did, they might get a different DC and/or do a much better job on ductwork design and machine ports.

And I am not saying published fan curves are or are not accurate. Everyone should realize they all are "the best possible" as determined by the manufacturer and are often footnoted as to the effects of different filters, etc. Kinda like the footnotes for diet other self improvement product advertising- "results not typical" "results may vary", etc.

[Ted Harris]

I am getting ready to purchase a new dust collector. I think that I am leaning towards a cyclone dust collector namely the Oneida Mini Gorilla. I have a fairly small basement shop (approximately 12X15X7ft (drop ceiling) and the portablity would be nice. I intend to use it primarily to collect lathe dust, but would also be using it to occasionally hook up to small table saw, 14 in bandsaw, 12 portable planer as I use them. I have been overwhelmed by all of the information regarding cyclones, cannister and bag systems. I am wondering if the Mini-Gorilla is going to be powerful enough for my application? Are cyclones that much better? Are cyclones that much safer in terms of human health and dust collection? Considering the expense, would I be better of buying the Powermatic 1300 that is on sale now? Or is the grizzly portable cyclone worth looking at? I guess that I really want to make sure that the Mini-G is going to perform well enough given the cost. Please feel free to offer your input.
Everything you ever wanted to know and more about dust collection...
http://billpentz.com//woodworking/cyclone/index.cfm
I selected the Clearvue max combo for my shop! What an incredible system! The website is...
http://www.clearvuecyclones.com/
I would suggest you learn as much as possible about DC...there is a serious science to it!

[Ted Harris]

But where are the fan curves for Grizzly, JDS, Harbor Freight, etc. etc.?
Fan curves for different sizes are here...
http://billpentz.com//woodworking/cyclone/measurement.cfm

[Alan Schaffter]

Fan curves for different sizes are here...
http://billpentz.com//woodworking/cyclone/measurement.cfm

Bill's site is a great place to start and his Hobbyist Fan Tables, and a woodworker's proposed/existing duct SP computations will help identify what size system he needs, but remember it wasn't too long ago that there was a bit of stretching the truth on DC motor hp. Not as much today, but I would bet the 2 hp HF DC is closer to 1.0 - 1.5 hp. You still must make sure the blowers are similar. Though most blowers use a backward inclined impeller, I have seen some that have flat or narrow blades, large center openings, large blade tip-housing gap, etc. all which affect the fan curve.

[Thomas Walker]

The grizzly G0703 is quieter (65db vs 76db). .



According to the Grizzly spec sheet the sound rating for the 703 is 83 db (not 65).


p.s. I realize this is an old post, but I want to correct it since I came across this point while researching portable cyclones.

[Ole Anderson]

And to add some more info if someone runs across this thread, American Woodworker ran some fan curves last year on portable cyclones. Here is a link to some of the data, there must be more in the mag to ID the models tested:
http://americanwoodworker.com/blogs/tools/archive/2010/10/25/tool-test-portable-cyclone-dust-collector-testing.aspx

Also they ran fan curves in 2006 on cyclones, but my link quit working.

[Maurice Ungaro]

Be sure when you are comparing dust collection options you are looking at actual fan curves, not marketing materials.
I don't own either system, but from their sites -The Oneida does not include the stand and is has 5" hose. It is made in America with a Baldor motor.The grizzly G0703 includes a frame that has rollers and can handle 6" pipe but has a 5" reducer (only needed if used at 110v and results in breaker tripping at startup). It also includes a waste drum and larger filter allowing for more airflow - (770cfm vs 600cfm if you believe their measurements). It also includes a remote control and is quieter (65db vs 76db). Made in Taiwan.Both can be wired for 220v. but come wired for 110v. I know which one I'll go for.Well Thom, I guess you'll save about $250. Haven't done all the shipping math, etc., but if you wan to know why this country is sucking wind, it's because everyone wants the most they can get for the cheapest they can spend. It's another version of WINIFM (What's In It For Me).

[Phil Maddox]

I just installed 4 of the Oneidas in a couple of high school woodshops and they work great! Perfect to move from tool to tool, captures more than I thought - improves air quality. I've had too many problems with off-shore electric motors - some last forvever, some are garbage soon after they are started - too hit or miss for me.

Cyclones are the ONLY way to go. Until you use one and see how much better the airflow remains because your filter isn't clogged, it is hard to believe - I'll never use a single stage again - in fact I just put a dust deputy on my shop vac with the same great results.

I personally think the Oneida quality is much better and their knowledge is better than the other off-shore models - and I like buying American when I can. I do own a 3hp SDG from them so I am not bias free.

Good luck.