New Veritas Vise

[Ben West]

I'm in the beginning stages (lumber milling and dimensioning) of a Roubo build, and have been debating what end vise to install. I first decided on a Benchcrafted wagon vise, then changed my mind and decided on a Veritas twin screw.

Now, the decision is made. Behold the Veritas Quick-Release Sliding Tail Vise.

http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/page.aspx?p=65746&cat=51&ap=1

For a video:
http://blog.woodworking-magazine.com/blog/Video+Veritas+Quickrelease+Sliding+Tail+Vise.aspx

[Eric DeSilva]

I'm no mechanical engineer, but I think I would stick with the benchcrafted vise. The idea of the jaw being off-center to the screw just seems... more prone to racking or something.

[Matt Radtke]

I'm very interested in the fast-acting tail vise as well. My only though/question about it is how robust the sliding section is.

With the BenchCrafted, you can clamp and chisel your dovetails right on the vise chop without risk to the vise (as shown in the YouTube video). Can the Veritas stand up to that? If so, I have another option when I upgrade my wagon vise.

[Chris Friesen]

With the BenchCrafted, you can clamp and chisel your dovetails right on the vise chop without risk to the vise (as shown in the YouTube video). Can the Veritas stand up to that?

Unless you've got a seriously thick bench top it's more efficient to chop dovetails directly over a leg--in that scenario you wouldn't be right on the vise chop anyways.

[Matt Radtke]

Anyone building a Roubo-ish bench has a seriously thick top. Mine is just over 3" and I can chop anywhere.

Specifically, I speak of: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=awLNuslxud0 at about 3:55.

I don't chop my dovetails on my wagon vise, but I like not worrying about where I chop, pound, or play rough with my bench. Right over the chop? Who cares?! Is the Veritas vise similarly strong? That's what I'm wondering.

[Jim Kirkpatrick]

+1 on sticking with the Benchcrafted vise.
EDIT, I just watched the video and I still think the Benchcrafted is the way to go. Near the end of the video, Chris says it "takes a turn or 2" to fully close it. When you are working with multiple sticks of the same size, a "turn or 2" gets old real fast. The Benchcrafted vise takes no more than an 1/8 of a turn to go the same distance.
So really, the only reasons to go Veritas is you save a little bit of money and ease of install. You're presumably building a bench that will last generations so in the grand scheme of things, whats a few more hours on the install?

[Tri Hoang]

I normally love Veritas innovations. However, there's something about this vise that prevent me from being too enthusiastic about it. It does not look as stout as the Benchcrafted/LN offerings. Can sagging still be possible? The vise travel distance is on the short side as well.

It seems to be designed to ease the installation on new/existing benches. I like the nice quick release function via a separate lever.

+1 on Benchcrafted wagon vise.

[Matt Radtke]

It does not look as stout as the Benchcrafted/LN offerings. Can sagging still be possible?


That's a better way of asking what I was asking.



The vise travel distance is on the short side as well.


I don't think that should be a problem for a tail vise, especially if you have 3-4 dog holes on the vise itself. IMHO, if any board can be clamped between any two contiguous dog holes, using the same hole on the vise, you have sufficient travel.

[Tri Hoang]

I don't think that should be a problem for a tail vise, especially if you have 3-4 dog holes on the vise itself. IMHO, if any board can be clamped between any two contiguous dog holes, using the same hole on the vise, you have sufficient travel.

I agree that there's no problem with dog holes here. I'm talking about clamping in the vertical direction.

[Chris Friesen]

Can sagging still be possible? The vise travel distance is on the short side as well.

In order for this to sag either you'd have to pull screws/bolts out of the wood, bend the metal or else wear down the guide bars or guides.

As for travel, this is a tail vise--it's normally opened as little as possible in order to provide as much support as possible for the piece being clamped. Typically you'd have multiple dog holes in the moving block, so you only ever have to open it as far as the space between holes.

[Matt Radtke]

I agree that there's no problem with dog holes here. I'm talking about clamping in the vertical direction.

How big of a piece do you clamp in there? Based on the video from the PWW and the installation instructions, I'd estimate the travel between 10-17 inches. What might you be clamping in there that isn't big enough?

[Tri Hoang]

How big of a piece do you clamp in there? Based on the video from the PWW and the installation instructions, I'd estimate the travel between 10-17 inches. What might you be clamping in there that isn't big enough?

I think the maximum travel is 7-3/4" based on Veritas spec.

[paul cottingham]

for ease of installation on my already built bench, it looks pretty cool.

[Ben West]

Near the end of the video, Chris says it "takes a turn or 2" to fully close it. When you are working with multiple sticks of the same size, a "turn or 2" gets old real fast. The Benchcrafted vise takes no more than an 1/8 of a turn to go the same distance.


That "turn or 2" that C.S. mentions is after sliding the chop up and re-engaging the threads. Once you got started planing multiple pieces of wood of the same dimension, it should operate very similar to the Benchcrafted vise. That is, back off a quarter turn or so, switch stock, re-tighten with a quarter turn or so, and back to work.

I see a few advantages over the Benchcrafted vise:

1) The sliding function is very nice and will, IMHO, save time.
2) The design of this vise allows positioning the dog holes right at the edge of the bench.
3) It is very easy to install and should fit almost any bench configuration.
4) It is cheaper.


Is it as strong as the Benchcrafted? I have no idea. Maybe, maybe not. The better question is "Is it strong enough to fit my needs?" To that question, I can say almost certainly yes. I'm looking primarily for a vise to hold boards and panels while planing, and that takes very little pressure. I don't ever see myself cranking down on this vise, so concerns about racking, robustness, etc., aren't really a concern for me. It appears more robust than I'll need.

The Benchcrafted vise is clearly a top-notch product, but this appears, to me, to be a very good alternative.

[Matt Radtke]

I think the maximum travel is 7-3/4" based on Veritas spec.

I stand corrected. But still: how much clamping do you do between the jaw and your bench?

[David Weaver]

I normally love Veritas innovations. However, there's something about this vise that prevent me from being too enthusiastic about it. It does not look as stout as the Benchcrafted/LN offerings. Can sagging still be possible? The vise travel distance is on the short side as well.

It seems to be designed to ease the installation on new/existing benches. I like the nice quick release function via a separate lever.

+1 on Benchcrafted wagon vise.

It's probably nearing $100 less when you factor in shipping.

Both are nicer than any vise I have by far, and nicer than I'm likely to have in the near future.

This is certainly the gilded age of vises. I wonder why everyone is in such a hurry to slam their vises open and shut and have such herculean grip. what's being done on the benches? My bench is relatively cheap, light enough that it's butted against another heavier machinist bench to avoid movement and I still never feel like I'm spending too much time opening and closing the vises. Most of the holding problems that I have won't wouldn't be solved by most of the vises ,anyway, and I find myself on the next bench over a lot with soft jaws on a machinist vise.

Should their be someone on this board with a nice heavy bench plain old european style vises, who lives anywhere close to western PA, and who wants to sell their old cast-off bench with slow vises (especially if you have a traditional tail vise) to get a new whiz banger bench with $800 worth of vises on it, let me know first!

On the same note, if someone has a threading/tapping pair in the 1 1/2 inch range, I'll take that off your hands, too.

Sorry to be cheap :o I should be embarrassed with how much I've spent elsewhere, but I have no shame.

[george wilson]

The tail vise only needs to open somewhat farther than the distance between the bench dogs. If the dogs are 6" apart,the vise more than ensures that wood of any length that the bench can hold will be clampable.(is that a word?)

[Rob Lee]

Hi -

A few comments about strength.... we blew apart a few benchtops testing this vise... the wood will fail before the vise parts will. I can't imagine making this vise fail in any rational application.

Any vise has has advantages, and disadvantages, be it functionality, price, ease of installation, and so on... this vise not only extends the range of choices available to people building a new bench - it can be straightforward to retrofit to existing benches. It's another good choice among many.

As far as clamping distance goes - that's a different thing from vise travel with a tail vise. Really - you can make wooden jaws to slip ofev the dogs on any tail vise - and, the same for the dogs in the skirt, to yield a clamping distance as wide as your bench. If you wanted to - you could make the skirt ahead of the vise removeable in fixed increments, or even more radical - have the skirt slide.

Cheers -

Rob

[Chris Padilla]

A few comments about strength.... we blew apart a few benchtops testing this vise... the wood will fail before the vise parts will.

Poor wood! Glue and this bench vise are stronger! :D

"The wood will fail before the glue!"

Looks like another nice product from Veritas.

[Wes Grass]

It's on display here in Atlanta. Sorry to say I didn't look at it closely. End pieces looked like die castings to me (which they are), which was the first turnoff (a personal thing).

Looking at the website, my first impression is that because it works by extending the jaw on a pair of rods it will flex more than a conventional tail vise when extended. And the rods aren't all that big IIRC. Maybe not that big a deal as the front one gets shorter as it's opened.

I also prefer the handwheel of the Benchcrafted vise to a floppy handle. Never used one (Benchcrafted) actually, but I've hated sliding handles since birth I think.

[Bob Jones]

I built a Roubo recently and took alot of time to build a wagon vise from scratch. It works fine, but I find that I am using clamps and battens ALL the time. Read about it in Chris S. book - he actually recommends it. Holdfasts and battens are cheap...

[george wilson]

The Tucker vise had die cast parts. lee Valley said the die cast alloy was stronger than cast iron. Has anyone heard of a Tucker vise breaking?

[David Weaver]

How many people have broken a vise to begin with? I've made the one on my cheap bench "tired", but it's just one of the junky sjobergs nordic benches, anyway, and it's light weight.

I hope I didn't come across too wrong in the prior post, I'd love to have the veritas vise - it looks a lot easier to install than most vises, which would count for a lot in my book, because working on benches and fixtures instead of tools or projects is not much fun, it's more of an obligation it seems unless you're into that sort of thing.

[Chris Padilla]

I dunno, David, my wife claims that I like to make stuff for my shop and collect tools versus using them for anything practical on the rest of the house.... :D

[Bill Rusnak]

Just wondering if anyone has bought this vise and can give some feedback?

Thanks, Bill