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Matt Armstrong
08-17-2010, 6:21 PM
Hey hey - this has been a long time coming. I've been working on designing and building this one for some time. It's 90% complete (just needs paint and some wire looms, which I probably will never get) and in full production now, so I figured pics are worth showing. I built this drum sander with 3 reasons in mind:

1) I was sick of using a ROS or even a belt sander to sand my end-grain cutting boards
2) I needed to get consistent thicknesses on cabinet doors, face-frames, etc that I couldn't achieve with hand sanding (this required a WIDE machine)
3) I don't really have a planer to speak of.

The 3rd will probably generate the most controversy, but my design allows me to bite into about 0.040-0.050 inches of wood with each pass without burning the paper. The primary ways I accomplish this is through a lot of power, a variable speed DC gear motor which allows me to creep the wood under the drum at a fixed rate, a large sanding drum to provide more abrasive surface area, and dust collection that prevents material from adhering to the drum. Although I still am considering buying a new lunchbox planer just to save some time / effort, I can feed through 4 or 5 boards at a time. The capacity makes up for the slower speed of sanding something down to size, and I am running out of room in the garage already.

Anyway, the basic design is an 8" single drum suspended over a granite countertop. I went with a slab of granite that was broken in half at the local home store and talked the manager into letting it go for $20. I then chucked up a diamond wheel in my trusty 4.5" angle grinder, clamped a steel straight edge to the granite where I wanted to cut it, ran the hose on it, and cut away. This was probably horribly unsafe, but it worked just fine for me. The granite then sits on a grid of 1.25"x1.25"x.1875" steel square tubing that was welded and ground (relatively) flat.

The table itself is supported in the center by 2 12v scissor jacks for motorized lift/lowering. I get about 10" of travel, which allows me to throw larger things on the table (such as a completed drawer box, for example) and sand the edges all flush for edge banding or whatever. The table moves on 4 linear bearing rails (like you'd find in a CNC machine) to allow for very smooth adjustments up and down. In the end, I think a chained system with lead screws would have been better, even with a hand crank instead of a motorized lift mechanism, but if I ever built a second version, I'd design those in from the start. Anyway, this doesn't have any specific disadvantages over a geared lead screw system, it's just more expensive for no good reason. I designed in two digital readouts for the height so I can see where the table is relative to a previous sanding run. While one could get away with only one of them, they were relatively cheap and this allows me to see if the table is raising linearly or whether some microadjustments are needed to bring it into the same plane as the drum.

The conveyer is a large sanding belt powered by a bodine DC gearmotor hooked up to a minarik speed controller. It can move the wood anywhere from 0-20fpm. I frequently use intermediate speeds, depending on how much material I'm sanding off. The quick speed is nice because it allows me to just lightly scuff sand multiple boards in rapid succession. The slow speed is obviously nice because I can leave the table at a fixed distance from the drum and hog off more material by simply feeding the workpiece at a crawl. The belt has tracking adjustments welded to the non-drive side which are simply bolts that tension each side of the shaft. The mounting plates were CNC'd from aluminum to ensure a precise system.

The frame itself was built with recycled steel. I learned to weld on this thing, but my brother in law graciously welded most of the critical components since my welds were "too ugly" he said. The wheels are locking casters and definitely undersized now that I've added all the steel and granite. They work but I wouldn't off-road with it.

The drum is a 1.25" precision shaft. NOTE: if you're thinking of building your own drum sander, don't skimp on this part. A round rod will NOT be precise enough to minimize vibration. Get a precision ground rod. If you watch other videos on the internet of home-made drum sanders, a lot of the chattering noises are coming from the out-of-roundness of the drum, which even if you correct through truing the drum, you still have a weight imbalance that imparts vibration into the system). The MDF discs (over 50 of them) were cut with a router (ugh) and epoxied onto the shaft. The drum was then trued by simply raising the moving conveyer belt under the drum before applying the hook side of the velcro material. The drum was shellac'd to provide better adhesion of the hook side of the velcro material, then spirally wrapped with 120 grit paper.

The dust "hood" is designed to maximize air velocity through the various entry points. It was made with acrylic (plexiglas) that was glued together. A scoop on the back comes within a few mils of the drum itself to ensure that all air is pulled from the front side of the drum. It rotates on an axis through the use of a round stainless steel shaft and a piece of DOM tubing welded to the top of the frame. It is easily removed to gain access to the drum bearing mounting plates or the drum itself.

The pressure rollers are indispensable. I got these for $3 each at a local metal recycler. They are conveyor rollers (ironically) and are held in place by a piece of 1/2" tube welded to a tab. They can be adjusted and they hold the material onto the granite as it passes under the drum. I am thinking of adding a few more on the infeed and outfeed sides. Snipe is non-existent, but I'm sure misalignment might introduce it into the system if I'm not careful. My hope is that more pressure rollers will prevent this.

The motor is a 6.5 HP compressor duty motor. I picked it up at the tractor supply house for just under $200. I was a little suspicious of the power rating but the ammeter confirms (assuming a reasonable efficiency) of up to 25 amp current draw at 220v when under full load. Even if it's only 4 or 5 hp, it does the trick. I don't run the sander long enough to need a continuous duty motor, or a TEFC. I originally was going to use a 2hp taiwanese dust collector motor and I'm glad I didn't. It takes a LOT of power to thickness sand, so more is better.

The "electronics box" is somewhat of a joke. It's a 6"x6"x0.25"thick, 14" long square tube with 1/4" steel plate welded to the tops and bottom. It weighs, by itself, probably 25 lbs. It sort of tops off the whole design with a ridiculous overkill clamshell opening system, and a shipping container latch designed for aerospace. At any rate, it contains the power supplies, ammeter for determining the load on the motor, potentiometers for controlling the speed of the table's up/down movement as well as the conveyer belt speed, some speed controller boards I soldered up, some switches, and some extraneous touches like power supplies to drive LEDs inside the switches (so I can tell if the motors are on or not).

Anyway, being able to build a full sized raised panel cabinet door or face frame and feed it through is amazing. The dust collection works perfectly when hooked up to a large enough cyclone and the time savings is incredible. I gave it a full commission of work and it didn't even blink. I don't know how I ever lived without it at this point. Oh, and for those wondering, my materials cost was just over $1000. The linear bearings and table lift jacks were almost $400 themselves, though, so I'm still convinced it could be done for cheaper. Either way, it's not an easy undertaking for the non-metal-inclined (though I wouldn't consider myself much of a metal worker). But if the shop-made wooden drum sanders have you thinking you could do better, I would agree. Enjoy.

Matt Armstrong
08-17-2010, 6:23 PM
Some more pics:

Mike Reinholtz
08-17-2010, 6:32 PM
Look fantastic, I've been meaning to get to work on mine but so far haven't gotten any further than collecting parts. How is performance? How did you attach the MDF disks to the shaft? Just use the keyway?

Trace Beard
08-17-2010, 6:33 PM
Very nice, looks like you took your time and didn't skimp on the materials. I like the plexiglass cover, wish my 22-44 had that.

Trace

Dan Friedrichs
08-17-2010, 6:38 PM
Wow!! Very, very cool.

Matt Armstrong
08-17-2010, 7:10 PM
Look fantastic, I've been meaning to get to work on mine but so far haven't gotten any further than collecting parts. How is performance? How did you attach the MDF disks to the shaft? Just use the keyway?

The shaft has no keyway - the pulley is attached by means of a compression bushing and the discs are epoxied onto the shaft and glued to each other.

Matt Logana
08-17-2010, 7:12 PM
Looks nice. Goes with out saying... but dont forget to put a guard over that chain and sprockets... I hate to see someone end up accidently mangled...

I may do one of these eventually.. since I love projects that actually work/do something. Could you post an expense list? If its not too personal of a matter.

mreza Salav
08-17-2010, 7:33 PM
That looks very well built; larger than my home-made one but I see similarities!
It looks very substantial and should weigh a bunch!
You'll enjoy it a lot (as I do) and I enjoyed building it as well.

David Helm
08-17-2010, 7:53 PM
I am seriously impressed. How does the cost (both time and materials) compare with a similar factory made one?

Matt Armstrong
08-17-2010, 8:17 PM
Looks nice. Goes with out saying... but dont forget to put a guard over that chain and sprockets... I hate to see someone end up accidently mangled...

I may do one of these eventually.. since I love projects that actually work/do something. Could you post an expense list? If its not too personal of a matter.
Thanks! I didn't keep great track of expenses, but the motor was about $200, the linear bearings around $270, the shaft around $50, the lift motors around $90, the conveyor motor and controller around $50, the steel was about $0.50 a lb, etc... the belts and pulleys were $50, the conveyor was $50,

Matt Armstrong
08-17-2010, 8:21 PM
I am seriously impressed. How does the cost (both time and materials) compare with a similar factory made one?

Not well, ultimately. I could have secured a job at the gas station, worked about 3 months there on the weekends, quit, and just bought a Grizzly model... and it would have come with a warranty! This is how it goes with tooling though. I learned a lot of skills and design techniques, and it was fun for me. It's not a "way to save money" though.

But, to be fair, I don't see any commercial drum sanders with this large of a drum, and so I do believe mine offers some advantages over even the heavy duty commercial units (though simultaneously some downsides).

Lastly, more than half of the work was in the design and modelling, not the actual construction.

Chris Padilla
08-17-2010, 8:30 PM
Looks nice, Matt. Can I bring my maple benchtop over for leveling?? :D

Matt Armstrong
08-17-2010, 9:26 PM
Looks nice, Matt. Can I bring my maple benchtop over for leveling?? :D

You definitely should! I still need to solicit you for help with my bandsaw, but I've gotten severely sidetracked with finishing the drum sander and building a set of kitchen cabinets for a friend. PM me and let me know a weekend that might work for you and we'll get together

Dave Lehnert
08-17-2010, 9:43 PM
Very impressive.
Looks GREAT!

Chip Lindley
08-17-2010, 9:55 PM
Great job Matt! Well thought out, and well executed! Looks like you went 1st Class all the way. IMO, you still saved over buying a used 36" sander. Plus, you had the fine experience of planning it out and seeing it all come together!

I had the same Idea over 15 years ago, and scrounged up all the parts I needed to make my own 38" drum sander; all except pulling the trigger to order a rough top conveyor belt from Woodmaster in KC. That, and having a piece of 6" I.D. heavy wall steel pipe machined and balanced for the drum were my stumbling blocks. A nice 10hp. Baldor single phase motor even fell into my lap, at a bargain price, to power the contraption.

But alas, this past year, as I was seriously getting ready to weld some steel together and make a trip to my friendly machine shop, a Woodmaster 3820 38" double-drum sander appeared on CL at a bargain basement price! For $1200 I have my dream drum sander, but missed all the fun of putting my own together! Pity!

Matt Logana
08-17-2010, 10:05 PM
You saved a bundle.... but I must ask... how many horses you got in the stable? Grizzlys have about 10 horses for that size... So.. I assume you run the same? I appologize if you posted it... I may have missed it...

Matt Armstrong
08-18-2010, 1:35 AM
Great job Matt! Well thought out, and well executed! Looks like you went 1st Class all the way. IMO, you still saved over buying a used 36" sander. Plus, you had the fine experience of planning it out and seeing it all come together!

I had the same Idea over 15 years ago, and scrounged up all the parts I needed to make my own 38" drum sander; all except pulling the trigger to order a rough top conveyor belt from Woodmaster in KC. That, and having a piece of 6" I.D. heavy wall steel pipe machined and balanced for the drum were my stumbling blocks. A nice 10hp. Baldor single phase motor even fell into my lap, at a bargain price, to power the contraption.

But alas, this past year, as I was seriously getting ready to weld some steel together and make a trip to my friendly machine shop, a Woodmaster 3820 38" double-drum sander appeared on CL at a bargain basement price! For $1200 I have my dream drum sander, but missed all the fun of putting my own together! Pity!
I wish i had a 10hp baldor :( I don't blame you for pulling the trigger when you did... sounds nice to have a dual drum sander

Matt Armstrong
08-18-2010, 1:36 AM
You saved a bundle.... but I must ask... how many horses you got in the stable? Grizzlys have about 10 horses for that size... So.. I assume you run the same? I appologize if you posted it... I may have missed it...
6.5 - but probably a few less. More would still be nice but the price goes up quick for more...

Matt Logana
08-18-2010, 1:54 AM
6.5 - but probably a few less. More would still be nice but the price goes up quick for more...

Ha... dont all tools seem to go up expedentially as you get into the higher numbers... :D

David Nelson1
08-18-2010, 4:17 AM
Great job Matt, I don't think I could have waited as long as it looks like it took to complete this project. Not to mention outstanding job of the electrical engineering portion for the controls. Did ya save any money doing it yourself?.

I once built a self propelled stump grinder using design techniques from various manufacturers and improving on them. Saved a bit of money but my machine was close to infallible and could get in and out of smaller jobs that the larger machines had no access to, which equated to MO money for me!:D

Todd Hoppe
08-18-2010, 8:27 AM
Simply amazing!

Paul Johnstone
08-18-2010, 9:33 AM
Wow, what a work of art.. Great work Matt. Thanks for taking the time to write it up.. I am truly in awe of that.

george wilson
08-18-2010, 10:18 AM
That looks great! The only concern I might have is dust getting into those linear bearings for elevation. I am using them myself on a carving duplicator I have been making. They do have those little "squeegee" seals. Hopefully those will keep the dust out of them. It would help if you can develop a good dust hood and lots of suction to keep fine dust away from them. My Delta 18"-36" hood does an excellent job. The regular "thickness planer" type drum sanders I had never did do much of a job at getting dust,even though hooked up to a large commercial dust collector.

Have fun with your new machine!! It is always nice to build your own.

Matt Armstrong
08-18-2010, 11:16 AM
That looks great! The only concern I might have is dust getting into those linear bearings for elevation. I am using them myself on a carving duplicator I have been making. They do have those little "squeegee" seals. Hopefully those will keep the dust out of them. It would help if you can develop a good dust hood and lots of suction to keep fine dust away from them. My Delta 18"-36" hood does an excellent job. The regular "thickness planer" type drum sanders I had never did do much of a job at getting dust,even though hooked up to a large commercial dust collector.

Have fun with your new machine!! It is always nice to build your own.

A big thanks to everyone for their compliments so far!

George,

I've had the same concern about the linear bearings and dust, but I've been pretty sloppy near them and they are holding up excellently. They are the sealed type, like you mentioned.

In some of the later pics you can see the dust collection hood. I can't even smell the wood when the cyclone is running on it. Works like a charm.

Don Selke
08-18-2010, 2:07 PM
Just one word Matt: Excillent!!:):):)

Van Huskey
08-18-2010, 3:14 PM
Great job! Not being a metal working kinda guy I am always more impressed with this type of project than anything I see in wood!

Sam Layton
08-18-2010, 8:02 PM
Matt,

That is not a home-made drum sander, it is a Custom Made drum Sander.

Great job, I am very impressed. I have a Performax drum Sander. Your design is far better than Performax in my opinion.

Great job, Sam

Justin Bukoski
08-18-2010, 11:30 PM
Awesome Matt. I'm really impressed/jealous!!

Matt Armstrong
08-19-2010, 12:02 AM
Thanks everyone! Now to design some drawers on it to add more storage...

Mitchell Andrus
08-19-2010, 8:15 AM
I would consider a two or three belt pulley to drive the drum. Also, your sandpaper wraps are going to be expensive. As soon as you see a dark stripe on the wood's surface you'll want to lower the bed in a hurry to avoid burning through the paper. This can happen quite quickly if you are sanding a glue-up. How fast do the power jacks work and is the control handy to the infeed and outfeed sides?

The surface of drum is going to get HOT if you didn't ventilate it. I'm assuming a solid block of MDF holds heat quite well. I'm thinking you're going to cook the shellac then over-heat the adhesive on the back of the paper. Version 2... perhaps a hollow steel or aluminum drum to dissipate heat - and paper clamps at the ends of the drum to eliminate the need for velcro.

Assuming the lifts don't have stepper motors or servos, is there a way to tie the lift's drive screws together, or lift with just one jack? If one is a little slow going up and/or the other is a little slow coming down it won't take long (a 20th of a turn per adjustment) for these guys to be a full turn or more out of level to each other.

Just random thoughts, I hope you don't mind... but these are the design considerations (plus the ones you've encountered and solved) that makes me continue to use my 25"er and haven't built one myself.

Great job. I wouldn't have the time or patience.
.

Mike Harrison
08-19-2010, 8:40 AM
Wow, REALLY KOOL Matt. Impressive to see a multi disciplined project come off so nicely.

WELL DONE!!

Matt Armstrong
08-19-2010, 12:53 PM
I would consider a two or three belt pulley to drive the drum. Also, your sandpaper wraps are going to be expensive. As soon as you see a dark stripe on the wood's surface you'll want to lower the bed in a hurry to avoid burning through the paper. This can happen quite quickly if you are sanding a glue-up. How fast do the power jacks work and is the control handy to the infeed and outfeed sides?

Hey Mitchell,

I am using a 5/8" ("B") drive belt on the drum. It's sufficient as a single belt, but a dual 1/2" would be better and require less tension. No disagreement there. I was trying to conserve space, but I'd probably do a dual-belt system next time (if there ever is a next time).

As for the sandpaper price, the large surface area of the drum means that less of the overall heat is dissipated into each portion of the sandpaper. I did an entire set of kitchen cabinets (including thicknessing all the material, not just sanding the glue-ups) without any significant trauma to the abrasive material. This is one of the things I will definitely recommend to any DIYer out there - use a large drum! It takes more paper to wrap, but $12-13 of sandpaper now goes a long ways...

As for the jacks themselves, I used a PWM motor circuit to control their speed. At full speed, they move faster than a hand crank would allow me to lift/lower. At minimum speed, I can move the table within a few thousandths. I wouldn't have done it with just an on/off switch.



The surface of drum is going to get HOT if you didn't ventilate it. I'm assuming a solid block of MDF holds heat quite well. I'm thinking you're going to cook the shellac then over-heat the adhesive on the back of the paper. Version 2... perhaps a hollow steel or aluminum drum to dissipate heat - and paper clamps at the ends of the drum to eliminate the need for velcro.


This was a huge design consideration. Actually, given the sheer volume of air moving over the drum, heat hasn't been much of a problem. Finding a large aluminum or steel drum would be expensive (at least one that is balanced and true along a 36" span), and mounting it to a driveshaft wouldn't be a piece of cake either without some precise machining tools that I don't have. The MDF allows for a very true drum (you essentially lathe the drum into a true shape before wrapping it) that is uniform density.

So, precision trumps heat dissipation here. Though I don't disagree that metals are superior for this purpose, adequate ventilation and a large enough surface area keeps the temps down far enough in my experience. Again - larger drum = better overall.




Assuming the lifts don't have stepper motors or servos, is there a way to tie the lift's drive screws together, or lift with just one jack? If one is a little slow going up and/or the other is a little slow coming down it won't take long (a 20th of a turn per adjustment) for these guys to be a full turn or more out of level to each other.

Just random thoughts, I hope you don't mind... but these are the design considerations (plus the ones you've encountered and solved) that makes me continue to use my 25"er and haven't built one myself.

Great job. I wouldn't have the time or patience.
.

So, this was another big concern... but if one jack decides to push faster than the other, then it'll load up first, right? The additional weight then slows it down, allowing the other one to catch up. The system is somewhat auto-correcting by it's nature. In experience, most drum sanding is done within a .100" range (my experience anyway), over which the misalignment is negligible. Nonetheless, I have a way to microadjust each lift jack to bring them back into the same plane if for some reason they get a mind of their own and start misbehaving. Like I said, definitely going with 4 precise leadscrews and a chain (or cogged belt) would be a recommendation of mine. My system works, but it's not ideal and has unnecessary complexities and design considerations (as you've identified).

Thanks!

Simon Dupay
08-19-2010, 3:38 PM
I'am very impressed! thou I would make the drum 12" (the bigger the better) so whats next?, a double drum?, timesaver?:D keep up the good work!

Matt Armstrong
08-19-2010, 5:11 PM
I'am very impressed! thou I would make the drum 12" (the bigger the better) so whats next?, a double drum?, timesaver?:D keep up the good work!

I think this is close to the limits of what a drum sander should do, and considering the performance and price of entry-level wide belt sanders, I'd say more complex than this warrants just buying a manufactured machine.

For what it's worth, I think a single drum setup makes more sense - you have a point of tangency to keep aligned rather than a plane!

David Loewer
08-20-2010, 2:45 PM
Awesome job, Matt! Just the inspiration I need to get going on my own. Just a quick question on the pressure rollers. You mentioned that they are adjustable. I see what appears to be 2 hex bolts securing them to the frame, so is the tab slotted to allow for up and down adjustment? Might you post a picture of this?

I was thinking about using a coil spring with bolt to tension and allow adjustment (similar to your tracking system on the conveyor rollers), for the pressure rollers, but maybe this would introduce snipe.

Thanks.

Matt Armstrong
08-20-2010, 4:52 PM
Awesome job, Matt! Just the inspiration I need to get going on my own. Just a quick question on the pressure rollers. You mentioned that they are adjustable. I see what appears to be 2 hex bolts securing them to the frame, so is the tab slotted to allow for up and down adjustment? Might you post a picture of this?

I was thinking about using a coil spring with bolt to tension and allow adjustment (similar to your tracking system on the conveyor rollers), for the pressure rollers, but maybe this would introduce snipe.

Thanks.

I'd remove them to show pics, but basically the holes are just slightly oversized. Channels would be better, but I didn't have access to a mill, so I just drilled oversized holes. But yes, you have the idea.

brian watts
08-20-2010, 7:03 PM
do you have any video of this running some wood though it??if so could you post it?

Mike Reinholtz
08-23-2010, 4:45 PM
Alright Matt, you got me motivated to get back to work on mine.

What grit sanding belt did you use for the conveyor? I'm thinking 100 grit but wondered what you used and how well it works.

Thanks!

David Loewer
08-23-2010, 10:08 PM
...And I was wondering how easily that conveyor sanding belt is changed if it becomes damaged or no longer provides enough "grip".

David Black
09-28-2010, 11:30 PM
I have been thinking of making a drum sander for awhile now, how has your motor held up? I was wondering if a cheaper motor would be able to handle the load that sanding puts on it, does your motor have a 5/8" shaft. I see a lot of other 5hp range motors have 7/8" shaft on them and thought that there may be problems with the shaft flexing or bending under load?

PS this is my first post, but I've been lurking for sometime.

Chris Padilla
09-29-2010, 4:24 PM
I'll give a free bump to this thread but some of you may wish to PM Matt so he can answer your questions.

Ron Murray1
01-13-2013, 8:30 PM
Hi Matt. Do you have any dementions for the sander? I am going to be in need of a good sized sander in the very near future. At present I have a 36 in. comercial one with a 30 H.P. motor that I must despose of due to a shop location change and no way can I power the big one in the new location.

Harry Hagan
01-14-2013, 10:43 AM
Matt,

That is not a home-made drum sander, it is a Custom Made drum Sander.

Great job, I am very impressed. I have a Performax drum Sander. Your design is far better than Performax in my opinion.

Great job, Sam

To design and fabricate a precision machine that ensures quality, saves time, and increases production output is very impressive. Sounds like it won't take long to pay for itself.