Maintaining 1 Hour Seperation for fire code?

[Nathan Dekens]

Well, I got a question about trying to maintain my 1 Hour seperation in my garage. I have a small attic space in my garage that is not attached to the main attic space. In this attic space I was planing to possibly mount a Dust collector and my air compressor, then penetrate the ceiling of the garage for return air, Dust collection, drain line and air lines. Now I know this will kill my current one hour seperation rating; however I was wondering if I were to get up in the attic and mount some 5/8" gypsum to the attic spaces walls and use the correct fire rated tape to seal off any exposed wall surfaces would that restore my fire rating? Does anyone know if this is allowed in California?

[Lee Koepke]

Not familiar with California codes, and the usual suggestion to either discuss with a building official or architect would be my first comment.

However, typically you can penetrate rated ceilings with a certain size opening without using a fire damper. If your dust collection piping exceeds that amount, you could install a fire damper in the ductwork. Dampers would usually be more cost effective than creating a rated enclosure for your equipment.

Here is a checklist from Palo Alto you could refer to.


http://www.cityofpaloalto.org/civica/filebank/blobdload.asp?BlobID=14017

[Dan Hintz]

You'll also want to fill in any gaps around the pipe with fire-rated foam...

[Sam Layton]

Nathan,

I live in Calif, and just completed a major remodel. My garage is attached to my house. My garage attic, and house attic are separated by a wall. The building code required the wall to be fire rated. I had to install 5/8 drywall, tape the seams, and seal all of the edges to provide the 1 hour fire rating.

By code, your wall that separates the house attic, and garage attic has to be fire rated regardless if you have any penetration in the garage ceiling. This is the code for newer construction. I don't know how long ago that code was put in place. I know it has been several years.

I don't know if code would allow you to install your dust collector and compressor in the attic. Check with your building inspector. However the fire wall in the attic is required in newer construction.

Sam

[Nathan Dekens]

Nathan,

I live in Calif, and just completed a major remodel. My garage is attached to my house. My garage attic, and house attic are separated by a wall. The building code required the wall to be fire rated. I had to install 5/8 drywall, tape the seams, and seal all of the edges to provide the 1 hour fire rating.

Sam

Yes I do know about the wall that separates garage and house attics, but I forgot to mention that my house is 2-story. My garage attic is on the first story and the rest of the attic space is on the second story. Thus my only fire rating for the garage is the ceiling and walls. When I go into the attic space for the garage I can see the studs of my boys rooms, insulation and electrical. It is those walls that I would cover with gypsum and provide an new 1 hour separation at that point rather then the ceiling of the garage.

[Sam Layton]

In your situation, your son's bedroom wall needs to be fire rated. The building inspector said any wall between an attached garage, and the house needs to be fire rated. So, a garage has to be totally isolated, interior garage space, and attic space, from the rest of the house. It does not matter what is on the other side of the garage attic wall.

In my situation, my house is a single story, so my garage attic and house attic are separated by a wall, which has to be fire rated.

Sam

[David Helm]

Sam has it right, and it is not a particularly new rule. You will have to do the fire rated wall in your attic.

[Stephen Cherry]

What if you installed a sprinkler (fire, not lawn) system in the garage? Would this satisfy the code, and the functional requirement?

[David Helm]

No it won't.

[Sam Layton]

I had to install the fire wall, and fire sprinklers...

Sam

[Karl Card]

kind of relating to that here in
Evansville code is written but it is also dependent on which inspector comes to your house... one allows certain things, the other two do on certain days but not on other days just depends on moods... by law we have to get permits for 25 dollars to install a ceiling fan. a remodel requires 10 percent of all supplies for permit fee. To put in a window is a 50 dollar permit fee for each window unless you do them all at the same time.

I did the wiring on my house and had to have it inspected before I could put up drywall, no problem I thought, but then I ran into things like well since you have the drywall not installed yet you will need to have all new smoke detectors that are wired on there own circuit. This is not a written code, the only thing code states about smoke detectors is there must be one in each bedroom, hallway, stairwell, and kitchen... so to me it is not so much about safety as it is poltical authority... After reading about smoke detectors most of the hard wired ones have more issues than the battery operated ones...

[David Helm]

kind of relating to that here in
Evansville code is written but it is also dependent on which inspector comes to your house... one allows certain things, the other two do on certain days but not on other days just depends on moods... by law we have to get permits for 25 dollars to install a ceiling fan. a remodel requires 10 percent of all supplies for permit fee. To put in a window is a 50 dollar permit fee for each window unless you do them all at the same time.

I did the wiring on my house and had to have it inspected before I could put up drywall, no problem I thought, but then I ran into things like well since you have the drywall not installed yet you will need to have all new smoke detectors that are wired on there own circuit. This is not a written code, the only thing code states about smoke detectors is there must be one in each bedroom, hallway, stairwell, and kitchen... so to me it is not so much about safety as it is poltical authority... After reading about smoke detectors most of the hard wired ones have more issues than the battery operated ones...

The reason they want hardwired, all on the same circuit, is so they all go off at the same time. Studies have shown that people will sleep through the sound of one, but not of many. The hardwire is "code" in many jurisdictions. Hardwired SDs also have battery backup.

[Sam Layton]

I also had to hardwire my smoke detectors. One requirement on mine was if the garage smoke detector went off, the master bedroom detector will go off.

I had to have fire sprinklers installed in my shop, because my shop is within 25 feet of my house.

Sam

[Aaron Wingert]

You'll also want to fill in any gaps around the pipe with fire-rated foam...

Fireblocking foam cannot and should not be used for firestopping, as would be the case in this application. Great Stuff fire foam and similar products are only listed for sealing off small holes and gaps within concealed spaces as requried by the fireblocking section of the code. Firestopping is a whole other animal, and addresses penetrations of fire membranes or penetrations of all or part of rated assemblies.

PVC pipe, PEX, PVC conduit and other items penetrating a fire membrane or assembly must be addressed with a variety of intumescent products such as intumescent caulk, intumescent collars, etc. Correct installation of any of these systems is absolutely critical and is something that a good inspector will check in detail.

California is wierd when it comes to their codes. The International Residential Code (which nearly every part of the country uses) does not require a rated wall or ceiling in a garage space. I believe California amended that to toughen the requirement. It simply requires 1/2" rock on all garage walls common to the home or garage walls supporting the structure, and only requires 5/8" on the ceiling if there is habitable space above the garage. Many architects, builders and inspectors incorrectly address this code requirement. R309.2 is the IRC code section. 5/8" everywhere in a garage is better, but the model code does not require it. By the letter of the code, any steel or wood posts or beams in the garage must also be rocked, which is a good idea but a lot of people miss it.

What gets me is that it takes a heck of a lot more than a layer of 5/8" drywall on a wall to make it an actual rated wall in accordance with UL or Gypsum Association standards. One sheet on one side doesn't get it. To be truly a rated assembly, a wall or floor/ceiling must be protected from fire from both sides, not just one side. Rocking one side of a floor/ceiling or wall creates a fire membrane, but not a rated wall. In the average single family home, there is no code requirement for any rated walls, regardless of the plan, unless your home is in very close proximity to a property line or unless you're in California (or another area that has re-written the code).

Nathan, if you place your dust collector in your attic you should be able to maintain your one hour separation if you only penetrate the ceiling with the pipes, properly sealed off with intumescent collars. If you need to remove a lot of rock from the ceiling you'd have to effectively raise the "rated" ceiling up into the attic. Doing so is possible but will be really specific to your home and how it is framed, etc. You probably wouldn't be able to increase the potential for any framing members to get fire exposure by doing the work...Exposing ceiling joists to the open garage would violate the code, etc. Your best bet is to inquire with the City building official and perhaps get a meeting at your house to discuss the idea's feasibility.