Rant: Blade Sharpening vs Buying New

[John Mark Lane]

Sorry, but I just have to vent. Maybe someone will have a helpful suggestion (ha ha, I mean a good suggestion).

So I was in the garage this morning and grabbed a pile of saw blades that had been used to the point that they needed to be swapped out. I have 6 of them here, three 40 tooth and three 60 tooth carbide blades. Delta and Oldham brands on them. They weren't particularly expensive.

I am not aware of any blade sharpening services in my area (NYC suburbs). My guess is it hasn't been the kind of profession that has attracted people lately, and real estate is just too pricey to justify use of the space etc for such a business. I was planning to pack them up and send them to Forrest for sharpening.

So it looks like the 40T blades are $20 to sharpen, the 60T's are $22. That's $126. Return shipping is $9 for the first blade, $1 for each additional. Meaning $141. Plus whatever it costs me to ship to them, which I assume is about the same $15. So, let's just say it's $150 to send these off and get them sharpened.

The approximate equivalent saw blades can be purchased new from Home Despot for $16 to $20 each (the Avanti brand 40T is $16.97, 60T is $19.967).

I guess the partial answer is, it doesn't make sense to use a service like the Forrest service except for high-end blades.

Fine. But what is a regular guy supposed to do with old "non-high-end" blades? Throw them away and just buy a new one? There is something just plain wrong with that. I don't know why or what the solution is, but it's just not right.

[Chris Padilla]

recycle :)

[Rod Sheridan]

Hi John, my take on sharpening is a little different.

I use FS Tools blades, in the $100 plus range.

My 80 tooth TCG is $16 to have them sharpen it on the CNC machines they use to produce the blades.

Regards, Rod.

[Hugh Jardon]

I'm by no means a blade expert, but the Harbor Freight blade sharpener might work for the lower end blades. Here's a positive review.

Here's a positive review. (http://www.hobartwelders.com/weldtalk/showthread.php?t=30331)

It's a low risk option, if you buy one and it doesn't work for you, just go get a refund on it. The worst you will do is ruin a blade that could have been sharpened professionally. If that's a $20 blade, no biggie in my book.

[Prashun Patel]

You need to look harder. You can find sharpeners locally. Check your phone book and inquire at local mills and engine repair shops.

The fuel and packing costs of mail order sharpening are arguably as karmically 'evil' as throwing out a blade.

I'm headed for Hades since I buy Oldham ripping blades precisely because they're disposable after a couple projects.

[Jon van der Linden]

The better blades are worth resharpening. Cheap ones aren't.

There is a difference in what they do, but that also depends on you, your work, and what kind of saw you're using.

[Mike Konobeck]

Here in MN I am Woodworkers Guild member and there is a local place that does sharpening for about $13-14 for a 40 tooth WWII with the discount. They use a CNC machine to do the sharpening and I have been very happy with them. Point is that there should be some resource available to you such as a group like a WW Guild that could help you find someone local. An hour drive may be worth it even.

On a side note, I do believe the carbide in a good blade is thicker and better so you get more use out of a nicer blade. Sharpening a $20 blade is really not worth it but if you can bring a $100 blade back to as good as new (or better) then you have something there. Woodpecker sells the Ridge ones for a reasonable price and they seem nice. Otherwise use a coupon to buy a Forrest from Rockler. Never looked back at the money spent. Makes my contractors saw cut whatever I throw at it.

[Will Overton]

Are you ranting about buying cheap blades or the price of getting good blades sharpened?

Check with your local lumber yard or tool store. They usually deal with a service and that saves you the shipping charge.

[Tom Walz]

Forrest is generally at the top end price wise.

[John Mark Lane]

Thanks for the replies. I do understand that it's a whole different matter when you're talking about an expensive blade. And I don't expect to be buying many more of these cheapo blades. But sometimes the cheapos are what makes sense -- for example, I've been building a fence from PT lumber, including 4 inch posts, and I cut them on my Delta CMS. No point wasting a good blade on a project like that.

Sean -- I wish you were right, but I have looked. The Yellow Pages for the entire region here lists only one saw sharpening service -- in a town that's well over an hour away. I just can't justify -- not one, but two -- drives for that. I'll keep looking, maybe there's a word of mouth place somewhere.

Woodworking guilds? Not aware of any around here. Would be nice. Maybe I should start one (like I have time for that...)...

Edit: Hugh -- thanks for the info on the HF sharpener. Interesting review, I'll have to give that some thought.

[John Nesmith]

You need to look harder. You can find sharpeners locally.

Not me. At least not anyone I would trust to sharpen my WWII and other higher-end blades. My only option is shipping them off.

[Brandon Weiss]

I don't have any blades that warrant sharpening yet, still new to woodworking and trying to do it on a slim to none budget. I've only gone through a few table saw blades but the ones I'm done using I keep. One of these days I'll find a way to make use of them, at this point I'm just keeping them because there's a story behind them. I'm still learning and each blade represents a different stage of my woodworking skill and time spent in the trade. Sounds cheezy but that's what I do with them. One of these days if I get a real shop I'll probably find a way to display them. I won't be doing this with every blade of every tool I have, just the TS blades. Odd, huh?

[Jon van der Linden]

Thanks for the replies. I do understand that it's a whole different matter when you're talking about an expensive blade. And I don't expect to be buying many more of these cheapo blades. But sometimes the cheapos are what makes sense -- for example, I've been building a fence from PT lumber, including 4 inch posts, and I cut them on my Delta CMS. No point wasting a good blade on a project like that.

Sean -- I wish you were right, but I have looked. The Yellow Pages for the entire region here lists only one saw sharpening service -- in a town that's well over an hour away. I just can't justify -- not one, but two -- drives for that. I'll keep looking, maybe there's a word of mouth place somewhere.

Woodworking guilds? Not aware of any around here. Would be nice. Maybe I should start one (like I have time for that...)...

Edit: Hugh -- thanks for the info on the HF sharpener. Interesting review, I'll have to give that some thought.

I wouldn't use treated wood to start with, it's ugly and toxic. Why would I want that on my land when a properly installed non treated post will last just as long? If you're burning out a blade on a few fence posts there's something wrong there too, unless your fence is really really long.

Your point about a lack of local sharpening is common. Most professional shops don't drive their blades around to get them sharpened, that costs money. They send them out just like you would. Shipping is faster and cheaper than driving. Once you're shipping, you can choose the most appropriate service in the country.

Regarding the cost, think about it for a second. Paying a fair price for someone else's work is fair. Just because you can buy a piece of junk for $20 doesn't mean it doesn't cost $20 to properly sharpen that same blade. It was never properly sharpened to start with. There's a lot more to sharpening a saw blade than just setting a grinder on there.

[glenn bradley]

I'm with Chris. Unless those Delta's are something special, they and the Oldham are what I would consider throw-aways. Just to add fuel to the fire; I had never been happy with my Forrest WWII. So many reliable people here raved about them I decided it must have been a lemon and I would have it sharpened and give it another chance (my bad for not dealing with it immediately under warranty).

Long story short, I used it for a thrasher and an MDF cutter till it lost its edge. By the time I get the WWII to Forrest and get it back in my hands it will run me nearly $50. If I watch for a sale I can get a Freud that I already know I like for that or not much more. For now the Forrest is hanging on a nail out of the way.

All that being said I do have a good service close by and have had other blades done there for a reasonable price and I can get there and back on my lunch hour. If not for that I would have a different outlook perhaps(?). I found them by asking a couple cabinet shops where they had their cutters done; I couldn't find them in the phone book till I knew their name(??)

[John Mark Lane]

I wouldn't use treated wood to start with, it's ugly and toxic. Why would I want that on my land when a properly installed non treated post will last just as long? If you're burning out a blade on a few fence posts there's something wrong there too, unless your fence is really really long.

Your point about a lack of local sharpening is common. Most professional shops don't drive their blades around to get them sharpened, that costs money. They send them out just like you would. Shipping is faster and cheaper than driving. Once you're shipping, you can choose the most appropriate service in the country.

Regarding the cost, think about it for a second. Paying a fair price for someone else's work is fair. Just because you can buy a piece of junk for $20 doesn't mean it doesn't cost $20 to properly sharpen that same blade. It was never properly sharpened to start with. There's a lot more to sharpening a saw blade than just setting a grinder on there.

You're welcome to use whatever kind of wood you want on your land. I happen to like PT (and when I made a fence from non-treated wood the termites ate it). Also, just to clarify, I am not "burning out a blade on a few posts". That was merely an example of some of the work I do that doesn't warrant a costly blade, to illustrate why even going forward I might not always limit myself to expensive blades.

I also have no objection to paying people a fair price for their labor. I was not complaining about the price of the sharpening service. I was merely pointing out the dilema one faces when considering what to do with cheaper blades. I hate the throw-away culture we live in for various reasons, including the environmental effects.

Anyway, thanks for your thoughts.

[Neil Brooks]

I tried ... for your area ... what I might try, for mine.

I Googled "sharpening NEAR White Plains, NY"

Results:

Central Mowers Inc.
475 Central Ave # 2, White Plains - (914) 761-3350

AND

http://www.ambrosicutlery.com/aboutus.shtml

Two possible businesses, in your area, who would KNOW where you can go, locally.

Worth two calls, at least ;)

EDIT: Dynamic AND Forrest -- it appears -- are New York (State) based.

[Dick Thomas]

Worst case scenario, you could make a crazy wind chime??? :D:D

[Victor Robinson]

It's the throwaway culture John, as you said. The economics will almost always encourage, reinforce, and propagate throwaway culture. It's usually the environmentally-conscious folks (or the folks who understand there must be a cost somewhere) that are bothered, but the worst part is if your decisions are first and foremost economically-based, as they are for most of us, you'll never be able to do the "right" thing.

[Jon van der Linden]

You're welcome to use whatever kind of wood you want on your land. I happen to like PT (and when I made a fence from non-treated wood the termites ate it). Also, just to clarify, I am not "burning out a blade on a few posts". That was merely an example of some of the work I do that doesn't warrant a costly blade, to illustrate why even going forward I might not always limit myself to expensive blades.

I also have no objection to paying people a fair price for their labor. I was not complaining about the price of the sharpening service. I was merely pointing out the dilema one faces when considering what to do with cheaper blades. I hate the throw-away culture we live in for various reasons, including the environmental effects.

Anyway, thanks for your thoughts.

Some friends that know me well might tell you about one of my "termite killing frenzies" with me chasing after them when they come out to breed. There are plenty of them around here, and those of us with any sense know that there always will be.

Legend in California is that redwood is termite proof or some such thing. I've seen them eat redwood, so I know that's not quite correct. They might not go after old growth heartwood, but the stuff that's available now is a different story. The thing is, most woods once they get some amount of rot going will be a target for insects or beetles.

The basic thing with fence posts is to use a wood that isn't prone to rot and weathers well, like cedar. Using several inches of gravel under the post as well as around it helps drainage a lot and keeps the post from rotting. A concrete cap locks it in place, protects it at ground level and directs water away. Not anything terribly complicated, but I see a lot of contractors mess this up and actually cause problems.

Then you have the people down the street that just replaced their fence which rotted away prematurely because their sprinkler system gives it a good soak every morning. A daily soaking/drying cycle is definitely not good for wood. The contractor that installed the new fence did a horrible job on setting the posts and it will follow the route of the first fence in no time at all.

I agree that you probably won't find me using the sawblade I've reserved for joints or veneer on wood that might have dirt embedded in it, but I probably wouldn't buy a special blade for it either. In fact it would never occur to me, possibly because there aren't cheap blades that will fit my saws. I think my average blade price is about $150, but they don't sell those kinds of blades at home depot either, so my options are more limited than yours.

So perhaps the reason for your recycling/reuse dilemma is really just that you didn't spend enough to be free of it in the first place!

Seriously though, when faced with the question of buying something really really cheap that has other alternatives, I always have to ask myself "who made this and how were they paid for their work?" If the answer is that they weren't paid enough to live at what I consider a minimum standard, then I don't buy the product. I don't like having to consider these kinds of questions when I'm shopping, but I do ask them.

[Nancy Laird]

John Mark, I'm gonna jump in here and suggest that you call some of the cabinet shops or custom carpentry shops, call cabinetmakers, call finish carpenters, and find out who they trust to sharpen their blades...those professionals will know the best sharpeners around and you can them check them out.

As far as buying cheap blades, yes, we are a throwaway society and cheap blades will forever be with us. However, if you want to build decent furniture or make square cabinets, you'll buy a GOOD/expensive blade so it cuts your lumber correctly. You'll throw away money if you use a cheap blade on Brazilian cherry!!

[John Mark Lane]

John Mark, I'm gonna jump in here and suggest that you call some of the cabinet shops or custom carpentry shops, call cabinetmakers, call finish carpenters, and find out who they trust to sharpen their blades...those professionals will know the best sharpeners around and you can them check them out.


Now that's a darn good idea. Why didn't I think of that? It will also give me a good excuse to stop in to a shop I've heard about here that's making some really cool stuff. Thanks!



As far as buying cheap blades, yes, we are a throwaway society and cheap blades will forever be with us. However, if you want to build decent furniture or make square cabinets, you'll buy a GOOD/expensive blade so it cuts your lumber correctly. You'll throw away money if you use a cheap blade on Brazilian cherry!!

Yes, yes, I know. I have said more than once that as between spending more on the saw or spending more on the blade, you may as well opt for the latter. I've got a Craftsman 7 1/4 inch CSMS that I bought because I like it's diminutive size, and I'm getting some blades for it that cost as much as the saw. Good advice! Thanks.

Mark

[Richard M. Wolfe]

Locally in this pretty small town there is a lumberyard that has dealings with a blade sharpening service. Write your name on the blade with a Sharpie and leave it with the yard. The blade service comes around every so often and picks up ones to be sharpened and leaves resharpened blades, so there's no shipping involved.

As far as finding a service, contact people who have blades sharpened and find out who they use. This can be cabinet shops, construction companies, renovators/remodlers, etc. Also check with people who deal with wood - lumberyards, home improvment centers, etc.

As far as finding a good sharpening service you just have to talk to people who have dealt with some to find one who does a good job and for a reasonable price. A good sharpening service can give you a blade that's better than when it came from the store. We are using some Freud thin kerf blades that cost about half the purchase price to sharpen and work very well. The cheapest blades are really not worth having done.

[John Mark Lane]

I tried ... for your area ... what I might try, for mine.

I Googled "sharpening NEAR White Plains, NY"

Results:

Central Mowers Inc.
475 Central Ave # 2, White Plains - (914) 761-3350

AND

http://www.ambrosicutlery.com/aboutus.shtml

Two possible businesses, in your area, who would KNOW where you can go, locally.

Worth two calls, at least ;)

EDIT: Dynamic AND Forrest -- it appears -- are New York (State) based.


Thanks, Neil, I will check those. But I have a feeling a lawn mower company is not likely to be much at sharpening saw blades (there is a huge culture of lawn mowing services around here, I suspect they service that). And yes, there are plenty of places that sharpen cutlery.

As for Forrest, they are actually in New Jersey. I had not been aware of Dynamic, but I checked -- they're in Buffalo. It's a long ways from White Plains to Buffalo. NY is a big state. Still, I appreciate any suggestions I can get! And at least Dynamic is less expensive than Forrest, so I may use them.

[Neil Brooks]

You're right about Forrest being in NJ.

My thought about the mower (and cutlery) sharpening people is that ... they may simply KNOW who can do a nice job on saw blades, in much the way that a local sawyer or furniture shop might.

I'm assuming that they may all be a loosely affiliated "fraternity," and each knows the other....

Good luck !

[scott spencer]

The new "Avanti" line at HD is junk...nothing close to the well regarded former Freud Avanti series other than the logo (buyer beware with those...they are not Freud blades). Cheaply made blades like the HD Avanti line, Workforce, Ryobi, Skil, Oldham contractor serires, DeWalt construction series, Vermont American, Irwin Classic and Marathon, etc. aren't worth the asking price IMO...it's false economy at $15-$20 per blade. If that's the quality level that suits your needs, buy the $5 blades from HF, Big Lots, Homier sales, etc., then toss them.

A better option IMO....Good blades go on sale at clearance prices fairly often...stock up when these opportunities come, so the blades are at least worth the cost of resharpening. IE: The Delta Industrial 35-7657 (formerly the DeWalt DW7657) full kerf 10" 40T ATB general purpose blade has been on sale for $18 plus shipping from Cripe Distribution on Ebay. The real Freud TK/Avanti line has been clearanced by Rockler, Amazon, and others in recent months for a fraction of the normal retail price. 3-4 years ago Irwin discontinued their very good "Woodworker" series that was made in Germany by Leitz...those blades were clearanced down into the $10-$15 range for quite a while. Keep your eyes peeled for the real deals, or just buy a couple of good quality blades with thick carbide that are worth resharpening.

[John Mark Lane]

The new "Avanti" line at HD is junk...nothing close to the well regarded former Freud Avanti series other than the logo (buyer beware with those...they are not Freud blades). Cheaply made blades like the HD Avanti line, Workforce, Ryobi, Skil, Vermont American, Irwin Classic and Marathon, etc. aren't worth the asking price IMO...it's false economy at $15-$20 per blade. If that's the quality level that suits your needs, buy the $5 blades from HF, Big Lots, Homier sales, etc., then toss them.

Good blades go on sale at clearance prices fairly often...stock up when these opportunities come, so the blades are at least worth the cost of resharpening. IE: The Delta Industrial 35-7657 (formerly the DeWalt DW7657) full kerf 10" 40T ATB general purpose blade has been on sale for $18 plus shipping from Cripe Distribution on Ebay. The real Freud TK/Avanti line has been clearanced by Rockler, Amazon, and others in recent months for a fraction of the normal retail price. 3-4 years ago Irwin discontinued their very good "Woodworker" series that was made in Germany by Leitz...those blades were clearanced down into the $10-$15 range for quite a while. Keep your eyes peeled for the real deals, or just buy a couple of good quality blades with thick carbide that are worth resharpening.

Scott -- how do you tell the difference (online or otherwise) between the Avanti junk and the good ones?

For the record (again), I do appreciate quality blades and I don't generally expect to be buying much junk (and I absolutely despise Home Depot... I won't even buy Dewalt because of the Home Depot connection). But I still puzzle over the unfortunate circumstance that probably 95% of the saw blades sold today are "not worth the cost of resharpening". Back in the day... (ha ha), I always had my blades resharpened, and it was a regular stop on my circuit to swing by the sharpener's shop. No more.

[Don Jarvie]

Think of it this way, is the cost of the sharpening the blade cheaper than getting a new one? If the answer is yes then sharpen, if not get a new one.

It's worth buying a good quality blade for your TS and any other tool you use on a daily basis. It will be well worth paying to sharpen them..

I have a WWII on my TS and a Freud on my RAS. I wanted to buy a Forrest Chopmaster but couldn't justify the 100 bucks. The Freud was a bit cheaper.

I just had the WWII sharpened and it cost~25 bucks and I had it back in 4 days.

[scott spencer]

Scott -- how do you tell the difference (online or otherwise) between the Avanti junk and the good ones?

The easy way to tell is to look for the name...the "good" Freud Avanti line that's been discontinued says "Freud" on the blade. The imitation junk Avanti line just says "Avanti" or "Avanti Pro".... no "Freud". The Freud line was also made in Italy, the imitation Avanti line is made in China...there are some good blades made in China, but the Avanti line is not among them. Oshlun, Tenyru Rapid Cut series, and Craftex Blue Tornado line are just some examples of very good value lines that happen to be made in China.

The harder way to tell junk blades in general is to look at the teeth, the brazing, the way the slots are cut, the overall appearance, etc. There's no guarantee that small teeth, sloppy brazing, and stamped expansion slots won't cut well, but it's a clue that "cheap" was the manufacturer's intention.

http://i.pgcdn.com/pi/0/71/02/7102044_640.jpg http://www.homedepot.com/catalog/productImages/300/10/10f4039d-d6c5-4ddd-9e65-4595665fc26a_300.jpg

[Larry Frank]

I found this thread interesting as I was just looking at my sawblades last night and separating out a couple that need to be sharpened. I also made a list of blades for my shop insurance inventory list and it was surprising what they are all worth.
I believe that using the lower cost blades for pressure treated and construction type work is great. When they are no longer sharp, they get thrown away or actually if you put them in your recycling they will become a new piece of steel and I see nothing wrong with that.

[Bruce Wrenn]

As for Forrest, they are actually in New Jersey. I had not been aware of Dynamic, but I checked -- they're in Buffalo. It's a long ways from White Plains to Buffalo. NY is a big state. Dynamic is as close as your front door. Go to USP site and request a "flat rate box" which postman will drop off at your house. go online and print postage, or attach a check to box for postage (less than ten bucks), then request a pick up. You can put up to 55 pounds in your box, which for most is a lifetime supply of blades. Next go to Cripe Distributing's web site and order you some Delta 35-7657 blades for $17 each. Shipping is $10 the first blade and only slightly more for several. As for distance to sharpening place, there are two good sharpeners in my county, just on the other side. Each round trip takes about two and one half hours, times two, for a total of five hours of lost production time. Makes that flat rate box real cheap. My blades go to Dynamic. Only once did I let Forrest rip me off on costs of sharpening.

[Will Overton]

I believe that using the lower cost blades for pressure treated and construction type work is great.

I agree with that logic. The blade that came on my 12" Bosch slider is a Bosch blade labeled "Construction". I replaced it with a Forrest ChopMaster, but left the Bosch hanging on the wall for just those times.

[Victor Robinson]

Ah yes, I was taken by the junk Avanti BORG blades as well...

[george wilson]

The HF sharpener may grind the teeth,but as I have said before,unless the carbide is VERY finely ground-to a POLISH as you see on new Forrest blades,they won't cut nearly so well.

I have diamond wheels,and have tried touching them up myself,though I couldn't polish grind them. The results were not as good as a proper sharpening would produce.

The HF sharpener does not mention the grit size of the wheel,but I can see it isn't very fine.

BTW,I didn't try to grind my Forrest blades.:)

[Ron Kellison]

I think it's all part of the learning experience. When I started out 35 years ago (Wow! Seems like yesterday!) I bought a cheapo Craftsman blade for my new saw. Shortly after that I bought a Systematic 50-tooth combo blade and a Systematic 24-tooth rip blade. I've resharpened both of them at least twice and they are still in service. I also have a Ridge combo blade that I use strictly for fine work and a Freud laminate blade that I use primarily for man-made materials. The bottom line is that 1) I don't expect a given blade to do everything and 2) the cheap blades actually aren't if you expect to be cutting wood for more than a couple of years after you get started in the addiction. Bottom line...go big and go early! You'll never look back!

Regards,

Ron

[David Helm]

John Mark, I'm gonna jump in here and suggest that you call some of the cabinet shops or custom carpentry shops, call cabinetmakers, call finish carpenters, and find out who they trust to sharpen their blades...those professionals will know the best sharpeners around and you can them check them out.

As far as buying cheap blades, yes, we are a throwaway society and cheap blades will forever be with us. However, if you want to build decent furniture or make square cabinets, you'll buy a GOOD/expensive blade so it cuts your lumber correctly. You'll throw away money if you use a cheap blade on Brazilian cherry!!

What she said. Most professionals (at least in my area and that included me) buy very good blades and have them sharpened at one of the three sharpening shops in this town of less than 80,00 people. All three shops have been in business for a long time. The one I use is in its third generation of one family ownership.

[Rick Potter]

So, how does HD get away with selling phony Avanti blades? Did Frued license the name to them? I cannot believe Frued didn't copyright the name. Even the logo is the same.

Rick Potter

[Peter Quinn]

I can think of two other sharpening services in your general area as far as mail order, Ridge carbide in NJ, and Connecticut Saw and Tool in Startford CT. Both have web sites, both have prices similar to Forrest. Fact is cheap blades are meant to be disposable. I wouldn't think twice about throwing out a $16 band saw blade, it would cost a fortune to sharpen. The hardest part is how to dispose of them. They are a little dangerous to throw in the recycling.

For the good blades its a no brainer. Most of my blades cost three to four times teh cost of a single sharpening and they come back as new or better. But for the value line blades, I like the wind chime idea! Or maybe shop clocks? We have one of those at work made from a saw blade

[Marlin Williams]

So, how does HD get away with selling phony Avanti blades? Did Frued license the name to them? I cannot believe Frued didn't copyright the name. Even the logo is the same.

Rick Potter


Freud was bought out by Bosch. So I am sure the name is legal. Think Avanti as the cheap blade and the Diablo as the middle blade.
The Rigid blades I think may be made by Freud/Bosch but is considered their "high end" blade based on the signs I have seen at HD. I have not used one as I stick to REAL Avanti/Diablo mostly and some high end full Freuds.

Amazon has had some good prices on the REAL Avanti's every now and then.

[Mitchell Andrus]

Perhaps your cheap blades will come back cutting better than when they were new. After sharpening a cheap Delta 40T 'spare', it cuts as well as any Forest in the pile and isn't the last blade in the pile anymore.

If a $22.00 sharpening gets you a blade that cuts as well as a $52.00 blade, you made money on the deal. After 22,000 blade sharpenings you could pay off that Mercedes.
.

[John Piwaron]

Perhaps your cheap blades will come back cutting better than when they were new. After sharpening a cheap Delta 40T 'spare', it cuts as well as any Forest in the pile and isn't the last blade in the pile anymore.

.


This is sort of why I don't think Delta blades should be included in the cheap junk group.

About 25 or so years ago, I got a Delta 40 tooth ATBR. It was one of my first blades and cut pretty well. It started cutting perfectly after it's first sharpening. Like a Forrest WW2. And I do have a couple of those. The first one came back not right, I didn't do anything about it other than to not use it. The 2nd one hasn't been back yet. It might never since my Delta is the blade I always use. I think in 25 years I've had it sharpened 4 or 5 times. Right after it's first sharpening I bought another one just like it. So when the tips on the old Delta become too small to be sharpened again, it's "brother" can take over.

And I do have other blades to use. for work that's less than fine, I have cheap blades. Blades with no carbide. Who cares how nice a cut looks on fence posts or landscape timbers? Those blades get tossed. The $100 plus ones go for sharpening. Locally. Fortunately SE Wisconsin has a lot of options for that.

[Chris Kennedy]

You may try your local hardware store. My local doesn't sharpen them, but they have someone who does sharpening once a week (you drop it off Tuesday and it is returned the following Tuesday). The price is pretty reasonable, too. It's been a while, but I want to say about 20 cents a tooth and no shipping.

Cheers,

Chris

[John Mark Lane]

I can think of two other sharpening services in your general area as far as mail order, Ridge carbide in NJ, and Connecticut Saw and Tool in Startford CT.


Thanks for this info. Stratford is moderately convenient for me (25 minute drive). I checked their website and it looks like an interesting business. It says they have pick and up delivery service that includes Westchester County, where I live. I will be looking into this.

[scott spencer]

I'd hesitate to pay sharpening fees for a poorly made blade, which doesn't necessarily correllate to price. The carbide is likely to be very soft and won't hold an edge long, the body is still made from inferior steel, poorly tensioned, poorly balanced, and poorly designed, etc.

Note that Delta does have some pretty decent quality blades in their lineup that are worth sharpening, but they also have some entry level junk. Same is true of many brands...

[scott vroom]

+1 for pressure treated. I don't like replacing fences with rotted posts. As for appearance, like my daddy used to say "All cats are grey in the dark".

[glenn bradley]

So, how does HD get away with selling phony Avanti blades? Did Frued license the name to them? I cannot believe Frued didn't copyright the name. Even the logo is the same.

Rick Potter

This was discussed back when it occurred. Here's a quote from a Freud rep/member here:

" Here's the official word on Freud Avanti:

In an effort to continue to deliver excellence in the cutting tool market, Freud consistently evaluates its product offering and brand strategy.

Freud has expanded its Freud Industrial Thin Kerf line to the point that it would be a replication for Freud to continue its Avanti line of saw blades. Therefore, Freud has decided to discontinue the Freud Avanti saw blades to streamline our saw blade strategy. We will be transitioning all Avanti saw blades over to Freud Industrial Thin Kerf line due to the significant increase in features and performance.

Freud will no longer manufacture the Avanti brand of saw blades effective June 2009.

Freud will continue to manufacture our premium brands including Freud Industrial & Diablo (premium construction line) from its manufacturing headquarters in Udine, Italy.

Because of this decision to discontinue the Freud Avanti saw blade line, consumers may see discounted Avanti product on the market until the completion of all existing inventory."

HTH.

[John Mark Lane]

Just to follow up, I called Connecticut Saw & Tool. Spoke to a very nice woman there. Their prices are considerably lower than Forrest (eg $13.75 for a 10" 50T blade). They have a pick up/drop off service that picks up at a hardware store right down the street from me. Ha! I will check the hardware store. If they mark up the price a dollar or two, I won't mind. If they mark it up more than that, I'll just drive up to Connecticut (a short drive for me). They have a showroom there and sell lots of stuff, so it's probably a good thing to do anyway.

So Peter -- thanks! Problem finds solution. Nice.

Mark

[Paul Johnstone]

Sorry, but I just have to vent. Maybe someone will have a helpful suggestion (ha ha, I mean a good suggestion).
.

Go to your local woodworking store. Most of those places have a guy that will come by once a week and sharpen blades.

[Will Overton]

Go to your local woodworking store. Most of those places have a guy that will come by once a week and sharpen blades.

Day late and a dollar short. ;)

[Jim Summers]

Hello All,

Not meaning to hijack this thread, but kinda a related question:

What are some ways ya'll use to determine if a blade needs sharpening?

Thanks

[Greg Portland]

What are some ways ya'll use to determine if a blade needs sharpening?A few options:

1) Look at the surface of the cut, is it smooth / polished looking?
2) Cut some melamine or plywood and see how much chip-out you get (should be very little with most multi-use blades). For rip or chopsaw blades make a few test cuts in splinter-prone wood and examine them for chip-out.
3) Did you clean the blade and still see these problems? If so, get them sharpened. Note: most people think their blade is dull but it's actually dirty.

Most WWers end up owning more than 1 blade so it makes cut quality comparisons pretty easy.

[Van Huskey]

Just to follow up, I called Connecticut Saw & Tool. Spoke to a very nice woman there. Their prices are considerably lower than Forrest (eg $13.75 for a 10" 50T blade). They have a pick up/drop off service that picks up at a hardware store right down the street from me. Ha! I will check the hardware store. If they mark up the price a dollar or two, I won't mind. If they mark it up more than that, I'll just drive up to Connecticut (a short drive for me). They have a showroom there and sell lots of stuff, so it's probably a good thing to do anyway.

So Peter -- thanks! Problem finds solution. Nice.

Mark

Looking at their web site they look to have up to date sharpening machines which is a serious positive. I think Forrest charges more because they can, there was a time when I would often here they were the only ones that could properly sharpen their blades, I didn't think it was true then and know all the high tech shops can do it now.

[Jim Summers]

A few options:

1) Look at the surface of the cut, is it smooth / polished looking?
2) Cut some melamine or plywood and see how much chip-out you get (should be very little with most multi-use blades). For rip or chopsaw blades make a few test cuts in splinter-prone wood and examine them for chip-out.
3) Did you clean the blade and still see these problems? If so, get them sharpened. Note: most people think their blade is dull but it's actually dirty.

Most WWers end up owning more than 1 blade so it makes cut quality comparisons pretty easy.

Thanks Greg,

I have a Freud glue-line rip blade. Can't remember how many teeth and a Freud 80 tooth crosscut. Both pass test 1. But on plywood for test 2 the 80T fails a little bit even when cleaned. The rip blade does fine and best when clean, although I rarely use it when cutting ply. I have been working with hard/soft maple and cherry mostly for the last couple of years. When ripping those I sometimes get some burn, but I help that with cleaning. Probably should retune the TS also. I clean with simple green which works pretty well.

What are some splinter prone woods?

I have had them several years and cut quite a bit with them so maybe a good sharpening is in order.

Thanks again.