Mortiser with compound angles

[Craig Parker]

I would like to get a mortiser and I have a Felder cf741 so the optional
mortiser would be a logical choice for me. However, I would like to make
some chairs as well so the optional mortiser would require a jig or jigs
to make compound mortises. I've never make a chair so I not sure how
easy this is. A hollow chisel mortiser like to PM 719T and the jds
multi-router are also possibilty but really don't want to spend $4000+
for the Felder FD250 since it doesn't do compound angles. So, which
machine with the best accuracy and easy of use would be the best to buy?

Craig

[ian maybury]

Hi Craig. Sounds like you're going through a similar process to what I did last year as a part of getting set up to make solid furniture - I wanted the ability to handle multi angle as well as square mortices.

I'm still not set up and don't have a lot of experience and so can't offer more than a view - but here's a few thoughts from my journey. WElcome to the maze!

I have a Hammer A3 410 planer thicknesser, and looked hard at the possibility of the add-on floating tenon horizontal slotting model Hammer can supply. Also the stand alone Felder model.

They seem to me a more elegant cutting solution than the vertical chisel variety which to my mind can be a bit rough in the way they cut if not well set up.

The trouble is that the horizontal models seemed limited on angular capability (one axis only, then packing blocks) to me as I was thinking of chair designs. Ditto in the case of chisel types - I couldn't seem to find a tilting table model in the UK market at decent quality/money. (that said Jet and Powermatic do a decent chisel type that's sold in the US, as do a couple of other companies) Multico I think also do what may be a good one, but I seem to remember them as being quite expensive.

The next stage was that the multi angle requirement led me into several varieties of US made 'do-everything' tool - the JDS multi router, and the like. This seemed like it had the potential to get me into the opposite problem of too much capability, but too much cost and complexity/slowness if I wasn't careful.

This led back into the thought that maybe it was just as practical to KISS (as they seem to do in the UK) - to buy good solid (but simple and fairly cheap) vertical chisel or horizontal slotting morticer, and rely on accurately cut angle blocks when the need for angled mortises arises. (staying aware that angle blocks can eat up quite a lot of clamping/cutting capacity, and as a result making sure that any machine is not too small to handle more acute angles in larger section timber)

In the end I chickened out, and decided that it wasn't really feasible to cover my rather vaguely defined bases with one piece of kit at any reasonable cost - and that to take it further I needed to gain a clearer view of my specific requirement as my business direction developed.

It's much more straightforward where right angle joints are concerned, but the lesson I think I learned was of the need to have pretty clearly defined requirements - on the basis that in these machines unnecessary capability leads to cost, complexity and possible less efficient methods. Not to mention inability to handle the work if you plump for the wrong tool.

The result was that I bought a Festool Domino hand held slot morticer to add some extra capability and speed where it was suitable, and figured I'd soldier on with that, some router jigs and an as yet unused Woodrat (like a Router Boss) and Incra joinery system. People seem to be finding that the Domino is a hell of a lot more versatile and convenient than it might first appear.

ian

PS Should you think of buying a Domino (and my sense is that it's a really versatile and convenient tool) be aware that there's mutterings of a larger 14mm dia x 3in deep model coming out fairly soon. What I don't know is whether or not it will run the current smaller tools as well - although it would seem likely that it should.

[Kirk Poore]

Well, you could try to find an old tilt-table Greenlee, Wyson & Miles, Oliver, or other old industrial machine. I did, and have no regrets. But you may not be looking for something that big.

A second option is a tilt-head mortiser. I have a friend with one, and he likes it. I think it's a General International.

Kirk

[Ryan Hellmer]

If you're not dedicated to the concept of using your current machine, a Leigh FMT is probably right up your alley. I've got one and it does compound M/T's with ease, doesn't take up much room and is astonishinly accurate and easy to use.

Ryan

[Stephen Cherry]

For chairs, you may consider just a strait mortiser and use wedges to achieve your angles. This has the advangage that the wedges become a repeatable template for future mortises of the same angle, as opposed to trying to set the machine for exactly the same angle.

[Philip Rodriquez]

+1 on the FMT. It is quick and fast for compound angles! The next step up would be the MiltiRouter.

[Jon van der Linden]

With this kind of thing making your own jigs and workholding devices is a normal way of life. There are mortisers designed to do exactly what you want, but they are very very expensive and designed for production lines where $20k(at the low end) is not a big deal.

I would have a serious look at the Festool Domino. It's relatively cheap and there's a lot you can do with it. Find someone near you that has one, or find a store where you can try it out. (Yeah, I did use the words Festool AND cheap!)

The other option would be to make some jigs to work with any of the variety of commercial mortising machines out there. I can't think of a single one offhand that you could get used for under $5k that would let you do compound angles. I'd stay away from any of the router options because of slow setup and relatively high cost, but that might not be an issue depending on how you work.

[Eiji Fuller]

+1 on the Domino. That machine has changed my life. :D

I cant wait for the big brother to come out but most likely it will not be compatable with the smaller cutters, as the shaft will have to be bigger to support the larger cutters, and be used for large M&T joints only. I only hope that its less than 2K.

[Neal Clayton]

for small oddball joints the leigh jig is hard to beat. its only limitation is it can't easily do mortises within other joints, and is depth limited (so it wouldn't be good for doors/windows, for example) but for furniture joints i don't see how anything else could be better.

[Tony Joyce]

This is what I found that fits the bill. www-dot-lagunatools-dot-com/mortisers/mortiser-platinumhct#
I was really impressed with the range of tilt it allowed. I haven't purchased one yet, but plan in the not too distant future.

I also have a Domino, they are very versatile, but do not do as large of a tenon as a real mortiser. The larger Domino is said to be as much as or more than the Laguna.

Replace -dot- with a period to get the link!

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=127641&d=1252624454