tongue and groove info

[Karl Card]

Is there a proper way or better way etc to make tongue and groove cuts?

I am getting ready to make some cedar chest, finally, and am wondering if a tongue and groove router bit is the way to go or is it better than using a table saw with a dado blade....

I have never did a t and g so any help and all info definitely welcome.

[Chip Lindley]

Karl, the amazing thing about woodworking, is that so many tasks can be done so many different ways, using the tools at hand. Some methods take a long time; others are much faster. Speed or simplicity is nice if lots of identical pieces are needed.

With a dado set, you can vary all dimensions to your liking. But, fine-tuning the dado setup on a TS is quite time consuming. The cut must be set up exactly so that T&G will be centered, and also to make an exact fit. If boards are not exact same thickness, tongues will be thicker or thinner, and grooves, cut at a constant width, may be too wide or narrow to receive the tongue.

The beauty of a router bit set, is that regardless of wood thickness, all cuts are referenced from the tabletop. All boards would fit together exactly, on one side at least! But, there is a trade-off! Although the T&G router bit set would be much faster and less tedious to set up than using a dado blade in the TS, you are limited to one tongue depth and width.

Now, if someone made a dado set for the TS with a spacer in the center, quick, accurate tongues could be cut. Setting up to cut the groove would be a no-brainer! But, until "someone" does, I suppose the choice between dado and router bits is yours.

[Troy Turner]

Karl - Looks like Chip did a pretty good job explaining the differences. I have a T/G router bit that I bought a while back to make our dining table. Didn't know about a dado blade then, but I do now. I still would turn to my router bit set. Get you a good one and you won't regret it.
Good luck!!!

[Karl Card]

Very good explanation. Kind of what I figured but wanted the opinion of someone who has done it..

Thanks,

[Tom Hintz]

I have a story on making the tongue and groove joint on a plain table saw. I do have a tongue and groove bit set that I use some but for smaller jobs the table saw method seems fastest to me and at least some of the joints I made this way have been holding together for 20 years or so now. See the link below for that story.

Making Tongue and Groove Joints (http://www.newwoodworker.com/basic/tgjnts.html)

[Peter Quinn]

Karl, the amazing thing about woodworking, is that so many tasks can be done so many different ways, using the tools at hand. Some methods take a long time; others are much faster. Speed or simplicity is nice if lots of identical pieces are needed.

With a dado set, you can vary all dimensions to your liking. But, fine-tuning the dado setup on a TS is quite time consuming. The cut must be set up exactly so that T&G will be centered, and also to make an exact fit. If boards are not exact same thickness, tongues will be thicker or thinner, and grooves, cut at a constant width, may be too wide or narrow to receive the tongue.

The beauty of a router bit set, is that regardless of wood thickness, all cuts are referenced from the tabletop. All boards would fit together exactly, on one side at least! But, there is a trade-off! Although the T&G router bit set would be much faster and less tedious to set up than using a dado blade in the TS, you are limited to one tongue depth and width.

Now, if someone made a dado set for the TS with a spacer in the center, quick, accurate tongues could be cut. Setting up to cut the groove would be a no-brainer! But, until "someone" does, I suppose the choice between dado and router bits is yours.

Chip, I inherited a pile of "spacers" for the TS, 5/8 ID and a 1 3/4" OD, that do just what you suggested, with a few shims. My grandfather used to stack several 8" rip blades on either side of the spacers and make the t&g joints that way. I have never used them personally, three shapers makes that option less attractive as I'm sure you are aware, but they have been invented, though they may be a causality of the safety police? I have 1/4". 3/16", 1/8" and 1/2".

A dado shim kit and two sets of blade stiffeners could give the same functionality I think, and if you build a jig to reference the fence you push any stock thickness error all to one face just like a router table or shaper.
That does limit you to 2" mortises before you bottom out wiht an 8" blade set, assuming 4" stiffeners.

[Jim Eller]

Karl,

I used Sommerfeld's T&G set to build my granddaughter's hope chest out of hickory for the top, bottom and corners. http://www.sommerfeldtools.com/3-Pc-Tongue-Groove-Cabinetmaking-Set/productinfo/03004/

The set worked perfectly with no adjustments to the router when changing bits as advertised.

The joints are smooth as silk with no sanding required. .......I couldn't believe it either. Only need to sand the whole project to apply a finish.

It was quick, easy, perfect and one of the best bit purchases I've ever made.

Just my opinion.

Jim

[David Cefai]

A question for Tom Hintz:

In your article you wrote:


A good portion of the Tongue and Groove Joint strength comes from making the tongue side of the joint in the rails. That means the top and bottom surfaces of the tongue are long grain, which glue to the long grain sides within the groove

I'm afraid I don't get this. Would it not be the same if the situation was reversed?

[David Hawxhurst]

i don't think there is a right way or wrong way to make t+g. i'm a fan of the router method. a shaper would be the easiest and fastest. being that i don't have one, the router table would be the way i would go. i don't have a t+G bit set so i'd use some straight bits. yes it would take longer because you have to make three passes. i'd cut the groove first then set up for the tongue and cut one side at a time.

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

I've done it with a table saw, a hand plane, a hand held router, and a table mounted router.
My preference is with a table router and a specialty finger bit.

[Tom Hintz]

A question for Tom Hintz:

In your article you wrote:



I'm afraid I don't get this. Would it not be the same if the situation was reversed?

Sure, as long as you are still talking about the long grain sections mating. I guess you can describe this either way. The tongue generally increases the amount of long grain to long grain contact. The tongue itself doesn't have much shear strength like a good cross grain spline except when we use this joint in something like a door frame. Then the tongue can actually mimic a spline because the grain runs 90-degrees to the joint and not parallel to it like when joining boards side by side.

[Karl Card]

I did get a line up on a 1/4 t and g bit. That was just awesome and the fellow creeker knows who he is....Thanks,


I have a very nice dado set that I got from a local cabinetmaker who got tired of making them and started just installing them, so I got a deal on his set. I played with it a little today and honestly thinking of why a person couldnt make a spacer or a set of spacers to put between the two outer blades in order to do a tongue and groove on the table saw. I looked at the inside cut because I had heard of others saying how the nasty the cuts can be. this thing was so clean, no strip out of wood, no corners were cut goofy, i mean just absolutley perfect cut down thru the piece of wood.

So I am curious if anyone has made there own spacer set to do a t and g on a ts with a dado set.


One last question, for today anyway, I have seen the joinery sets at mlcs and wonder if they are of any quality.