Question for you electrical people out there.

[Kurt Cady]

I work in my garage, but the entire garage is on one 15A circuit. Can only run on thing at a time.

I want to add a DC, (HF unit which draws 15A IIRC) and to do so, I am planning on dropping (2) 20A GFCI outlets directly below my breaker box using 12/2 wire. I have plenty of open space in the box.

My question is this: I want to put the DC in the opposite corner, so I need an extension cord. I was planning on making my own with leftover wire and plug ends. I have plenty of 14/2 wire which I know is used for 15A circuits. Can I use this 14/2 wire for my extension cord to a HF DC which draws 15A but may spike for a short time over 15A on startup? The extension cord will run about 25-30ft long.

Thanks for any input, guys.

[Jeff Fischer]

#1: Romex is not rated for extension cord use
#2: 25 feet cable at full rated amperage is unsafe

Is this garage attached to your house?
I've repaired several houses that burned due to improper use of extension cords.
Go ahead and run a 12ga 20a circuit for the unit and sleep better.

Just my 2 cents.

Jeff

[Kurt Cady]

I figured using wire at it's rating wasn't a great idea. Had to ask.

I guess I asked the question to see what others have done in this situation. I can't be the first!

Jeff, are you suggesting I run the wire through the wall? I was hoping to find an easier way as my garage is fully drywalled with living space above and neighbors. (Townhouse)

[Jeff Fischer]

My first choice would be to run up into the attic, across and back down inside the walls, if possible. It's really not that hard, depending on access and other obstacles I can't see from here..

If that's not practical, how about surface mounted conduit? The gray pvc is really easy to work with, and you can purchase the individual white, black and geen 12 ga wire by the foot along with the conduit and fittings at the big box stores.

If all that is just too much trouble, at the very least purchase a real 12ga extension cord that's long enough to work but not long enough to coil up the extra, (Don't ever coil up a cord in use) and disconnect when not needed.

Sorry, didn't mean to sound so harsh in previous post. Meant to sound concerned.:)

Jeff

[Barry Lyndon]

(Don't ever coil up a cord in use)


What about the retractable extension cord that I bought? http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=10673

Is this really a concern?

[Jeff Fischer]

I'm not sure of all the electrical theory of coiled cords, but I believe that overheating due to overloading a fully coiled lightweight cord caused a total loss fire I worked.
The findings from the investigator were:
A 'handyman" plugged a compressor into a 100ft 14 ga ext cord and took off to get materials. The compressor was left on and the cord was plugged into an outlet 3 feet from the compressor. The hardwood flooring under the coiled cord was the point of origin.

So, just don't overload the cord, especially while it is comepletely coiled up near a combustible surface. Your retactable cord when extended and not overloaded should be fine.

Hope that helps!

Jeff

[Dave MacArthur]

Run a circuit. It's very easy to do. Surface mount conduit, you can use the plastic or metal EMC, both are very very cheap. Run 12ga, or better yet run 10ga.

I just posted a thread 2 weeks ago about what size motor for a dust collector could be run on 12 ga wire, there is much info in it. 2HP no problem. 5HP at 240V/19A was OK on my 12ga circuit until I de-rated it for temperature.

Honestly, if you're in a garage with one 15A circuit, and planning on doing woodworking in there, just bite the bullet and run 4 or 5 circuits up, across the attic, then back down in conduit. Once you're running one, it's not much more effort to just wire the place up.

[Don Alexander]

i'm not an electrician however i got some good advice years ago from a very good electrician i knew well

he said never use an extension cord unless its absolutely necessary , when necessary to use one use the shortest one you can , never ever use a cord while its coiled , and be sure you use wire thats heavy enough gauge to easily handle the load you put on it


i have found that following that advice is alot safer than ignoring it and a side benefit is that its easier on the tools DAHIKT :eek:

[Henry Ambrose]

I'd run a couple of new 20A circuits with multiple outlets if you have room in your supply panel. You'll be glad you did (and for a long time). Its worth the time and effort.

[Kurt Cady]

If I run it to the attic, I'm looking at 75+ feet of 12/2 wire per outlet. For that cost I may as well just cut out an 8" wide strip of drywall along the perimeter of the garage and put the wire through the studs. Sure, it's a little more work, but to run 3 different circuits the cost savings could be worth tearing into the drywall.

If I'm going to go through the trouble, should I wire one for 240V? What do I need for 240V compared to 120V? Is it a benefit? Right now I have an R4511 TS which I love.

[Jeff Fischer]

[/QUOTE] I was hoping to find an easier way as my garage is fully drywalled with living space above and neighbors. (Townhouse)[/QUOTE]

Sorry Kurt, I missed those details.
It might be worth peeking above the drywall ceiling to see what kind of joists you have.
I've used those small plastic snap-in access panels on a ceiling before for plumbing access, they might work for you with one at each end of the run, and save the drywall work, and leave access points to add more later if needed.
Jeff

[Dan Friedrichs]

If I run it to the attic, I'm looking at 75+ feet of 12/2 wire per outlet. For that cost I may as well just cut out an 8" wide strip of drywall along the perimeter of the garage and put the wire through the studs. Sure, it's a little more work, but to run 3 different circuits the cost savings could be worth tearing into the drywall.

If I'm going to go through the trouble, should I wire one for 240V? What do I need for 240V compared to 120V? Is it a benefit? Right now I have an R4511 TS which I love.

Why do you need to run it inside the wall? Mounting plastic conduit to the wall would be much cheaper and less labor-intensive.

You don't necessarily need to make the decision to wire for 240V just yet - if you run separate wires to each outlet, you can later decide to turn those into 3-wire 240V outlets by just installing a new breaker and a new receptacle.

[Kurt Cady]

Dan, what kind of wire do I need for a 20A 240v? 12/3?

Thinking more about it, I think I'm going to run (3) circuits. One with one outlet, one with two, one with three. (HD sells a packs of 3 GFCI)

If I want 240v later I can always pull new wire through the circuit with one outlet.

I'll have to explore the conduit thing a little more.

[Kurt Cady]

Jeff, my joists are the ones with a 2x3 on top and bottom with plywood in between. And they run from garage door to the back wall. My panel is in the center of the back wall and I want outlets along one side wall so I'm not sure access panels will work unless I'm envisioning them wrong.

Thank you guys for all your help and suggestions!

[Dan Friedrichs]

Dan, what kind of wire do I need for a 20A 240v? 12/3?



Nope, just 12/2. Your 240V loads are likely going to be motors, so they don't need the neutral wire like on a "4-wire" 240V circuit (where you would, indeed, use 12/3). So you can actually just change a 120V outlet into a 240V outlet by changing the breaker and the receptacle. It can't be used for 4-wire appliances (like a stove or dryer), but can be used for a window air conditioner, motor, or any other 3-wire 240V appliance.

[Jeff Fischer]

Kurt,
You're right, the panels probably won't save you any trouble, since you have to cross the floor joists with your wire.
Be sure you follow the manafacturer's directions on drilling the web to pass the wire thru.
For future reference here are the panels I referred to:
http://www.oatey.com/Plumber/Shared/ProductGroupDetail/65/Access+Able+Access+Panels.html

Jeff