WoodRiver Planes.... They're baaaaack....

[Chris Griggs]

This is just and FYI so PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE don't let this set off another round of debates. I think the various viewpoints on these planes have already been well established.

Anyway, I was browsing Woodcraft's website today and noticed that all the WoodRiver planes including both the standard and low-angle block planes are available again. It was my and many other peoples assumption that that the WoodRiver planes had been discontinued so I thought folks might like to know. Also, the prices have gone up by $5-$10 bucks a piece.

[James Taglienti]

i would like to present 400 key facts, viewpoints, and opinions on the different qualities of wood river planes VS all other planes on the market. here goes...

[Chris Griggs]

And I would like to present an equal number of counter arguments to your viewpoints regardless of what they are.:)

[Sean Hughto]

I just have one thing to say:

"WoodRiver" is a dumb name.

It sounds like a cheesy wannabe McMansion subdivision.

:p

[Jared McMahon]

I just have one thing to say:

"WoodRiver" is a dumb name.

It sounds like a cheesy wannabe McMansion subdivision.

:p

Wow, I just realized, for a short time I actually did live in a cheesy wannabe McMansion (townhome) subdivision named Wood River.

[Michael Peet]

I just have one thing to say:

"WoodRiver" is a dumb name.

It sounds like a cheesy wannabe McMansion subdivision.

:p

LOL, I always think of that scene in the movie Fletch, except that was "moon river."

Mike

[David Weaver]

This sounds a lot like the quote I saw yesterday, can't remember where it was from:

Definition of the suburbs - "a place where they cut down all of the trees and then name the streets after them."

In my neighborhood (suburban), the streets are all named after animals and people doing activities that you used to be able to do before the burbs were there, with the obligatory random monopoly game street thrown in the middle - no tree names, though, maybe because most of the trees are still there.

[David Weaver]

I would like to put a placeholder in for all of the future posts:
* "I would never buy anything from China"
* "nobody should buy these, they should rehabilitate planes that are perforated with rust"
* "someone has to make a plane for people who can't buy lie nielsens"
* "I know deneb and tom, and I'd never buy anything but lie nielsens"
* "you're stupid, I'm stupid, they're stupid, we're stupid"
* "calm down, this thread is going to be locked"
* "i'm sorry, you're sorry, they're sorry, we're sorry - but that doesn't change the fact that I was right"
* "hooray for the mods, the mods are great. Thanks for the service"
* "Chris Schwartz says.."
* "testimony by three people who actually have the planes" (this one is, of course, ignored by everyone, including the people who just want to know "the truth" about whether or not they're junk).
* "woodcraft 20% off sale ruined the world"
* "japan woodworker - borg"
* "you're stupid again, i'm stupid again, they're stupid again, we're all stupid"
* Thread locked
* Thread disappears

3 months from now, we recycle. :D

[John A. Callaway]

LOL, I always think of that scene in the movie Fletch, except that was "moon river."

Mike


Moon River..... the actual moon river is just a short drive from my house.

WoodRiver..... never in my house.

[Karl Wicklund]

Hey, I grew up on the banks of the Wood River up in NW Wisconsin. It's one of the prime attractions of these planes for me.

[Sean Hughto]

Karl, no offense to the real Wood Rivers that exist out there in Wisconsin and elsewhere in the world (or the people that love those rivers, or love wood for that matter). I was just being silly - hence the "stick out tongue" emoticon.

[Garth Keel]

The beautiful Woodriver planes of mid Kansas. I know them well. You too can live on the cutting edge. :D

[Chris Griggs]

3 words... "funniest, thread, ever..."

Also, the street I grew up on was called "Pond Haven Lane" and I'm thinking of starting my own tool company called "Pond Haven Planes". Any buyers?

[Callan Campbell]

I would like to put a placeholder in for all of the future posts:
* "I would never buy anything from China"
* "nobody should buy these, they should rehabilitate planes that are perforated with rust"
* "someone has to make a plane for people who can't buy lie nielsens"
* "I know deneb and tom, and I'd never buy anything but lie nielsens"
* "you're stupid, I'm stupid, they're stupid, we're stupid"
* "calm down, this thread is going to be locked"
* "i'm sorry, you're sorry, they're sorry, we're sorry - but that doesn't change the fact that I was right"
* "hooray for the mods, the mods are great. Thanks for the service"
* "Chris Schwartz says.."
* "testimony by three people who actually have the planes" (this one is, of course, ignored by everyone, including the people who just want to know "the truth" about whether or not they're junk).
* "woodcraft 20% off sale ruined the world"
* "japan woodworker - borg"
* "you're stupid again, i'm stupid again, they're stupid again, we're all stupid"
* Thread locked
* Thread disappears

3 months from now, we recycle. :D
And we have a WINNER for best post of the month!!!!!:D:D:D ;)

[Chris Griggs]

And we have a WINNER for best post of the month!!!!!:D:D:D ;)

I second Callan's vote for best post of the month. Mr. Weaver, I solute you sir.

[Joel Goodman]

If we link to the previous threads pro and con we can really get ourselves all worked up....

[glenn bradley]

Wow, I just realized, for a short time I actually did live in a cheesy wannabe McMansion (townhome) subdivision named Wood River.

I just blew coffee all over the monitor :D:D:D

[Brian Kincaid]

Love this thread. :D
-Brian

[Rick Rutten]

Wow, I just realized, for a short time I actually did live in a cheesy wannabe McMansion (townhome) subdivision named Wood River.

Are you kidding? I still do. Its kind of plane. If it were in Wisconsin it would be really cheesey. I have a little block house at #9. The guy next to me has a whopper though. One the other side of him are some folks who are really involved but they are joiners. The guy next to them can do nearly anything. Jack something.

Although all of the houses are plane some have fences. Some of the house are not square but they are all affordably priced. A lady a couple of blocks over, Phyllis, has a problem sliding around. Of course there are the poeple in the 600 block that have castles. On the weekends we have yard sales where some people come in to buy whatever we have because they think it is rare. Its not really to boring here in Wood River.

Respectfully, ;)
Rick

[Rick Markham]

Are you kidding? I still do. Its kind of plane. If it were in Wisconsin it would be really cheesey. I have a little block house at #9. The guy next to me has a whopper though. One the other side of him are some folks who are really involved but they are joiners. The guy next to them can do nearly anything. Jack something.

Although all of the houses are plane some have fences. Some of the house are not square but they are all affordably priced. A lady a couple of blocks over, Phyllis, has a problem sliding around. Of course there are the poeple in the 600 block that have castles. On the weekends we have yard sales where some people come in to buy whatever we have because they think it is rare. Its not really to boring here in Wood River.

Respectfully, ;)
Rick

I liked David's post too, but I have to vote for Rick in this one... he has a good name, and his usage of puns is brilliant!

And as far as the "your stupid, I'm stupid we're all stupid comment" I resemble the "I'm stupid part" :D

[Bruce Campbell]

While I appreciate the self-enforced moderation and rapid degeneration into humor I'd like everyone to keep in mind that woodworking is a growing hobby. As such there are people here who have not had the vast experience necessary to immediately bring out the flamethrowers at the mention of Brand/method of work/place of manufacture.

There are many who have yet to weigh in on even such mundane topics such as tails/pins/(or as I dobutt joint and draw dovetails with a fine point pencil) first method much less the rarified beatification of Ron Hock vs. The miracle of laminated old school rust bucket blade rehabs.

To instantly turn to humor on a brand war of this magnitude is doing a serious disservice to those of us who are just now saving pennies to buy our first name brand plane/tool in hopes we might also cause a moderator thread lock based on the strength of ownership.

In the future please continue heated debate for 24 hours prior to fellowship and good humor. Us noobs need our chances also.

[David Weaver]

Perhaps we've reached time for convention to change.

Serious debate can follow the people who've no objective other than to play weatherman with the thread pattern :D

Of course, I only saw the pins vs. tails argument one time, and at the time, i still couldn't figure out why someone who doesn't want to mark work in general would ever cut pins first. Sheesh :confused: And if you want to mark work first vs. just cutting the tails and then using them to do a very minimal marking scheme - yeah, you should have yours coming, too :D

Rick's post is definitely a lot more thoughtful than mine. I didn't have to do anything other than recall what always happens in this type of thread :)

[Rick Rutten]

Bruce I didn't mean to step on any toes. I am probably one of the most noobs here being only a few months in to this. I believe that if you were to ask a serious question in this or any other thread you would still get an honest and thoughtful reply. So ask away! No offense intended.

Rick

[Ron Conlon]

While I appreciate the self-enforced moderation and rapid degeneration into humor I'd like everyone to keep in mind that woodworking is a growing hobby. As such there are people here who have not had the vast experience necessary to immediately bring out the flamethrowers at the mention of Brand/method of work/place of manufacture.

There are many who have yet to weigh in on even such mundane topics such as tails/pins/(or as I dobutt joint and draw dovetails with a fine point pencil) first method much less the rarified beatification of Ron Hock vs. The miracle of laminated old school rust bucket blade rehabs.

To instantly turn to humor on a brand war of this magnitude is doing a serious disservice to those of us who are just now saving pennies to buy our first name brand plane/tool in hopes we might also cause a moderator thread lock based on the strength of ownership.

In the future please continue heated debate for 24 hours prior to fellowship and good humor. Us noobs need our chances also.

You seemed less reactionary in the Evil Dead movies.

[Casey Gooding]

I just have one thing to say:

"WoodRiver" is a dumb name.

It sounds like a cheesy wannabe McMansion subdivision.

:p

I agree. I mean what is a woo driver anyway??? :)

[Sean Hughto]

Actually, I think they should move that capital to the left one and make it

"WooDriver"

A plane that would drive me to exclaim "WOOOO" might be cool. Or maybe it would help me in pitching woo to my best girlfriend. But any of these associations would certainly beat the cul-de-sac picture "wood river" paints in my mind.

[Ron Conlon]

Actually, I think they should move that capital to the left one and make it

"WooDriver"

A plane that would drive me to exclaim "WOOOO" might be cool. Or maybe it would help me in pitching woo to my best girlfriend. But any of these associations would certainly beat the cul-de-sac picture "wood river" paints in my mind.

"Pitching woo?" Sean, you must be older than your picture would indicate! :p

[Bobby O'Neal]

So...all joking aside, considering I'm not privy to whatever discussion has gone on prior to this posting, are the planes a joke or a contender?

Bobby

[David Weaver]

I think the consensus is that between the cheap planes (groz, et al) and the superb planes (LN and LV), they are price appropriate - capable planes that aren't quite as nicely finished as LN and LV.

[Chris Griggs]

Ok Bobby, here's me trying to answer your question to the best of my ability. I will focus my response on the functionality of the planes.

I am a relative newbie and currently only own two planes, a rehabbed Stanley No. 4 w/ Hock blade and a WoodRiver No 6, so feel free to take my opinion with a grain of salt. I will say that I have been very pleased with my WoodRiver (I mean WooDriver). When I got it the blade required honing, but everything else was ready to go. I've used it as a roughing plane, super smoother, shooting plane, and jointer, and can say that when set for a fine cut it easily takes transparent shavings and leaves a beautiful surface on domestic hard woods (maple, cherry, etc..). While the adjustment mechanisims are perfectly adequate my impression is that this is where LNs and LVs outshine a WR the most. Also, while I don't own any LN/LV planes I do have two LN backsaws and can attest to the fact that part of what you get when you buy their products is unbelievable product support and customer service.

All other debates aside my feeling is that the WRs are a great value especially if you wait for them to go on sale (which is what I did). While I think the current $155 price of the WR No 6 is still a good value for what you get, for $60 more you can get an LV Low angle Jack, which I think would be worth paying the extra money for. Of course, you also need to consider what you plan to use the plane for. For me, the WR No 6 filled both short and long term needs. In the short term it serves multiple puposes as I mentioned above. Hopefully, many of the tasks it currently handles will be taken over by LVs and LNs; however, even then I think it will still have a place as either roughing plane or an alternative to a larger jointer.


Now lets get back to the humor! So what is Woo Driver anyway? While "Woo" and "Driver" both have multiple definitions, I have list the two I think are most pertainent below.

Woo: "to court a romantic interest"

Driver: "one that provides impulse or motivation"

Therefore, a WooDriver Plane gives you the impulse or motivation to court a romantic interest. Isn't the power of hand tools amazing?

[Rick Rutten]

So...all joking aside, considering I'm not privy to whatever discussion has gone on prior to this posting, are the planes a joke or a contender?


Bobby, try googling "Wood River Plane reviews." there are quite a few articles out there where plane-heads put them through their paces and compare them to others. From what I have read it is kind of hit and miss for quality. For a nickle more you can get something that is pretty well regarded as being high quality. However, that is a decision you will have to make for yourself based upon the reviews and opinions from here. Although the opinios may be quite hard to find. :D

If you lined up a string of Woo-Driver planes you would have a plane train that went "wooo wooo."

Rick

[Larry Frank]

This thread should be a model for a lot of other threads. It had humor and even managed to answer the question concerning the planes.

I had a Woodriver plane and after some work, it did a reasonable job. I also have several LN planes and they are pretty much ready out of the box. They feel better, look better and work better than the Wood River but cost a bunch more. Is it worth it? Probably depends on how much is in your wallet and what you using them for.

In my case, it also depends on what my Chief Financial Officer approves. I could not believe it when she got me the LN 4-1/2 for Christmas.

[James Taglienti]

i would like to take this moment to go off on a 7 paragraph tangent that pisses everybody off including myself.

[Bobby O'Neal]

Good info, David and Chris. Thanks for the insight. I am one who is new to woodworking in general and am quickly learning the value and application benefits of good hand tools. So, I don't have any good planes. I wonder how much I would appreciate the difference between a WR or a LN. Would I even have the skills to tune up the WR to make it workable? I doubt it, at least to start with. I am willing to wait for a LN to know that I've got the quality and assurance of a good tool and to be able to trust it. I think in the end, I am not wanting to own two of the same plane, having hated the first (cheap) one the whole time I was waiting to afford the second. I am not sure if that would be the case here. If a WR did a good enough job for a while and the LN is a step up, and I still feel good about the work done with the WR, then ok.

[jerry nazard]

I could not believe it when she got me the LN 4-1/2 for Christmas.

Larry,

That gets you a very serious "Woo".... :D

-Jerry

_________________________

To add something to the thread: I bought a WR #4 when they first came out. The plane needed a fair bit of tuning, which I spaced out (piddled with) over a period of a year or so. In it's current state, the plane pulls nice sub-.001 shavings and will probably be a keeper. Several well respected fellows of this esteemed community have commented on problems with backlash. This doesn't seem to be an issue with my plane, and perhaps I am just lucky. Just grinding the blade back and getting it square improved the plane immensely.

[Don Dorn]

i would like to take this moment to go off on a 7 paragraph tangent that pisses everybody off including myself.

Go ahead, I probably couldn't keep focused on it anyway. Each time I see a post from you, I can't help but picture your wife waving her plane blade in the air when she wants it sharpened. I really shouldn't have had a mouth full of soda when I read that.

[Chris Griggs]

This thread should be a model for a lot of other threads. It had humor and even managed to answer the question concerning the planes.

I had a Woodriver plane and after some work, it did a reasonable job. I also have several LN planes and they are pretty much ready out of the box. They feel better, look better and work better than the Wood River but cost a bunch more. Is it worth it? Probably depends on how much is in your wallet and what you using them for.

In my case, it also depends on what my Chief Financial Officer approves. I could not believe it when she got me the LN 4-1/2 for Christmas.

Well said Larry. By the way how do you like the larger size of the 4 1/2 compared to a No 4?

Also, how did you get her to get you one? Despite not so subtle hints, I haven't even been able to get my fiance to give me an LV apron plane. Soon after we got engaged she asked me if women ever gave guys engagement gifts. I tried and failed to convince her that an engagement plane would be appropriate. Oh well, looks like I'll have to buy it for myself.

[Harlan Barnhart]

This sounds a lot like the quote I saw yesterday, can't remember where it was from:

Definition of the suburbs - "a place where they cut down all of the trees and then name the streets after them."

In my neighborhood (suburban), the streets are all named after animals and people doing activities that you used to be able to do before the burbs were there, with the obligatory random monopoly game street thrown in the middle - no tree names, though, maybe because most of the trees are still there.

So true. It's almost as if we are trying to compensate for the destruction of these things by memorializing the name. My father-in-law in northern Canada tells me of hunting trips with First Nations people who have cut off the beard of the fallen moose and throw it into the river to appease the spirit of the moose. Perhaps this naming ritual fills a similar purpose.

[Jake Helmboldt]

Well said Larry. By the way how do you like the larger size of the 4 1/2 compared to a No 4?

Also, how did you get her to get you one? Despite not so subtle hints, I haven't even been able to get my fiance to give me an LV apron plane. Soon after we got engaged she asked me if women ever gave guys engagement gifts. I tried and failed to convince her that an engagement plane would be appropriate. Oh well, looks like I'll have to buy it for myself.

My wife and mom went halves on a LN 4 1/2 while in their showroom for my birthday a couple years ago. Then a month later at Christmas the progressive pitch dovetail saw appeared. My wife said "I figured even if you don't use it it is a beautiful tool to have".:D I like her.

[David Weaver]

Good info, David and Chris. Thanks for the insight. I am one who is new to woodworking in general and am quickly learning the value and application benefits of good hand tools. So, I don't have any good planes. I wonder how much I would appreciate the difference between a WR or a LN. Would I even have the skills to tune up the WR to make it workable? I doubt it, at least to start with. I am willing to wait for a LN to know that I've got the quality and assurance of a good tool and to be able to trust it. I think in the end, I am not wanting to own two of the same plane, having hated the first (cheap) one the whole time I was waiting to afford the second. I am not sure if that would be the case here. If a WR did a good enough job for a while and the LN is a step up, and I still feel good about the work done with the WR, then ok.

It depends on whether or not it's "good", i guess. Some of the reviews say minor tuning, and others say no tuning, and other people felt like they could never get the planes right. I think woodcraft's return policy is pretty liberal, so you could probably return anything you didn't like.

I personally would spend the money on an LN first, just one if money is an object, but not so much so that you couldn't afford one LN, and then get WRs in other sizes. You'll have an excellent benchmark plane to judge all future bench planes by.

[Rick Markham]

Bobby, here is my take on the situation. Take it for what you want. I have gotten the plane bug bad so you are listening to a hardcore addict :D. Within the last year I have taken a lot of time to research and get very serious about planes and handtools in general. I have been woodworking for about 9 years now as a passion, I was largely a powertool junky until I found Neanderthal haven LOL, now I see the benefits of both.

Now to my point, nothing is more frustrating than having a plane that doesn't work, especially when you don't really fully understand why or how they are supposed to work. With the expense of these things, and since I am a firm believer in a simple fact of ME, is that I generally want something, and if I buy something lesser than what I want... I won't be satisfied with a "stop gap" or "lesser" item. I also believe that a plane should last many lifetimes, if cared for.

I chose as a first plane a LN no.8. The way I figured it, I am in the "hobby" for a lifetime, I'm tired of buying tools I am not going to be satisfied with for my lifetime. I also figured it would give me a great starting point as a reference, right out of the box. I have no one around here to teach me, and show me why my plane isn't performing the way it should. These are things that I have had to learn on my own, through research here, books, and tinkering. Me I fell in love with mine as soon as it glided across a piece of wood. (I knew I was in trouble LOL)

The simple fact that it worked right the first time, and i could figure out what changed during it's use, that caused it to work better, or worse, and because of kind folks here, and many authors, I understand why, and how it all works, and how to adjust everything has been a god send.

My advice, find someone who knows planes who can show you, it's much easier to learn with instruction. If that's not possible, choose something that isn't going to be frustrating and ask as many questions as possible here as you can. Great friendly knowledgeable folks who are willing to nurture (enable) your future addiction.

That being said, one of my favorite planes I have is a #3 Stanley bailey that I fettled myself, no it doesn't perform like my LN 4 1/2, but it is dang close with it's original iron. Learning planes without someone helping me, would that be the outcome with that plane... I doubt it, it would still be rusty and sitting in my tool chest under my Random Orbital Sander.

Take it for what it is... The learning curve exists no matter what you choose, for me with no one around (in person) to explain and show me precisely what's going on, it was better for me to start with something I knew, wouldn't become frustrating and anger me, and just become another unused gadget in a drawer.

[Bobby O'Neal]

Thanks, Rick. I think I'm somewhere in your same line of thinking. Bottom line being, a tool that performs sub par will do more damage than the money it will save me. That being said it doesn't have to be a LN to meet expectations..........or maybe it does. When you're first experience with planes is in the internet age and you can watch Rob Cosman on Youtube doing unbelievable things with hand tools, it sets the bar high.

[Rick Markham]

Yeah, my thing regarding watching someone plane online, you actually get very little from the experience. One of the biggest helps that I got was with Daneb from LN at their tool expo. Even with that, it's still a whole lot better with someone teaching ya hands on one on one.

Yeah, I'm definitely not advocating running out and buying a $475 jointer like I did. But you are doing things right and trying to make a wise choice and get opinions on getting something quality. I would also look at Lee valley, everyone here seems to love them, and they are generally a little less expensive than LN,

Like I said, I have no experience with Wood River, so I can't tell ya anything about them.

The best resources that I can suggest, other than here, are Chris Schwartz Coarse Medium and Fine, and David Charlesworth's three books, A guide to handtools and techniques, Furniture making techniques, and Furniture making techniques II. Charlesworth's books have helped me the most as far as setting planes up, and refining their operation. He is a master furniture maker turned teacher, and a very very detail oriented guy, so the minor details most of us would never consider, he has considered and explains very clearly. The Chris Schwartz video is excellent for becoming efficient with their usage.

[Bobby O'Neal]

Thanks again, Rick. I agree, watching the Coz on Youtube isn't a stand alone teaching method, but it gives you an idea of what the tool is capable of when in skilled hands. I don't have RC's skills but i am sharp enough to learn over time and want a tool that I wont outgrow. Good stuff.

[Rick Markham]

Something I thought about this morning after I made that last post: I don't get to Woodcraft as much as I would like (It's an hour and a half drive for me, but it is close to the beach I go to) and I am heading up there this weekend. I will ask while I am there if they have any of the wood river planes in their teaching room, and see if they will let me give a couple a try. It might be worth asking at your local one, the older fellas there don't always have an answer for me, but they generally do everything they can to help me out when I am there. I know most woodcrafts have a class they offer with hand tools, I would assume (complete assumption) that they would probably have planes that they sell in their teaching workshop. If they do here, I will try and give ya an impression of my take on them. Hopefully your local one will have them available and you can get a first hand impression. Nothing beats trying one yourself!

I'd ask around here in Neanderthal haven and see if there is anyone in your area, that would be willing to spend a little shop time and let ya try theirs, and give ya some first hand advice and tool time. ;)

[Chris Griggs]

Bobbie, one more thought/question. What size/number plane are you thinking of getting and what do you foresee you will mainly use it for? I ask because this may guide your buying decision. For example, a No 5 or 6 doesn't necessarily need to be LN quality. My WR no. 6 is more than good enough to do what I ask it to. However, if you're looking for a true finisher/smoother you probably would want to pop for an LN/LV. A WR might be a fine finisher as well, but I haven't used the 3 or 4 so can't say for sure. Oh yeah, if you''re ever in the New Orleans area, you're welcome to try mine.

[Steve Dallas]

I would like to put a placeholder in for all of the future posts:
* "I would never buy anything from China"
* "nobody should buy these, they should rehabilitate planes that are perforated with rust"
* "someone has to make a plane for people who can't buy lie nielsens"
* "I know deneb and tom, and I'd never buy anything but lie nielsens"
* "you're stupid, I'm stupid, they're stupid, we're stupid"
* "calm down, this thread is going to be locked"
* "i'm sorry, you're sorry, they're sorry, we're sorry - but that doesn't change the fact that I was right"
* "hooray for the mods, the mods are great. Thanks for the service"
* "Chris Schwartz says.."
* "testimony by three people who actually have the planes" (this one is, of course, ignored by everyone, including the people who just want to know "the truth" about whether or not they're junk).
* "woodcraft 20% off sale ruined the world"
* "japan woodworker - borg"
* "you're stupid again, i'm stupid again, they're stupid again, we're all stupid"
* Thread locked
* Thread disappears

3 months from now, we recycle. :D

Absolutely, positively, priceless.

[Bobby O'Neal]

Chris, initially my desire for a good plane always comes up in a flattening situation. Eventually i'd like to have a smoother for finishing, but to start with I'd say flattening glue ups and face jointing before running boards through my planer are my needs.

[Andrew Gibson]

This sounds a lot like the quote I saw yesterday, can't remember where it was from:

Definition of the suburbs - "a place where they cut down all of the trees and then name the streets after them."



I am pretty sure that is from You, Me and Dupree... or however you spell Dupree.

[Chris Griggs]

Bobbie,

Once again I'm a relative newbie but I'll leave you with this. From what you describe a WR No 6 would likely serve you well. However, that's not to say you shouldn't get an LV or LN. One of the reasons I went with the WR is because I really needed a long plane to take on some projects I had, and didn't have the money at that moment to get an LN or LV. If you have the money for an LV/LN or are willing/able to wait until you do, I'd say go for it. I agree that starting with an LV/LN would provide you with a great place from which to measure other planes against. The WR would likely be plenty good enough, but it's not like you'll ever regret owning something better. I don't know if your wondering about what size to get, but whatever brand you go with I'd say a 5 1/2, 6, or 7, would be a could choice for the purposes you describe.

Finally, I don't know if you've read Chris Schwarz's article "Understanding Bench Planes", but you should definitely check it out if you need info on different size planes or bevel-up vs bevel down. I'm not sure if I'm allowed to post the link to the article but if you Google "Understanding Bench Planes" it will be the first thing to come up.

[Bobby O'Neal]

Thanks, Chris

[David Weaver]

Some clarification ... from what "I hear", they went offline and back online due to some changes made to the insides of the casting - to go to their own design, and to beef up the adjuster and some threaded parts to tighten things up.

Since I have never even seen a WR plane in person, someone who has an old one and who gets a new one can detail what that means in terms of how the planes are in use.

[Chris Griggs]

Intriguing. The block plane looks to be a knuckle joint style now. I don't think is was before. Clearly Woodcraft was paying attention to last year's controversies over their planes. I wonder if Fine Woodworking will do a second review of these.

http://www.woodcraft.com/Images/products/151125.jpg http://http://www.woodcraft.com/Images/products/151125.jpg

[David Weaver]

Intriguing. The block plane looks to be a knuckle joint style now.

That's the word I got, different than the prior design, knuckle block planes now, based on stanley design but with some modifications (no clue what those would be).

If a creeker who has a lot of tools and experience got some of the bench planes and reviewed them, I'd feel just as good about those reviews as I would from FWW. No slight to FWW, because I think they run an honest publication, it's just nice to get other data points.

I ponied up the bucks and bought the bench chisels with bubinga handles when there was all of the scuttle about whether or not they were any good. I needed more chisels like I need an extra buttcheek, but I guess I'll turn them into a set of 8 skews or something at some point. Someone else will have to pony up the WR plane dollars - be really more instructive if it was someone who already had one of the other ones, and some experience with more and less expensive planes.

[Kevin Grady]

That's the word I got, different than the prior design, knuckle block planes now, based on stanley design but with some modifications (no clue what those would be).

If a creeker who has a lot of tools and experience got some of the bench planes and reviewed them, I'd feel just as good about those reviews as I would from FWW. No slight to FWW, because I think they run an honest publication, it's just nice to get other data points.

I ponied up the bucks and bought the bench chisels with bubinga handles when there was all of the scuttle about whether or not they were any good. I needed more chisels like I need an extra buttcheek, but I guess I'll turn them into a set of 8 skews or something at some point. Someone else will have to pony up the WR plane dollars - be really more instructive if it was someone who already had one of the other ones, and some experience with more and less expensive planes.


Hi David,

What is your opinion of the bench chisels and are they the same chisels that woodcraft has on sale right now for $49.99 for a set of 8?

Thanks,
Kevin

[David Weaver]

Kevin, yes, those are the same ones. They are fine. I got them because I stuck my neck out and said that usually chisels where a hardness spec is given are at least going to be harder and more suitable for woodworking than a hardware store chisel that is intentionally left soft. Someone asked about them on WN and the reply was "have to be junk, made in china", but nobody had tried them.

Basically same deal as now, since they were cheap, I just ordered them - it's a little over $6 a chisel, figuring that's just the cost of curiosity. Shipping was free then, I think it might be again now.

I think for the price when they're on sale they are great (actually, I don't have any idea where else you can get a chisel that's not offensive for that price - they're even cheaper than narex chisels). They weren't in a class with LNs in terms of the level of preparedness or delicate bevels, but they weren't hard to prepare and they hold an edge suitably well (i.e., I think their claim of 59 hardness is probably accurate), and the bevels on the ones I got, at least, aren't offensive and tall like hardware store chisels - they're acceptable. I set them up between 25 and 30 degrees with a hollow grind and they are fine, similar in durability to a lot of my vintage chisels.

I have used mine just after getting them to see what they were like to clean out the mortise for a wooden plane. I don't know what it would take to break one of the handles (people voiced a concern about that since they don't have a hoop on the handles), but I didn't have any issues using a beech mallet and I struck the ones I struck harder than I would in normal use. I haven't really used them much since then, but the things that would hurt a bubinga chisel handle are probably things that should be done with mortise chisels, anyway.

They are good enough that I also bought the butt chisels, which I actually did need and I didn't like the looks of the crown chisels for the price. I am pleased with those, too.

From time to time, WC sends me something to look at and provide my thoughts, but in this case, I bought the chisels straight up and these are my honest thoughts on them. Best lower-cost chinese-made chisels I've used, first ones I've seen, actually, that gave a hardness spec and seem to live up to it.

[Kevin Grady]

Kevin, yes, those are the same ones. They are fine. I got them because I stuck my neck out and said that usually chisels where a hardness spec is given are at least going to be harder and more suitable for woodworking than a hardware store chisel that is intentionally left soft. Someone asked about them on WN and the reply was "have to be junk, made in china", but nobody had tried them.

Basically same deal as now, since they were cheap, I just ordered them - it's a little over $6 a chisel, figuring that's just the cost of curiosity. Shipping was free then, I think it might be again now.

I think for the price when they're on sale they are great (actually, I don't have any idea where else you can get a chisel that's not offensive for that price - they're even cheaper than narex chisels). They weren't in a class with LNs in terms of the level of preparedness or delicate bevels, but they weren't hard to prepare and they hold an edge suitably well (i.e., I think their claim of 59 hardness is probably accurate), and the bevels on the ones I got, at least, aren't offensive and tall like hardware store chisels - they're acceptable. I set them up between 25 and 30 degrees with a hollow grind and they are fine, similar in durability to a lot of my vintage chisels.

I have used mine just after getting them to see what they were like to clean out the mortise for a wooden plane. I don't know what it would take to break one of the handles (people voiced a concern about that since they don't have a hoop on the handles), but I didn't have any issues using a beech mallet and I struck the ones I struck harder than I would in normal use. I haven't really used them much since then, but the things that would hurt a bubinga chisel handle are probably things that should be done with mortise chisels, anyway.

They are good enough that I also bought the butt chisels, which I actually did need and I didn't like the looks of the crown chisels for the price. I am pleased with those, too.

From time to time, WC sends me something to look at and provide my thoughts, but in this case, I bought the chisels straight up and these are my honest thoughts on them. Best lower-cost chinese-made chisels I've used, first ones I've seen, actually, that gave a hardness spec and seem to live up to it.


Dave,

Thanks for the quick and detailed response. I've been thinking about pulling the trigger on them since they are on sale + free shipping. This hobby (addiction??!:eek:) is new for me and justifying expensive hand tools with the boss is not easy yet, so I'm trying to keep things relatively inexpensive until I produce something the wife likes :D

[David Weaver]

I think you'll find them to work out fine. If you don't, you can always return them.

[David Weaver]

Now I remember where I saw the suburbia quote - wilbur pan quoted it on his blog title.

It's a bill vaughan quote. His quotes remind me of ashleigh brilliant, sort of....another great bunch of quotes to search out.