"Best" brand vs. Dan's Whetstone Arkansas stones?

[David Weaver]

This goes with the other post I put up about what is essentially the black razor hone I got from woodcraft.

Due to my inability to get to flea markets and public sales, I guess I'll be buying a hard black arkansas.

I only want to buy one, and I want it to be a good one.

There is a seller on ebay who sells "BEST" branded hard black stones, advertises them to be 2500 grit.

There is also the more expensive Dan's Whetstone brand, and he advertises his hard black to be as fine or finer than an 8k waterstone.

I know enough to know that at these stones may actually be the same fineness. Unless someone is looking under a dissection microscope to see the patterns, the "Best" 2500 and the 8000+ that Dan's says may be the same thing.

I am no stranger to sharpening goods (this is probably actually the last qualified different medium I haven't given a fair shake at), but oil stones are the final frontier for me. I *need* (want?) to get a good one to get a good view of the world of oil stones and see if they're worth putting in a drawer of my sharpening bench.

Is the Dan's brand worth the price difference?

[Kevin Adams]

Dan's is supposed to be very good. I have a hard black from Hall's Pro-edge and it is excellent (I recall it was also quite a bit less expensive than Dan's, too). I know nothing about the ebay seller you mentioned, but my recommendation would be to go with a proven quarry where they have been mining these stones for generations...either Dan's or Hall's.

Another option if you want to consider it, is a translucent. Personally, if I was only going to have one fine stone, it would be the 8"x2"x3/4" Norton stone that Joel (and others) sell. This stone is just about as fine as the hard black, but cuts faster. It leaves a nice polish and followed by a strop will give a great edge.

Good luck.
Kevin

[john brenton]

For some reason I want to think that oil stones are not recommended for straights. My razor hone is a Smith's Arkansas stone that they sell at Home Depot. I had bought it years ago and it was in nasty condition. I just lapped it (they lap really easily) and pried it off the plastic base and it works great with water. It has a great grit for razor tough up work, followed by a green rouge strop and then the leather has gotten me by for the last few years and I wet shave with the straight everyday.


This goes with the other post I put up about what is essentially the black razor hone I got from woodcraft.

Due to my inability to get to flea markets and public sales, I guess I'll be buying a hard black arkansas.

I only want to buy one, and I want it to be a good one.

There is a seller on ebay who sells "BEST" branded hard black stones, advertises them to be 2500 grit.

There is also the more expensive Dan's Whetstone brand, and he advertises his hard black to be as fine or finer than an 8k waterstone.

I know enough to know that at these stones may actually be the same fineness. Unless someone is looking under a dissection microscope to see the patterns, the "Best" 2500 and the 8000+ that Dan's says may be the same thing.

I am no stranger to sharpening goods (this is probably actually the last qualified different medium I haven't given a fair shake at), but oil stones are the final frontier for me. I *need* (want?) to get a good one to get a good view of the world of oil stones and see if they're worth putting in a drawer of my sharpening bench.

Is the Dan's brand worth the price difference?

[David Weaver]

I'm actually going to be using this for just tools, I think.

I have no doubt that anything really will do a straight fine. I have had fine experience on my straight with a shapton, another waterstone and the chinese waterstone from WC. I think the razor folks get just as carried away as we do, and I'll bet a good skill set on anything 6k grit or above can make a comfortable shave as long as the honing and stropping is done well.

I do just what you do. I go from stone to a stropping with green stuff, and then maintenance strop just with fromm's stuff on another strop. Never had an issue with any of the shaves as long as I've taken time and paid attention to the honing and stropping.

But anyway, I want to try oilstones for old tools and one set of HC chisels I have. The shaptons eat them alive, and since all of my old stuff save the rounded edge woodies is hollow ground, I would trade the cutting speed for a little less stiction.

[David Weaver]

Dan's is supposed to be very good. I have a hard black from Hall's Pro-edge and it is excellent (I recall it was also quite a bit less expensive than Dan's, too). I know nothing about the ebay seller you mentioned, but my recommendation would be to go with a proven quarry where they have been mining these stones for generations...either Dan's or Hall's.

Another option if you want to consider it, is a translucent. Personally, if I was only going to have one fine stone, it would be the 8"x2"x3/4" Norton stone that Joel (and others) sell. This stone is just about as fine as the hard black, but cuts faster. It leaves a nice polish and followed by a strop will give a great edge.

Good luck.
Kevin

Kevin - thanks for reminding me of Halls. Forgot, and was looking between Best, Dan's and Nortons.

There's a vendor online that has halls surgical black in 12x3x1 for $96.50 and apparently free shipping, so that kind of seals the deal.

I like big stones.

[Derek Cohen]

I would trade the cutting speed for a little less stiction.

David, if that is all you want, then simply add a little soft soap to the water that you spritz on the Shaptons. Works for me.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[David Weaver]

That's a pretty good idea.

bit late, though!

I do have plenty of stones that don't have stiction, though, I guess curiosity is driving me to try the stones more than anything else.

In my space compromised shop, it's more convenient to experiement with stones than it is with planes or machines. I still have some drawer space.

[James Carmichael]

I'm not sure what you guys are talking about with "hard black", etc.

Last time I looked a Arkansas stones, the finest grades, in order, are Surgical Black and Translucent.

Try googling Hand American to see if they're still around. IIRC, they buy stones from Halls and actually undercut them on price.

I recall an Ebay seller, maybe the one you're referring to, who sold slightly flawed translucent stones at a pretty good price.

[David Weaver]

In this case, it was some place called Knife Merchant or something like that. I looked at the site you mentioned, and their order page is down to change servers, so I can't tell what price they have. I already ordered, though.

They (knife merchant) didn't list the stones as seconds, though they could be, you never know. I don't worry too much about whether or not they're seconds, though, as long as it doesn't materially affect the ability of the stone to sharpen. The picture shows a uniform stone, though, and not one with faults.

The only reason I used the term hard black instead of surgical black is because it seems like half or more of the places I've seen list hard black or translucent. I could be "misremembering, though", i'm not up on the terms.

This one, I think, was listed as black arkansas or something, and the picture showed the lid of the stone case stamped "surgical black". I would've called before ordering if the case didn't say "surgical black" on it.

I don't expect it to outcut (speed or finish) nakayama stones, but I'm sure it'll be easier to use. "need" isn't the issue, though, anyway. Need was met by the first set of kings I ever got - I still haven't seen a steel type they won't hone fairly quickly, and I never minded flattening them once I got away from using sandpaper to do it.

I do expect the oilstones to be different and interesting, though. I'll be interested in seeing what the edge looks like under the microscope compared to other stones.