Bandsaw Choices: Griz, Jet, Powermatic - Help?

[John Mark Lane]

Hi Folks,

I know from other things that newbies jumping into serious boards with dumb questions gets tiresome. So I apologize in advance. I spent a good bit of time with the Search function here. There's a ton of stuff on Grizzly tools, most of it favorable, a fair amount on Jet, also favorable, and I rarely see anyone say anything bad about Powermatic.

FWIW, I'm not a newb to woodworking, but a former professional, returning to it as a hobby now. I'm building a small shop in a basement space to work with my children and make small projects. TS, BS, lunchbox planer to store under the bench, small-ish jointer, cross-cut saw etc... I'm starting from scratch with a modestly decent budget. I will be using the tools one or two days a week, relatively light use, but I care about quality.

I consider the bandsaw to be a critical piece. I expect to do a fair amount of resawing, mostly hardwoods (walnut, maple, etc), mostly "small-ish" pieces (6-8 inch widths, under 2 feet in length). Also circle cuts etc. I want a good bandsaw.

Grizzly seems to have a ridiculous selection of bandsaws in their lineup. I'm guessing the G0555X is the closest to what I need. It's $695. Oddly the closest Jet from what I can see is the JWBS 14CS, which is less at $599. Then the Powermatic PWBS 14CS 14 inch bandsaw is $999. So theoretically all of these are in the range of what I'm willing to spend.

Should I just get the Powermatic? I'd rather not spend $400 for nothing but gold paint and resale value. In your opinions, would I experience a difference in functionality among these three tools?

Thanks for any thoughts you might be willing to share.

Mark

[Bill Huber]

I am far from a band saw expert...

I have the Jet, its a very good saw but if I was doing it over again I would get the Grizzly.

I had to buy a fence, comes with the Grizz, had to buy a tension release, comes with the Grizz.

From what I have seen of the PM, it is a Jet with a few things added and painted gold.

[Cary Falk]

Hi Folks,

Then the Powermatic PWBS 14CS 14 inch bandsaw is $999. So theoretically all of these are in the range of what I'm willing to spend.



Mark


If you are willing to spend 1k on a bandsaw then get the G0513x2. You won't be disappointed. There are quite a few members on this forum that have it and love it(me included). It's in a whole different league as the 14"(even the PM).

[Brendan Plavis]

I know that its not in your list, but Delta 976(pretty sure these are the numbers(the one with the open stand) is a pretty good saw. I picked mine up for less than $350 after state tax. Now it doesnt come with a fence, or Mitre Guage... But, I have been able to resaw 99% of things I put through it.... including a nail...:eek: But add those, and you have a good saw, for the price.

It only has a .75hp motor, but, I have managed to saw oak logs with it(thats whats in my yard... and in my firewood pile..) with a 14tpi blade(it was slow going because of this... but... that is my next purchase, a 3tpi blade, as well as a hatchet(went to take the pick axe to some wood, and ended up injuring my hand when the head slid down on me...:mad:) to knock some of the bark off...)

If you add a riser kit to it, then you can definately saw the 8in boards...


Another thing to consider is Laguana. I just saw on their site, that their 14in is about $1200 with free shipping.. Those are supposed to be the best you can get..

I have never used anything except a Delta, so I cannot really say from experience, except for speculate.

[John Mark Lane]

Thanks for the replies.

Bill -- other than the fence and tension release, do you think the Jet is any "better" than the Griz? I'll probably end up with an aftermarket fence system anyway....

Cary -- my concern re the larger "square-ish" bandsaws is size. My shop is 16 by 10 (yup, I said small). I'm allocating a "corner" for the BS, but even ceiling height is sort of an issue -- just over 7 feet where heating ductwork cuts across. Griz says that saw is "20 inches deep", but think that must be a typo. I love those big BS's, but I think they're just too big.

Brendan -- re the Laguna, see above re size. It's a gorgeous machine and I'd love to have one. But again, I think they're just too big... ?

As for the Delta, I had one of those. It was...ok. I think I want a beefier motor. And -- correct me if I'm wrong -- I'm guessing the closed base saws are better at dust collection? I really don't know, just guessing on that. DC is important as this is a basement shop. I plan to have a DC system and a ceiling mount air cleaner (sandwiched between ductwork lengths).

I guess at this point I'm thinking it's the Jet or the Griz, and trying to determine whether there is any quality difference between them. I realize that's a big question (or a little one). I may try to order other stationary tools from the same source in the same brand and get a price break, so it may also affect what I get for a jointer etc.

Thanks again, folks. Really very much appreciated.

Mark

[Joe Wiliams]

Have you considered Rikon? Their 14" Deluxe 10-325 is currently at the top of my list.

http://www.rikontools.com/products_bandsaws.htm

The Jet and PM aren't on the list at all. Unless one comes up used nearby. They seem to be over priced for what you get when compared to Grizzly & Rikon.

[John Mark Lane]

I never heard of Rikon. Are they new to the scene? I'm skeptical of newer companies. (I've been skeptical of Grizzly for...uh, a long time. :) ) Once upon a time I bought a "Reliant" bandsaw (almost forgot about that thing, it was imminently forgettable). As far as I can see, that "brand" doesn't even exist any more.

Is Rikon a real player? Serious question, I never heard of them....

Mark

[Joe Wiliams]

I don't know how long they have been around, I'm fairly new to this scene:rolleyes: I have read several positive customer service reports here at SMC. Woodcraft, Sears and others carry their products.

[Frank Warta]

Edit: Well Joe beat me to it...

You may want to look at the Rikon 10-325 as well. Don't own one myself so take this with a grain of salt of coarse, but it looks like a very nice machine and for the most part the reviews I've read have been very complimentary.

I know the G0555X is also very popular, but for about $100 extra you get a bit more. A modern steel frame design, 13" of resaw out of the box, and as far I can tell you're mostly giving up the cast iron wheels and the ridiculous customer service that SMC members seem to get from grizzly.

I think if resaw capacity over 6" is really important to you not having to deal with a riser might make the Rikon a better performer in the long run. At least that's my $0.02.

[Brendan Plavis]

I never heard of Rikon. Are they new to the scene? I'm skeptical of newer companies. (I've been skeptical of Grizzly for...uh, a long time. :) ) Once upon a time I bought a "Reliant" bandsaw (almost forgot about that thing, it was imminently forgettable). As far as I can see, that "brand" doesn't even exist any more.

Is Rikon a real player? Serious question, I never heard of them....

Mark

Rikion I hear are excellent... But I am afraid they are a wee bit above me pay grade...(makes my wallet sweat just thinking about it...)

Not to mention, It may be a wee bit tall...

[John Stan]

Hi Folks,

I know from other things that newbies jumping into serious boards with dumb questions gets tiresome. So I apologize in advance. I spent a good bit of time with the Search function here. There's a ton of stuff on Grizzly tools, most of it favorable, a fair amount on Jet, also favorable, and I rarely see anyone say anything bad about Powermatic.

FWIW, I'm not a newb to woodworking, but a former professional, returning to it as a hobby now. I'm building a small shop in a basement space to work with my children and make small projects. TS, BS, lunchbox planer to store under the bench, small-ish jointer, cross-cut saw etc... I'm starting from scratch with a modestly decent budget. I will be using the tools one or two days a week, relatively light use, but I care about quality.

I consider the bandsaw to be a critical piece. I expect to do a fair amount of resawing, mostly hardwoods (walnut, maple, etc), mostly "small-ish" pieces (6-8 inch widths, under 2 feet in length). Also circle cuts etc. I want a good bandsaw.

Grizzly seems to have a ridiculous selection of bandsaws in their lineup. I'm guessing the G0555X is the closest to what I need. It's $695. Oddly the closest Jet from what I can see is the JWBS 14CS, which is less at $599. Then the Powermatic PWBS 14CS 14 inch bandsaw is $999. So theoretically all of these are in the range of what I'm willing to spend.

Should I just get the Powermatic? I'd rather not spend $400 for nothing but gold paint and resale value. In your opinions, would I experience a difference in functionality among these three tools?

Thanks for any thoughts you might be willing to share.

Mark

Mark,
I have had exceptional luck with my Grizzly tools. I very much enjoy my Grizzly bandsaw. I have been very disappointed with my one and last Powermatic purchase - both from a quality/performance and customer service stand point. Get the Grizzly, you will not be disappointed.

-John

[David Christopher]

John, I have the Rikon 10-325 14" bandsaw with 13" resaw capacity...if it broke I would buy another just like it

[Neil Brooks]

I've got the G0555X.

Originally, it was between that and the Rikon.

If you do a little searching, here, you'll find QUITE a few owners of each -- basically all more than satisfied.

I have the riser kit, but haven't yet installed it. Grizzly OEM blades are throwaway.

For daily use, I have TimberWolf. For resawing, WoodSlicer gets the top marks.

My wheels were coplanar. The saw set up perfectly. It's just quiet, and ... ready to do ... whatever I throw at it.

Put me in the ".... would buy it again, today, if I had to" camp.

Good luck !

[Sean Nagle]

Cary -- my concern re the larger "square-ish" bandsaws is size. My shop is 16 by 10 (yup, I said small). I'm allocating a "corner" for the BS, but even ceiling height is sort of an issue -- just over 7 feet where heating ductwork cuts across. Griz says that saw is "20 inches deep", but think that must be a typo. I love those big BS's, but I think they're just too big.

The steel frame saws are actually fairly compact. I have a 16" Laguna and an old 14" closed-stand Delta. The Laguna's footprint is no larger and possibly a hair smaller than the Delta's. Be sure to get some kind of mobility for the saw though. What I like about the steel frame bandsaws is the lower table height. You could arrange your shop such that a workbench could be used for an outfeed table coming off the back of the bandsaw.

[Gary Max]

I bought the wife a Grizzly bandsaw G0555x a couple years ago and she loves it.
This saws runs every day and never a minutes trouble.
Wish I could say that about the $2500.00 saw sitting in my shop ---but that's a different story.

[Rick Fisher]

PM always seems way over priced to me... I look, but cant see what all the fuss is about..

Grizzly has great customer service.. I think they are the best choice of the choices given..

I would spend the full $1000 and get a bigger saw.. With Bandsaw's " Size matters" ..

[Van Huskey]

The PM is a really nice saw but unless you care that it has Carter guides (which are indeed better than the rest, save ones more in the Laguna range) and Carter quick release it isn't that much better than the other 14" cast saws incrementally better yes BUT I would get a Laguna before I bought the PM. A lot of saw in a small space Rikon would be my choice. Very nice steel saw for the money and 13" resaw out of the box. On the economy front the Grizzlys are the value leaders.

[John Mark Lane]

I find it interesting that very few people have anything much to say about the Jet. There is a huge outpouring of support for Grizzly all over this board -- not a criticism, more of a learning observation. That is a very good thing for the company and something I'm sure they value (I've seen the owner post here). I'm just having a hard time "placiing" the two companies in terms of price-point/value analysis.

Should I just assume they are functionally equal in terms of quality?

Mark

[Van Huskey]

I find it interesting that very few people have anything much to say about the Jet. There is a huge outpouring of support for Grizzly all over this board -- not a criticism, more of a learning observation. That is a very good thing for the company and something I'm sure they value (I've seen the owner post here). I'm just having a hard time "placiing" the two companies in terms of price-point/value analysis.

Should I just assume they are functionally equal in terms of quality?

Mark


You have to consider each tool and not just the company and the Jet 14" cast saws are about equal to the Grizzly when you match the models via spec. Actually pretty much all the 14" cast Delta "clones" are in the same ball park some with a little better QC, some better CS and at least one with 3rd party "upgrades".

As I said before in the sub 1K 14" saw market I think Rikon gives the best saw for the money or maybe the G0457 from Grizzly, once above $600 I would rather have a steel saw.

[Van Huskey]

You have to consider each tool and not just the company and the Jet 14" cast saws are about equal to the Grizzly when you match the models via spec. Actually pretty much all the 14" cast Delta "clones" are in the same ball park some with a little better QC, some better CS and at least one with 3rd party "upgrades".

As I said before in the sub 1K 14" saw market I think Rikon gives the best saw for the money or maybe the G0457 from Grizzly, once above $600 I would rather have a steel saw.

A couple of potential positives to the Jet which usually runs about $100 more is a warranty which is 5 times as long and the ability to patronize a local business and depending on the store you purchase it from it may come with a lot of value added help (or may not).

[Dave MacArthur]

Mark,
In fact the footprint of the euro-style saws, even the 17" grizzly, is no larger than the 14". The splayed legs of the 14" cast iron saws you're looking at is virtually the same. The "footprint" for a 14" machine (G0555x in this case, they're all the same) is 17"x 16", BUT the actual "width/depth" the things take up due to motor sticking out back etc. is 30"x26", this is more than the H/D of the euro-saws. You can see some example measurements at this comparison chart Griz puts out, nice place to compare "standard" sizes:
http://cdn6.grizzly.com/pdf/Grizzly_BandsawComparisonChart.pdf

For mobility, the euro-style saws actually fit nicer on a mobility kit and roll around fine. I have a 14" delta cast iron BS, but have been looking at band saws like a religion for 2 years. I use a Laguna16 at my AF wood Hobby-shop. Having read maybe many reviews on band saws now, the ones in your price range maybe < $1000 that stand out in my mind are:

1. Grizzly G0513x2, summer sale Starts May 17th $895. The G0513 is $895 now, it may go for $800 or so. Of all band saws < $1400 I would say I have seen more vigorously enthusiastic posts on this saw than any other. If you do a google for "band saw reviews" and start working through them, at least to like page 20 where I quit, you will find massive accolades for this saw.

2. Grizzly G0555X, listed at $695 now, probably about $100 off on the summer sale. Many good reviews on this saw. HOWEVER, I personally would never get a 14" cast iron saw if I could swing the modern euro-style saw with numerous advances.

3. The Rikon 14" deluxe saw, won "best" of the 14inchers by hmm, PWW? maybe 3 years ago.

4. 14"Laguna SUV won best 14" last year from one of the mags, it looks great. However, for the same cost I'd get a bigger grizzly. But it's a great saw no doubt.

5. I wouldn't buy a Jet or Delta, based mainly on them faring mediocre in magazine reviews I've read, and probably not "best buy" material. Powermatic is almost always a good buy, their band saw is highly rated, but at their price point I'd go steel saw.

6. With your stated emphasis on resawing, I would certainly prioritize the square shaped eurostyle saws, the design allows them to tension a blade better for resaw without flex (so they say). I would not buy a CI 14" saw with a riser block with that intent for sure.

Look at my signature, the link to band saws, you might find some threads there that are helpful. Good luck!

[Van Huskey]

+1 to all of Dave's comments

[Joe Spear]

I love my Rikon with all its features. Luckily I live only five miles from the Rikon headquarters in Woburn, MA. Periodically they have a sale of returned, reconditioned machines. The engineers there go over everything thoroughly so that the machines work perfectly. I got my $800 bandsaw about three years ago for $500, and it was already assembled. I could have gotten one for $450, but it had a little dent in the bottom. Rikon is an excellent brand. It was started by some guys who were formerly with the late Woodworker's Warehouse company. I also have a Rikon midi-lathe and stand. The package was half the retail price. The lathe was unused except for being photographed once for one of their advertisements.

[Eric DeSilva]

I'd agree with David's comments as well. I bought a used PM 14" in almost new condition, spent ages tuning it and tried a pile of different blades for resawing. I could never get the thing to resaw even remotely acceptably. I finally gave up (wanna buy a used PM? if so, disregard everything I'm saying... :rolleyes:). I ended up with the Laguna 14SUV, which, while a 14" bandsaw, bears no relationship to other 14"ers. I love my Laguna.

[Curt Harms]

I find it interesting that very few people have anything much to say about the Jet. There is a huge outpouring of support for Grizzly all over this board -- not a criticism, more of a learning observation. That is a very good thing for the company and something I'm sure they value (I've seen the owner post here). I'm just having a hard time "placiing" the two companies in terms of price-point/value analysis.

Should I just assume they are functionally equal in terms of quality?

Mark

The owner/chairman/CEO monitors and posts to this board. He has also been know to step in to situations involving Grizzly products when necessary. This is appreciated and respected by members here. Grizzly is considered a value leader by many. I have the Rikon 10-325 and it's a good saw. Steel frame, 1.5 h.p. motor, cast iron wheels, 13" resaw. I replaced the factory base with my own lower mobile base because I wanted to lower the B.S. table a few inches. I may do another base and make the B.S. table the same height as the T.S. and jointer/planer. If ceiling height is an issue, a lower base is pretty easy to fabricate. Woodcraft stocks Rikon band saws if you have a Woodcraft nearby.

[David Helm]

I have owned the Jet for about 6 years. I bought the Jet because I already had the Jet cabinet saw and loved it. I also could buy it locally so the money circulated in my local economy. I am now buying (backordered) a new Grizzly TS (Grizzly headquarters are in my town so that is also a local purchase). The Jet bandsaw has served me well. I don't do a lot of resawing, but have had success with all I have done. I get my blades made up by a lcal saw shop as well.

[John Mark Lane]

Thank you for the responses. I'm presently looking at a couple of the steel saws. I've determined that 73" is about as tall as I can go -- the ceiling in the shop is 79" under the heating ductwork that runs the length of the shop down the side where the BS will go, but a stairway that it will have to go down to get into the basement is even more limited at one spot where it turns. A saw that breaks into two sections should be no problem, but there is no way I'll get an 80" tall saw into this shop, regardless.

The GO457 looks intriguing. Anyone know if that ships in two pieces (looks like it might). Seems like a compromise design, and I'll research reviews. The Laguna looks awesome, maybe a wee bit more than I really want to spend ($1000 was a bit much but I'd stretch for it). That comparison chart is very helpful, thanks! Wish all mftrs did things like that. Hard to even determine the footprint on a lot of these saws (eg the Laguna).

Mark

[John Mark Lane]

BTW -- the damm Jet website is crappy it's almost enough to turn me away from their tools in itself. (Sorry, just venting...)

[Michael Peet]

I have the PM 14" bandsaw. One of the bearings went bad on it right away, but they sent someone out immediately to fix it. It's been fine in the 2 or 3 years since then.

I spent some time tuning it up and it actually works really well for me now. The blade is 90° to the table and with a 1/2" woodslicer it can resaw 6" ash. The quick release and guide bearings are nice features, and it runs smoothly.

That said, if I had to do it again I would go with a Laguna, probably. The resaw capacity of the PM isn't that much, 6" is about the limit. Plus I would like the ability to tension a larger blade.

Mike

[mreza Salav]

PWW magazine did a review of still fram 14" bandsaws in Fall 2006 (included grizzly, general, Laguna, Rikon, Craftsman, and maybe a few others). Their pick was Rikon 14". I don't have it but it appears it's a very good value and the guides are also fine.

[Van Huskey]

The GO457 looks intriguing. Anyone know if that ships in two pieces (looks like it might). Seems like a compromise design, and I'll research reviews. The Laguna looks awesome, maybe a wee bit more than I really want to spend ($1000 was a bit much but I'd stretch for it). That comparison chart is very helpful, thanks! Wish all mftrs did things like that. Hard to even determine the footprint on a lot of these saws (eg the Laguna).

Mark

The G0457 ships in two containers for the sizes and weights go to the G0457 page on the Grizzly site and click the specification page link located unter the "gift cabana".

BTW the G0457 seems to be 73" tall, the same height as the 513 at least in the Grizzly specs.

[Bill Wyko]

My Grizzly 19" will be here on Friday. The vernier to tilt the table was a real clincher for me. A ton of features above the rest. IMHO The Griz it the way to go.

[John Mark Lane]

Van Huskey - thanks for the tip on the spec sheets. I hadn't noticed that. Good info there!

[Van Huskey]

My Grizzly 19" will be here on Friday. The vernier to tilt the table was a real clincher for me. A ton of features above the rest. IMHO The Griz it the way to go.


Not 100% sure by what you mean by "vernier" but if it is what I am thinking why wouldn't you use a Tiltbox et al to set the table angle, a lot more accurate.

[Joe Wiliams]

Here's another comparison list of Grizzly bandsaws. This one has 2009 pricing and more saws. I wonder which one is more accurate?

[Roger Newby]

+1 on Griz. I've had the G0555 with riser for almost 3 years now and can't say a bad word about it. I've resawn 10" oak with no problems...haven't had a board any wider to try yet. :p Can't say anything about customer service 'cause I haven't had any problems...nada. I did go to their showroom in Springfield a few years back and WOW! what a candy store!!!! When loml and I walked in, I asked her if she should hold my hand. She said "No, but give me the check book and credit card." :D

[Jeff Willard]

...the Laguna 14SUV, which, while a 14" bandsaw, bears no relationship to other 14"ers.

This is a 14" saw that thinks it's an 18" saw.

[Curt Harms]

Thank you for the responses. I'm presently looking at a couple of the steel saws. I've determined that 73" is about as tall as I can go -- the ceiling in the shop is 79" under the heating ductwork that runs the length of the shop down the side where the BS will go, but a stairway that it will have to go down to get into the basement is even more limited at one spot where it turns. A saw that breaks into two sections should be no problem, but there is no way I'll get an 80" tall saw into this shop, regardless.


Mark

That was one of the big reasons I went with the Rikon 10-325. The saw body is 54" high and after taking the table off, probably weighed 150 lbs. or less. Easy to move down basement steps.