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Phillip Ngan
04-22-2010, 3:57 PM
Tullies' "Stupid, stupid, stupid" (http://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=138579)thread was very enlightening. The basic lesson was "don't use a fence when cross-cutting on a table-saw". Of course the danger is obvious when one stops and thinks about the mechanics of what is happening. But as a newbie, I've done this many times, simply because "I didn't know what I didn't know."

So I was wondering if the old hands on SMC could offer other basic guidelines for workshop safety. I'm thinking particularly of practices that are not immediately obvious, but would be unpleasant to learn the hard way.

Thanks!

Neil Brooks
04-22-2010, 4:17 PM
http://woodworking.about.com/od/safetyfirst/tp/safetyRules.htm

http://www.ccohs.ca/oshanswers/safety_haz/woodwork/gen_safe.html

Dan Karachio
04-22-2010, 5:18 PM
Bravo Niel, like you I am open to all advice and lessons learned from all the experienced people here. I found the following useful specifically related to table saw safety:

http://www.woodcraft.com/Articles/Articles.aspx?articleid=317

http://www.woodworkersguide.com/2008/05/05/table-saw-safety-is-serious-business/

The Wood Whisperer has some good advice in this video:
http://thewoodwhisperer.com/episode-51-tablesaw-experience/

I believe he says something to the effect of, "If something does not feel right, stop, do not push through, just stop."

P.S. Tullie's thread motivated me to do something I have not caught up on - build new cross cutting sleds. One for large pieces and one smaller I will use more often.

David Helm
04-22-2010, 6:29 PM
One of the best guidelines I know of is to Engage the Brain before engaging the tool!

Nathan Callender
04-22-2010, 7:08 PM
My best advise would be to learn how to use each tool safely and what are safe and, more importantly, UNSAFE operations (climb cutting with a router, etc).

My other piece of advice is to never use a tools when distracted, pressured for time, or tired. I don't do this for a living, so I have the option that when any of those things happen, I just quit for the time being and do something else.

Dan Karachio
04-22-2010, 7:53 PM
David and Nathan, do you have any specific safety resources and/or resources on using tools correctly? As someone who has been into this for about 3 years, I now feel like I am highly educated on using all my power tools, but despite the plethora of information out there, it is not organized and I learned on my own - by doing and sometimes by mistakes, though none causing injury. Figuring this all out is not easy or as obvious as experienced people might think and making mistakes that lead to injury does not mean the person is stupid, has an inferior brain, did not engage their brain... In the old days we had shop class in junior high where you were taught how to use power tools. I think shop class is long gone in most schools and has been for a long long time. There are a lot of people interested in all this, but starting only with the saw/router manual is not going to cover it all.

glenn bradley
04-22-2010, 8:44 PM
As mentioned, use the fence or the miter gauge/sled, not both. Generally sled or miter for boards that are wider than the cross cut is long and the reverse for the fence and rip cuts. Oh man, I just realized this could get out of hand, just for the tablesaw:

- use a splitter whenever possible.
- use a guard whenever possible
- never stand in line with the blade
- keep your hand away from the blade 6 - 8"; if you have to get closer than that, use push blocks or find some other way to make the cut.
- "Just this once" is what every four fingered man has said in the past.
- unplug the saw (no the switch isn't good enough) whenever changing blades or placing your hands near the blade for setups.
- turn the saw off before leaving the tool
- lower the blade when your done for the day; other folks don't pay as much attention as we do when they use the saw for a drop zone for groceries.
- oh so many more; I guarantee there are books at the library.

Neil Brooks
04-22-2010, 9:02 PM
but starting only with the saw/router manual is not going to cover it all.

In all seriousness, and with all due respect for the potential "politics" of this ... I find my manuals are *obnoxious* about safety warnings, and usually give fantastic tips about what to do and what not to do.

Guess why ;)

I'm not enough of a "Read The * Manual" guy, but ... I/we should.

At least.

Quoth Brother Norm, too ;)

Kevin Groenke
04-22-2010, 9:11 PM
I severed a thumb and finger in an incident similar to the one Tullie described: defective fence and I didn't know then what I know now, my supervisor kinda let me down too.

Hand BEHIND chisel, clamps in front of/under chisel.

I think Marc Adams' dvd's are pretty good, but I don't see that you can buy just the safety one.
https://marcadams.us/xcart/home.php?cat=1

I'll share a link to our handbook. It's very basic but lays a level ground for all our users. Following all of the SOP's within should keep you out of trouble:
http://design.umn.edu/current_students/leo/hall/documents/WShb_09.pdf

Be safe.

-kg

Dan Karachio
04-22-2010, 9:19 PM
I just realized something. I am really not asking for me. Via my own time, work, reading and doing AND reading so much here, I feel pretty much on top of safety with all my tools. I was thinking about the newbie, but any newbie who comes here and spends some time is going to learn quite a lot. Any newbie who just jumps into it and does not seek out fellow woodworkers (like that surgeon who free hand cross cut on a table saw and lost a few fingers) is pretty much beyond anyone's control.

Jim Falsetti
04-22-2010, 9:31 PM
Dan - I think an excellent resource is Hendrik Varju's table saw video. It is nearly 10 hours long, and he stresses safety throughout the video. Hendrik covers many situations you are likely to encounter.

It is by far the most complete tutorial I have seen on how to set up and use your table saw.

Jim

Jim Rimmer
04-22-2010, 10:25 PM
As mentioned, use the fence or the miter gauge/sled, not both. Generally sled or miter for boards that are wider than the cross cut is long and the reverse for the fence and rip cuts. Oh man, I just realized this could get out of hand, just for the tablesaw:

- use a splitter whenever possible.
- use a guard whenever possible
- never stand in line with the blade
- keep your hand away from the blade 6 - 8"; if you have to get closer than that, use push blocks or find some other way to make the cut.
- "Just this once" is what every four fingered man has said in the past.
- unplug the saw (no the switch isn't good enough) whenever changing blades or placing your hands near the blade for setups.
- turn the saw off before leaving the tool
- lower the blade when your done for the day; other folks don't pay as much attention as we do when they use the saw for a drop zone for groceries.
- oh so many more; I guarantee there are books at the library.
Wait for the blade to stop spinning before removing off cuts.

Phillip Ngan
04-22-2010, 11:15 PM
Thanks to all the responses so far: they have all been helpful.

There's something specific that I've seen and have been wondering if this relates to a safety concern. When ripping on a table saw, most pictures I've seen uses the fence on the right of the blade. Is this a safety related practice?

I'm going to follow up on all the links to further reading.

Jeff Bratt
04-23-2010, 12:07 AM
I'm going to through in one more thing that is sometimes mentioned in books, but not in this thread - yet. A characteristic of a table saw - and also a band saw, jointer, and sometimes a router or shaper - is that you are actively pushing your workpiece - often with your bare hands - towards that sharp, unforgiving cutter. When planning your cuts, always think about what might happen - on that rare occasion - when that work piece slips, catches, or otherwise suddenly moves out of the way. Where will your hands go now? How might you use pushers, clamps, a sled, or other fixturing to hold that workpiece safely?

Barry Wilson
04-23-2010, 12:17 AM
I can not speak for a left handed person. I had to cut with the fence to the left of the blade today. I am right handed and found it very awkward.

First I found it difficult to see if the work was tight to the fence. I do not think it is just a matter of what you are are conditioned to either. It seems very strange. Just consider where you want to put your right hand when feeding through work. Your mind wants to normally push to the fence a little. Of course that implies to the left on that side.

What is strange is I have been using table saws on and off since 1955. Today was the first time I ever remember doing this and the same day reading this thread. I am new on site by the way.

Since it was a new application I was extra careful. I have always been that way because if you were to amputate a finger I really do not think you would be aware basically it is happening.

Always take a moment to set up a feather board or what ever to keep your hands well away from the blade. It only has to happen once.

Todays saws are much more powerful than the nine inch beaver/rockwell saw with the 3/4 horsepower delco motor I started out with those many years ago. Or if a person is accident prone just stay away from woodworking equipment period.

Barry Wilson
04-23-2010, 12:29 AM
I'm going to through in one more thing that is sometimes mentioned in books, but not in this thread - yet. A characteristic of a table saw - and also a band saw, jointer, and sometimes a router or shaper - is that you are actively pushing your workpiece - often with your bare hands - towards that sharp, unforgiving cutter. When planning your cuts, always think about what might happen - on that rare occasion - when that work piece slips, catches, or otherwise suddenly moves out of the way. Where will your hands go now? How might you use pushers, clamps, a sled, or other fixturing to hold that workpiece safely?

If you find you are really pushing usually something is wrong. It may not seem so but it probably is. For example you may have a dull blade or cutters or some form of misalignment. This type of thing results in too much force application to feed the material. Or stated another way more than you should be using. Some of todays equipment is very powerful and will not forgive much. In fact I belive there was an old saying that dull blades cut more people than sharp ones do by a wide margin.

Chip Lindley
04-23-2010, 1:08 AM
Comments above deal with the tablesaw more than any other tool. Perhaps rightly so. My best advice is, "If it feels awkward or wrong, DON'T DO IT!" Experience in the shop gives one a 6th Sense. Resist the temptation to perform some operation without thoroughly planning beforehand. I found it mesmerizing, to watch of a cut-off piece jittering around on the saw table just beyond the blade! The "call of the Sirens" would have me reach to pick it off the surface. Use a pushstick if you must remove it.

There are very few comments on drill press safety! Nasty injuries can result from holding a piece of metal by hand for drilling with a large bit. Clamp the piece firmly, or at the least, provide a backstop to prevent it from spinning if the bit catches.

Never wear loose clothing in the shop. Floppy long sleeves, neckties, and long dangling necklaces or loose bracelets are a few items that are an accident waiting to happen. Wearing any finger rings was forbidden in the Army when I went through Combat Engineer training. Ring accidents are very nasty. Many electricians do not wear rings for obvious reasons; especially linemen working with high voltages wearing rubber gloves.

Lee Ludden
04-23-2010, 1:16 AM
This (http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x7d2vt_kelly-mehler-table-saw_lifestyle) Kelly Mehler video was very good for table saw safety.

Jeff Bratt
04-23-2010, 1:54 AM
If you find you are really pushing usually something is wrong. It may not seem so but it probably is. For example you may have a dull blade or cutters or some form of misalignment. This type of thing results in too much force application to feed the material. Or stated another way more than you should be using. Some of todays equipment is very powerful and will not forgive much. In fact I belive there was an old saying that dull blades cut more people than sharp ones do by a wide margin.

I'm not talking pushing too hard - that is a symptom of the dull blades you are talking about - just the basic configuration of pushing a workpiece towards a blade with your hands... One of the ways kickback can cause serious injury is when your hand goes right into the tablesaw blade after the workpiece "disappears".