Norton Waterstone Question

[Chas Fuggetta]

Howdy gang,

My Norton waterstone set came yesterday so I gave them a trial run. The 220, 1k and 4k stones worked fast and smoothly. No issues at all. When I got to the 8k stone I saw a problem. The stone is not flat from side to side. I gave the flattening stone a go and it did not alleviate the issue.

I took the stone to work today to check the flatness. I put it up on leveling blocks and checked it with a micro-hite. Yup, flatness is out from side to side by .0018". There appears to be two ridges along the length of the stone that are higher than the surrounding media. lMy hunch is that the ridges are harder than the surrounding media so the flattening stone won't work. Is that possible?

Finally, should I give Nortan a call and see if I can return the 4k/8k stone?

[Jim Koepke]

It might help to give them a call.

Did you check the flatness of your flattening stone?

I use abrasive sheets on a piece of tile. When the 8000 is flat, it is difficult to flatten the back of a blade because of the suction formed between the stone and the blade.

jim

[Andrew Gibson]

Keep us posted on what you find out. I am considering picking up that set of stones soon. I would also be interested in hearing your opinion on their performance.

[Chas Fuggetta]

Jim, that's called 'ringing' due to two very flat surfaces mating very well together. I checked the flattening stone as well and it's within .0004". Well within range of error due to the inspection tip I used and the coarse surface of the stone. I put the iron back on the 4k grit and then to some 2k sandpaper on a granite surface. I was surprised at how well the granite surface matched the stone surface. When I started honing on it, it covered the entire surface within a couple strokes.

Andrew, I LOVE the Norton waterstones. They cut quickly and with much less mess than sandpaper/granite. If the 8k stone was as flat/easy to flatten as the other 3 stones I'd give it a 9 out of 10. I must admit part of my satisfaction with them is due to the water. It keeps the metal dust/smell out of the air. I have grown to despise that smell. :rolleyes:

I'll try calling them tomorrow, but may have to wait until Monday. I sincerely hope they can help resolve this issue.

[Tony Shea]

Why don't you put the 8k stone on the granite surface you have with some sandpaper glued to it like you did for your iron. That or find a peice of glass (at least 1/4" thick) and stick sandpaper to that to flatten it. I've heard some poor reveiws of the Norton Flattening stone and that most get better results with sandpaper glued to a flat surface. But I have no experience with any of the stones so this is all based on what I seen and heard.

[Chas Fuggetta]

Why don't you put the 8k stone on the granite surface you have with some sandpaper glued to it like you did for your iron. That or find a peice of glass (at least 1/4" thick) and stick sandpaper to that to flatten it. I've heard some poor reveiws of the Norton Flattening stone and that most get better results with sandpaper glued to a flat surface. But I have no experience with any of the stones so this is all based on what I seen and heard.

I thought about that too. I'll give it a shot later. Thanks!

[Tim McEneany]

I picked up a Norton 1k/8k stone recently and it was out of flat on both sides straight out of the packaging. I used 220 grit sandpaper on a granite stone and quickly got both sides flat. Alternatively, I've seen people use a DMT course diamond stone to flatten their waterstones. I kind of like this because it's less time to setup and there's no wasting sandpaper.

[Andrew Gibson]

Here is a question, When flattening a water stone is it important to soak it prior to flattening? I assume you would want to have soaked it the same as you would for sharpening...?

[Tony Shea]

I would think that it should be wet as if you're sharpening on it as the you would want to create slurry as opposed to dust which could clog things up as well as might create a spot that would be out of flat. I would think you'd want the slurry to fall off the sides instead of dust getting trapped between paper and stone. This is just of the top of my head, I have no experience with water stones but need to flatten one that was given to me. Not sure how this person even used the stone I have, it's extremely dished out on both sides. That's why he gave it to me as he thought it was a lost cause. I took it knowing it could be flattened and has a ton of life left. My problem is there is no identifying marks on it therefore have no idea what grit it is. Is there any way to id a waterstone without markings?

[Jim Koepke]

When flattening a water stone is it important to soak it prior to flattening?

I have tried it where the stone was pretty much dry, only residual water from the previous day and also wet.

When using sandpaper with a dry stone, you may get airborne stone particles. Use a mask. When working a wet stone, the paper loaded up in about two strokes.

When working against another stone, wet seems to be the way to go.


Is there any way to id a waterstone without markings?

Comparison of the surface left on a blade with surface left by other known stones is the only way that comes to mind.

jim

[Nelson Howe]

I recently tried to flatten my water stones dry on sand paper, and discovered that I was getting corns like you get rubbing out a finish with non-stearated paper. The corns cut grooves into my water stones, which then had to be removed. I have since ordered a dmt diamond stone. I didn't have corns with the paper wet, but I grew tired of pulling out my glass and burning through sand paper.

Nelson

[Jeff Hamilton Jr.]

I use the Norton watersones, with a DMT 8" x-coarse for flattening. Never had any problems. It's quick, fairly clean and I get a dead flat surface on the stones.

Great system and not nearly as much as the Shaptons. I can't imagine my chisels and irons sharper that they are now.

[Tri Hoang]

I strongly recommend a convenience way to flatten your stone. Sand paper isn't very convenience. Perhaps a x-coarse diamond plate. If it's not convenience, you may push it off too long. You don't want to put a good blade on a dished stone...not a good way to ruin your day.

[Jim Koepke]

You don't want to put a good blade on a dished stone...not a good way to ruin your day.

Heck, I thought using a dished stone was my excuse for using a cambered blade.:p

jim

[Tony Shea]

I just recently got done flattening the stone that was given to me that was severely dished. The stone was very dry with no residual water at all. I took the advise and tried flattening it dry and it's a good thing I did. I started out with 100 grit paper and boy did it work great. Lots of stone powder buildup but just shaking the paper off got rid of it all. I continued until the stone was flat. I switched over to 320 wetordry paper and actually glued it to the glass this time to ensure flatness. This also worked pretty well but the paper did load up fairly quickly and was harder to clear being that the paper wasn't loose therefore couldn't be shaken off. But eventually this step worked great and now my stone is just like new, actually probably flatter.

My advise would be to let the stone dry completely with zero dampness as this will give you little bugers like you get in sanding a finish. If it is just dry dust it should just wipe or blow off. Mind you I don't beleive my stone is a Norton therefore not quite as hard but similar enough that this method should work.

Thanks Jim for pointing this method out otherwise I think I would have a mess. BTW, work your stone outside if you can as this dust is really nasty.

[Jim Koepke]

Thanks Jim for pointing this method out otherwise I think I would have a mess. BTW, work your stone outside if you can as this dust is really nasty.

You are welcome. The nasty dust is my reason to mention a dust mask.

I was also thinking that the dust could be made into a slurry to be used when sharpening odd shaped blades. Haven't done it yet.

jim