Grizzly ROCKS!!!

[Harold Burrell]

I've been having a bit of an issue with my G0661 tablesaw. I would bind and bog-down to the point where I could literally stop the blade while ripping 2x4's.

I checked the alignment of the fence. That was OK, but I flared it out a bit, to be sure.

I changed the blade. That helped a little.

I double checked the riving knife and nudged it a tad to the right.

All of the above helped...some. But I wasn't satisfied.

I called Grizzly.

The tech guy was very helpful. First, he had me check my 220 wiring job. All was well. He asked me to describe to him, again, the issue. I told him that my "tweakings" had indeed improved the situation some and that the rest was probably me.

He said that he wasn't satisfied...and that Grizzly would send me a new motor. Free.

I just finished installing it. It runs like a dream.

Thank you Papa Grizz (and all you little Grizzes).

Now...if you all will excuse me...I need to go spend some quality time with my saw...

[Victor Robinson]

Wow, now that is SERVICE!

Many companies would probably just say, "yep it's probably you, Harold." It's nice to hear that you got a nice person on the phone who really wanted to solve your issues and have your saw working perfectly.

[Rich Noterman]

Nice to here Grizzly took care of you...............................My next Table saw will be a grizzly

[Matthias Imhof]

Harold,

Could you describe the problem a little bit more? I have the same saw, and it won't start if the wood piece is just touching the blade. It also bogs down when ripping, and I did manage twice to get it to a full stop with a 2x4.

Matthias

[Charley Foley]

That is good service, excellent in fact. But. Shouldn't have needed the motor in the first place...

[Ken Fitzgerald]

When you pay less for a given product, it's only reasonable to expect that quality control and product quality won't be as consistant either. If all things remained the same, why would any manufacturer charge a different price? There wouldn't be any competition between manufacturers....all w/w tools would be more expensive and a lot of us hobbiests would not be able to have w/w as we know it as a hobby.

So....when you pay less.....it's nice to know that the company will stand behind their product.

[fRED mCnEILL]

A number of years ago my neighbor bought a brand new Powermatic Cabinet Saw. It would'nt work properly out of the box so they sent out a new motor.

But you are right. Everything SHOULD work right the first time.
Incidently, it took quite a long time to get his saw working properly.

[Jeff Willard]

I have the same saw, and it won't start if the wood piece is just touching the blade.


:eek::eek::eek:
Why would one attempt this?

[Terry Hatfield]

In a perfect world....:rolleyes:

Even Mercedes, BMW, Lexus and Jaguar need warranty every once in a while and some of the highest initial quality rating are for Hyundai. :eek: It's not necessarily how much you pay but rather what you got for the money.

To me it's not an issue that the motor needed to be replaced but rather the way in which they handled it. I have a shop full of Grizzly tools and I've never once felt like I got less than a great tool. I don't long for a Powermatic or SawStop or Delta or Hammer or Laguna or whatever when I look at my stuff and I don't feel like I got less just because I paid less. I got exactly what I wanted. Only had 1 or 2 issues with anything I ever bought from Grizzly and those were solved quickly and with great care. I don't know how much more one can ask.

[Paul Snowden]

Thanks to so many comments like this here I always consider Grizzly when looking at new tools.

[Harold Burrell]

Harold,

Could you describe the problem a little bit more? I have the same saw, and it won't start if the wood piece is just touching the blade. It also bogs down when ripping, and I did manage twice to get it to a full stop with a 2x4.

Matthias

It sounds exactly like my issue (minus the "starting the saw with the wood piece touching the blade" part. Never tried that. :eek:)

You might want to call them. Also check your fence alignment, centering of your riving knife and whether or not you are using a good sharp ripping blade.

Also...when the blade stops, is the belt squealing? Or does the motor actually stop?

I'm no electrician, but I'm wondering if you are getting enough juice to it as well. Are you wired for 220?

[Harold Burrell]

When you pay less for a given product, it's only reasonable to expect that quality control and product quality won't be as consistant either. If all things remained the same, why would any manufacturer charge a different price? There wouldn't be any competition between manufacturers....all w/w tools would be more expensive and a lot of us hobbiests would not be able to have w/w as we know it as a hobby.

So....when you pay less.....it's nice to know that the company will stand behind their product.

I could not agree more.

Grizzly products may not be "top of the line" (though, I am VERY pleased with the quality of their stuff), but their service certainly is. Which is why I have (and will continue) to buy from them with absolute confidence.

[Neil Brooks]

I've certainly been in a version of THIS "argument" before :D

If I ran the company (and I know full well that the guy who does ... participates on this forum), then ....

I'd ensure that I have a thorough understanding of the parts of our process (be they design, engineering, manufacturing, manuals, or ... what) that lead to our initial defect levels being higher than zero.

Then, I'd have my smart people show me how much it would cost to tweak EACH of those elements on an ever-increasing path TOWARD zero defects.

Mind you, I am NOT suggesting all-or-nothing, here. It's not "do nothing and accept our current defect rate" or "spend a billion, have every machine perfect, and price ourselves out of the market".

It's a curve (or a line).

I would make sure that my marketing team quantified any impact -- to "likely to purchase a Grizzly product again," "How likely are you to recommend a Grizzly product to a friend," and "Lifetime Value (LTV)" of my customers -- brought about by initial quality issues that required Customer Service intervention.

I would look at the cost to acquire new customers -- very steep, traditionally, particularly in e-commerce., and compare that to the profitability of selling MORE tools to my EXISTING customer bse (very cheap, traditionally).

That would be premised on a pretty accurate picture of the Lifetime Value (LTV) of our current customer base -- something that I would HOPE we paid attention to.

I would look at a customer's propensity to re-purchase IF THEY HAD an initial defect that required a Customer Service intervention.

I would compare THAT rate -- and the amount spent, over the next 12-18 months -- with people who did NOT have a defect that required a Customer Service intervention.

Then I would make a SMART decision about how much more money I should be willing to spend to improve my quality.

It isn't automatic that every incremental dollar would have to be passed along to the consumer.

It's entirely possible that within -- say -- a year -- these business changes would INCREASE my gross profit dollars, despite an initial increase in Cost of Goods Sold, and an initial shaving of margin points.

I'm absolutely not a Grizzly basher, but ... sadly ... at this point ... neither am I a Grizzly promoter.

Two for two inoperable on arrival ... didn't thrill me.

When I think about the $$$ they could lose ... from me, alone ... if I've been scared off the brand, forever, and DO NOT recommend it to friends ... I have to wonder just how expensive some of the necessary tweaks would really HAVE TO BE to NOT make them worth the company investing in them.

The Mercedes, the Lexus, and the BMW may NOT be PERFECT in year one, but ... one surely hopes their defect rate is FAR, FAR lower than many lower priced brands.

I believe I'm on my fourth car that has required NOTHING, apart from scheduled maintenance.

Nothing.

And I don't drive luxury cars. I just drive brands known for quality AND low price -- evidence that one does NOT preclude the other.

Just one man's perspective.

Shiraz?: former retail VP, here, and upper management guy from an e-commerce company -- now semi-retired. If you're ever bored enough to want to have this conversation, in greater depth, I'd be most interested and most willing.

The aim would be mutual benefit. I do NOT bash your company. Problems like I see, with Grizzly, have been mine to SOLVE on countless occasions :rolleyes: :)

[Harold Burrell]

I've certainly been in a version of THIS "argument" before :D

If I ran the company (and I know full well that the guy who does ... participates on this forum), then ....

I'd ensure that I have a thorough understanding of the parts of our process (be they design, engineering, manufacturing, manuals, or ... what) that lead to our initial defect levels being higher than zero.

Then, I'd have my smart people show me how much it would cost to tweak EACH of those elements on an ever-increasing path TOWARD zero defects.

Mind you, I am NOT suggesting all-or-nothing, here. It's not "do nothing and accept our current defect rate" or "spend a billion, have every machine perfect, and price ourselves out of the market".

It's a curve (or a line).

I would make sure that my marketing team quantified any impact -- to "likely to purchase a Grizzly product again," "How likely are you to recommend a Grizzly product to a friend," and "Lifetime Value (LTV)" of my customers -- brought about by initial quality issues that required Customer Service intervention.

I would look at the cost to acquire new customers -- very steep, traditionally, particularly in e-commerce., and compare that to the profitability of selling MORE tools to my EXISTING customer bse (very cheap, traditionally).

That would be premised on a pretty accurate picture of the Lifetime Value (LTV) of our current customer base -- something that I would HOPE we paid attention to.

I would look at a customer's propensity to re-purchase IF THEY HAD an initial defect that required a Customer Service intervention.

I would compare THAT rate -- and the amount spent, over the next 12-18 months -- with people who did NOT have a defect that required a Customer Service intervention.

Then I would make a SMART decision about how much more money I should be willing to spend to improve my quality.

It isn't automatic that every incremental dollar would have to be passed along to the consumer.

It's entirely possible that within -- say -- a year -- these business changes would INCREASE my gross profit dollars, despite an initial increase in Cost of Goods Sold, and an initial shaving of margin points.

I'm absolutely not a Grizzly basher, but ... sadly ... at this point ... neither am I a Grizzly promoter.

Two for two inoperable on arrival ... didn't thrill me.

When I think about the $$$ they could lose ... from me, alone ... if I've been scared off the brand, forever, and DO NOT recommend it to friends ... I have to wonder just how expensive some of the necessary tweaks would really HAVE TO BE to NOT make them worth the company investing in them.

The Mercedes, the Lexus, and the BMW may NOT be PERFECT in year one, but ... one surely hopes their defect rate is FAR, FAR lower than many lower priced brands.

I believe I'm on my fourth car that has required NOTHING, apart from scheduled maintenance.

Nothing.

And I don't drive luxury cars. I just drive brands known for quality AND low price -- evidence that one does NOT preclude the other.

Just one man's perspective.

Shiraz?: former retail VP, here, and upper management guy from an e-commerce company -- now semi-retired. If you're ever bored enough to want to have this conversation, in greater depth, I'd be most interested and most willing.

The aim would be mutual benefit. I do NOT bash your company. Problems like I see, with Grizzly, have been mine to SOLVE on countless occasions :rolleyes: :)

OK...like...WOW...

That was WAY over my head. :eek:

[Rod Sheridan]

I've certainly been in a version of THIS "argument" before :D

If I ran the company (and I know full well that the guy who does ... participates on this forum), then ....



Many good points Neil.

I would expect that Grizzly have already analyzed many and perhaps all of those issues.

I have a suspicion that they have optimized their business model for their target customer, and have been very successful at doing so. I also presume that they are constantly modifying their approach, which is a sound business practise.

Their model isn't for me, however it certainly seems to be a good model for their customers. I'd be very interested in hearing whether their customer base would expand, or shrink with a higher cost, higher service approach.

Regards, Rod.

[Cody Colston]

Grizzly markets quality tools at an affordable price with top-notch customer service...so what's not to like?

[Rod Sheridan]

Grizzly markets quality tools at an affordable price with top-notch customer service...so what's not to like?

Cody, your definition of top-notch service and my definition don't match.

My definition involves the company sending a field engineer to my location, making it correct, and the cost incorporated in the initial purchase.

It's nothing to do with the machinery, just the model of service I like for something that I can't lift and take to the service depot.

Regards, Rod.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Rod,

There a FEW companies who provide onsite field service. Even those that do, don't do it for every problem.

[Rod Sheridan]

Ken, I agree, however I do like having the option of someone coming to my house as opposed to me doing the work, or shipping it back when it's under warranty.

My major equipment purchases were General or Hammer, and they do provide field services for warranty, or years later at whatever their field service rates happen to be.

I'm willing to pay more for that level of service for large machines, for something I could carry and take to a service center, I wouldn't be willing to pay for home service.

Regards, Rod.

[Eric Gustafson]

Two for two inoperable on arrival ... didn't thrill me.



I bought a Grizzly bandsaw and TS. Both were perfect. Two for two, but I am making a play on words. I have seen pictures of the Grizzly warehouses. These guys sell a LOT of tools. Of course, you hear most often about the failures and not the successes. So, two for two, no manner how you look at it, is meaningless statisically.

[Neil Brooks]

I bought a Grizzly bandsaw and TS. Both were perfect. Two for two, but I am making a play on words. I have seen pictures of the Grizzly warehouses. These guys sell a LOT of tools. Of course, you hear most often about the failures and not the successes. So, two for two, no manner how you look at it, is meaningless statisically.

I can tell you *one context* in which the statistic has *huge* meaning :D

But ... as you and I have agreed before ... of course, you're right. That's why I never bash Grizzly.

Fact is, once they got them working ... I flat love them :)

[Van Huskey]

Ken, I agree, however I do like having the option of someone coming to my house as opposed to me doing the work, or shipping it back when it's under warranty.

My major equipment purchases were General or Hammer, and they do provide field services for warranty, or years later at whatever their field service rates happen to be.

I'm willing to pay more for that level of service for large machines, for something I could carry and take to a service center, I wouldn't be willing to pay for home service.

Regards, Rod.

I am with you Rod but there seems to be more resistence to this train of thought here.

Grizzly makes fine tools for the price, has excellent CS although it is at arms length and a rather short warranty period, that is fine as long as you know and understand these things when you ake your choice. For many people this is an excellent choice but for some it makes more sense to spend more money where it gives them peace of mind. In this case I think Grizzly does indeed "rock" particularly at the price point but at a different price point I would have expected and in the past got different action, then again a motor is one of the easier fixes.